13:58:53 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/08/04-ldp-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/08/04-ldp-irc ←
13:58:55 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
13:58:57 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be LDP
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be LDP ←
13:58:57 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes ←
13:58:58 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference
13:58:58 <trackbot> Date: 04 August 2014
13:59:26 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started ←
13:59:34 <Zakim> +Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: +Arnaud ←
13:59:57 <Arnaud> ok
Arnaud Le Hors: ok ←
14:02:12 <Zakim> +Matt
Zakim IRC Bot: +Matt ←
14:02:18 <deiu> Zakim, +Matt is me
Andrei Sambra: Zakim, +Matt is me ←
14:02:18 <Zakim> sorry, deiu, I do not recognize a party named '+Matt'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, deiu, I do not recognize a party named '+Matt' ←
14:02:23 <deiu> Zakim, Matt is me
Andrei Sambra: Zakim, Matt is me ←
14:02:23 <Zakim> +deiu; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +deiu; got it ←
14:02:26 <Zakim> +JohnArwe
Zakim IRC Bot: +JohnArwe ←
14:02:40 <deiu> Zakim, mute me please
Andrei Sambra: Zakim, mute me please ←
14:02:40 <Zakim> deiu should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: deiu should now be muted ←
14:03:30 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
14:03:31 <Zakim> +Alexandre
Zakim IRC Bot: +Alexandre ←
14:03:41 <bblfish> hi
Henry Story: hi ←
14:03:43 <bblfish> connected
Henry Story: connected ←
14:03:59 <Zakim> +Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro ←
14:04:12 <deiu> Skype does VOIP
Andrei Sambra: Skype does VOIP ←
14:04:13 <bblfish> zakim who is here?
Henry Story: zakim who is here? ←
14:04:28 <bblfish> Zakim, who is here?
Henry Story: Zakim, who is here? ←
14:04:28 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, deiu (muted), JohnArwe, [IPcaller], Alexandre, Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Arnaud, deiu (muted), JohnArwe, [IPcaller], Alexandre, Sandro ←
14:04:30 <Zakim> On IRC I see JohnArwe, Zakim, RRSAgent, deiu, betehess, TallTed, bblfish, jmvanel, Arnaud, sandro, Yves, ericP, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see JohnArwe, Zakim, RRSAgent, deiu, betehess, TallTed, bblfish, jmvanel, Arnaud, sandro, Yves, ericP, trackbot ←
14:04:36 <Arnaud> zakim, IPcaller is bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: zakim, IPcaller is bblfish ←
14:04:36 <Zakim> +bblfish; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bblfish; got it ←
14:04:37 <bblfish> mhh
Henry Story: mhh ←
14:04:43 <bblfish> weird
Henry Story: weird ←
14:04:48 <bblfish> never did that before.
Henry Story: never did that before. ←
14:06:56 <JohnArwe> regrets: steve speicher, sergio
14:07:43 <Arnaud> scribe: bblfish
(Scribe set to Henry Story)
<bblfish> chair: Arnaud
<bblfish> agenda: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2014.08.04
14:07:35 <bblfish> Topic: Minutes of Last meeting
14:07:31 <Arnaud> http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-07-28
Arnaud Le Hors: http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-07-28 ←
14:07:44 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: +OpenLink_Software ←
14:07:49 <TallTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
14:07:49 <Zakim> +TallTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +TallTed; got it ←
14:07:53 <deiu> scribenickL bblfish
14:08:07 <deiu> s/scribenickL bblfish/scribenick: bblfish
14:08:09 <betehess> looks fine to me
Alexandre Bertails: looks fine to me ←
14:08:27 <bblfish> resolved: Approved minutes of last week http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-07-28
RESOLVED: Approved minutes of last week http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-07-28 ←
14:08:38 <bblfish> next meeting next week
next meeting next week ←
14:08:50 <bblfish> no objections.... passed
no objections.... passed ←
14:08:57 <bblfish> Topic: Open Actions
14:10:06 <bblfish> action-146?
14:10:06 <trackbot> action-146 -- John Arwe to Clarify the spec, saying that our intent is that ldp paging support "signal" requires the presence of the 'pagsize' parameter, and to reply on the public comments list to see if that addresses the concern -- due 2014-08-04 -- OPEN
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-146 -- John Arwe to Clarify the spec, saying that our intent is that ldp paging support "signal" requires the presence of the 'pagsize' parameter, and to reply on the public comments list to see if that addresses the concern -- due 2014-08-04 -- OPEN ←
14:10:07 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/146
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/146 ←
14:10:53 <bblfish> resolved: close action-146
RESOLVED: close ACTION-146 ←
14:10:53 <trackbot> Closed action-146.
Trackbot IRC Bot: Closed ACTION-146. ←
14:12:07 <bblfish> which action?
which action? ←
14:12:19 <JohnArwe> action-145?
14:12:19 <trackbot> action-145 -- Sandro Hawke to Figure out where json-ld context for ldp goes on w3.org -- due 2014-08-04 -- OPEN
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-145 -- Sandro Hawke to Figure out where json-ld context for ldp goes on w3.org -- due 2014-08-04 -- OPEN ←
14:12:19 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/145
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/145 ←
14:13:01 <bblfish> Arnaud: Two pieces of work: update the primer
Arnaud Le Hors: Two pieces of work: update the primer ←
14:13:10 <bblfish> and the other was to ?
and the other was to ? ←
14:13:52 <JohnArwe> other = serve the json-ld context when a client GETs the LDP nsuri with accept json-ld
John Arwe: other = serve the json-ld context when a client GETs the LDP nsuri with accept json-ld ←
14:13:53 <bblfish> ... send an e-mail to the list with a link to the archive discussion, and a link to the context...
... send an e-mail to the list with a link to the archive discussion, and a link to the context... ←
14:14:07 <JohnArwe> ericp, you tuned in?
John Arwe: ericp, you tuned in? ←
14:14:45 <bblfish> Topic: LDP Paging
14:15:03 <bblfish> Arnaud: John what is the status of the spec? What is stopping us from the last call?
Arnaud Le Hors: John what is the status of the spec? What is stopping us from the last call? ←
14:15:20 <bblfish> JohnArwe: three things on the agenda
John Arwe: three things on the agenda ←
14:15:55 <deiu> In the channel topic
Andrei Sambra: In the channel topic ←
14:16:00 <Arnaud> https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2014.08.04
Arnaud Le Hors: https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2014.08.04 ←
14:16:42 <bblfish> thanks
thanks ←
14:17:19 <JohnArwe> proposal from the email: 5.1.5 LDP Paging clients SHOULD NOT treat a page sequence as equivalent to
John Arwe: proposal from the email: 5.1.5 LDP Paging clients SHOULD NOT treat a page sequence as equivalent to ←
14:17:19 <JohnArwe> > the paged resource when the _paged resource changed_ [link to 6.2.8]
John Arwe: > the paged resource when the _paged resource changed_ [link to 6.2.8] ←
14:17:19 <JohnArwe> > _during retrieval of the page sequence_ [link to 6.2.7].
John Arwe: > _during retrieval of the page sequence_ [link to 6.2.7]. ←
14:17:45 <bblfish> vote
vote ←
14:17:49 <bblfish> Resolved: Proposal accepted
RESOLVED: Proposal accepted ←
14:18:09 <bblfish> proposal to add Should on 410 for abandoning page sequences
proposal to add Should on 410 for abandoning page sequences ←
14:18:16 <Arnaud> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2014Jul/0153.html
Arnaud Le Hors: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2014Jul/0153.html ←
14:18:33 <TallTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
14:18:37 <JohnArwe> proposal was: [[LDP Paging servers SHOULD indicate that they have abandoned a
John Arwe: proposal was: [[LDP Paging servers SHOULD indicate that they have abandoned a ←
14:18:37 <JohnArwe> > > > sequence by responding with at 410-Gone to any of the in-sequence
John Arwe: > > > sequence by responding with at 410-Gone to any of the in-sequence ←
14:18:37 <JohnArwe> > > > pages with appropriate paging link response headers, rel='first']]
John Arwe: > > > pages with appropriate paging link response headers, rel='first']] ←
14:19:02 <bblfish> makes sense
makes sense ←
14:19:33 <bblfish> Sandro seems to have a cold
Sandro seems to have a cold ←
14:19:50 <bblfish> sandro is ok with the proposal
sandro is ok with the proposal ←
14:19:55 <bblfish> Resolved: Proposal approved
RESOLVED: Proposal approved ←
14:20:18 <bblfish> proposal: best practices authors - willing to adopt paging appendix?
PROPOSED: best practices authors - willing to adopt paging appendix? ←
14:21:33 <bblfish> sandro: people will probably not read the best practices, and criticise anyway
Sandro Hawke: people will probably not read the best practices, and criticise anyway ←
14:21:45 <JohnArwe> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/raw-file/default/ldp-paging.html#ldpr-impl
John Arwe: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/raw-file/default/ldp-paging.html#ldpr-impl ←
14:21:47 <bblfish> bblfish: I suppose you can always point them to BP
Henry Story: I suppose you can always point them to BP ←
14:22:30 <bblfish> One argument was that it is always easier to update a BP than it is to update a normative spec
One argument was that it is always easier to update a BP than it is to update a normative spec ←
14:24:14 <bblfish> search for "consideration" in the spec . last line before 6.2
search for "consideration" in the spec . last line before 6.2 ←
14:24:45 <bblfish> TallTed: has a proposal
Ted Thibodeau: has a proposal ←
14:25:04 <bblfish> ( or was that someone else ? )
( or was that someone else ? ) ←
14:26:39 <bblfish> TallTed: can you write your proposal down?
Ted Thibodeau: can you write your proposal down? ←
14:27:08 <JohnArwe> tallted: suggest changing current ref @ end of 6.2 to include 1st paragraph from current appendix A, then move the rest into BP&G and change the existing link in 6.2
Ted Thibodeau: suggest changing current ref @ end of 6.2 to include 1st paragraph from current appendix A, then move the rest into BP&G and change the existing link in 6.2 [ Scribe Assist by John Arwe ] ←
14:27:14 <bblfish> Arnaud: it seems we have 2 proposals. Either we leave things as they are. Or we move the apendix to the BP doc
Arnaud Le Hors: it seems we have 2 proposals. Either we leave things as they are. Or we move the apendix to the BP doc ←
14:30:02 <bblfish> Arnaud: we keep it in the spec, no changes
Arnaud Le Hors: we keep it in the spec, no changes ←
14:30:04 <TallTed> +1 status quo
Ted Thibodeau: +1 status quo ←
14:30:27 <bblfish> Resolved: do nothing
RESOLVED: do nothing ←
14:31:47 <bblfish> discussion on last call
discussion on last call ←
14:33:07 <sandro> PROPOSED: Publish ldp-paging as Last Call WD at earliest convenience, assuming changed agreed upon in today's meeting, and everyone getting 24 hrs (business day) to review said changes.
PROPOSED: Publish ldp-paging as Last Call WD at earliest convenience, assuming changed agreed upon in today's meeting, and everyone getting 24 hrs (business day) to review said changes. ←
14:33:15 <bblfish> q+
q+ ←
14:33:24 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
14:34:42 <sandro> +1
Sandro Hawke: +1 ←
14:34:54 <JohnArwe> +1
14:34:55 <deiu> +1
Andrei Sambra: +1 ←
14:34:58 <TallTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
14:35:07 <betehess> +0
Alexandre Bertails: +0 ←
14:35:08 <bblfish> well just wanted to know if I could implement it before we push it to last call
well just wanted to know if I could implement it before we push it to last call ←
14:35:36 <Arnaud> RESOLVED: Publish ldp-paging as Last Call WD at earliest convenience, assuming changed agreed upon in today's meeting, and everyone getting 24 hrs (business day) to review said changes.
RESOLVED: Publish ldp-paging as Last Call WD at earliest convenience, assuming changed agreed upon in today's meeting, and everyone getting 24 hrs (business day) to review said changes. ←
14:35:57 <bblfish> Topic: LD-Patch
14:36:00 <deiu> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/raw-file/ldpatch/ldpatch.html
Andrei Sambra: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/raw-file/ldpatch/ldpatch.html ←
14:37:56 <bblfish> Arnaud: should we continue ldpatch proposal or move back to SPARQL Update
Arnaud Le Hors: should we continue ldpatch proposal or move back to SPARQL Update ←
14:38:40 <bblfish> ... we should have a broad discussion here
... we should have a broad discussion here ←
14:38:44 <Zakim> +EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: +EricP ←
14:39:10 <bblfish> sandro: SPARQL update is not easy either, and there is the question of blank nodes
Sandro Hawke: SPARQL update is not easy either, and there is the question of blank nodes ←
14:40:13 <bblfish> Three patches: LDPatch, SPARQL Update, and SPARQL Update with bnodes re-ification
Three patches: LDPatch, SPARQL Update, and SPARQL Update with bnodes genid'd ←
14:40:27 <betehess> are we seriously back to where we were 2 years ago?
Alexandre Bertails: are we seriously back to where we were 2 years ago? ←
14:41:50 <sandro> s/re-ification/genid'd/
14:41:57 <bblfish> Arnaud: Straw poll
Arnaud Le Hors: Straw poll ←
14:42:24 <Arnaud> strawpoll: 1) LDPatch, 2) SPARQL Update, or 3) SPARQL Update with bnodes genid'd
STRAWPOLL: 1) LDPatch, 2) SPARQL Update, or 3) SPARQL Update with bnodes genid'd ←
14:42:28 <deiu> a), b), c)?
Andrei Sambra: a), b), c)? ←
14:42:44 <sandro> +0 -0 +1
Sandro Hawke: +0 -0 +1 ←
14:42:48 <betehess> what is genid?
Alexandre Bertails: what is genid? ←
14:42:57 <betehess> I have no idea what this is
Alexandre Bertails: I have no idea what this is ←
14:43:02 <JohnArwe> genid ?= skolemization
John Arwe: genid ?= skolemization ←
14:43:05 <bblfish> yes
yes ←
14:43:09 <sandro> yes, of course
Sandro Hawke: yes, of course ←
14:43:12 <betehess> would prefer to read skolemization then
Alexandre Bertails: would prefer to read skolemization then ←
14:43:24 <bblfish> I'd rather we have a) b) c) then we can give reasons
I'd rather we have a) b) c) then we can give reasons ←
14:43:35 <bblfish> or 1) 2) 3)
or 1) 2) 3) ←
14:44:52 <betehess> +1 -1 (can't support it completely) -1 (I have scenarios where I cannot support stable bnodes)
Alexandre Bertails: +1 -1 (can't support it completely) -1 (I have scenarios where I cannot support stable bnodes) ←
14:45:29 <bblfish> 1) LDPatch: 0 it requires one to need write a new parser 2) +0.7 is what I impleemnted 2 years ago with betehess and one should work on a subset is easier 3) +.5 it is the cleverest but does require one more request to the server for bnode
1) LDPatch: 0 it requires one to need write a new parser 2) +0.7 is what I impleemnted 2 years ago with betehess and one should work on a subset is easier 3) +.5 it is the cleverest but does require one more request to the server for bnode ←
14:45:30 <JohnArwe> -0.5, +0, +0.5
14:45:54 <TallTed> -0.5, +0.25, +0.5
Ted Thibodeau: -0.5, +0.25, +0.5 ←
14:46:00 <betehess> please read my emails for more detailed explanations for my -1
Alexandre Bertails: please read my emails for more detailed explanations for my -1 ←
14:46:13 <ericP> 0, 1, .3
Eric Prud'hommeaux: 0, 1, .3 ←
14:46:20 <deiu> +1 -0.5 -0.5
Andrei Sambra: +1 -0.5 -0.5 ←
14:46:55 <JohnArwe> betehess do you have urls for your emails? even if people don't have time now to consume them if new, for the minutes.
John Arwe: betehess do you have urls for your emails? even if people don't have time now to consume them if new, for the minutes. ←
14:47:21 <betehess> JohnArwe, not directly under my hand
Alexandre Bertails: JohnArwe, not directly under my hand ←
14:48:09 <betehess> well, if people are not motivated, not sure it's really a good thing to pursue...
Alexandre Bertails: well, if people are not motivated, not sure it's really a good thing to pursue... ←
14:48:33 <betehess> q+
Alexandre Bertails: q+ ←
14:48:44 <JohnArwe> IIRC from emails the -1s were based on implementation restrictions in his impln
John Arwe: IIRC from emails the -1s were based on implementation restrictions in his impln ←
14:48:46 <Arnaud> ack betehess
Arnaud Le Hors: ack betehess ←
14:51:36 <JohnArwe> 1: how much of sparql upd would a implr have to understand?
John Arwe: 1: how much of sparql upd would a implr have to understand? ←
14:51:50 <JohnArwe> 2: are intermediate result sets required?
John Arwe: 2: are intermediate result sets required? ←
14:52:13 <JohnArwe> those seem to be the underlying points betehess is poking at
John Arwe: those seem to be the underlying points betehess is poking at ←
14:58:08 <betehess> https://twitter.com/bertails/status/493784135014834176
(No events recorded for 5 minutes)
Alexandre Bertails: https://twitter.com/bertails/status/493784135014834176 ←
15:01:35 <bblfish> q+
q+ ←
15:01:45 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
15:02:08 <JohnArwe> For anyone who wants to see updates from today's resolutions, they're live in the editor's draft. I have to leave now.
John Arwe: For anyone who wants to see updates from today's resolutions, they're live in the editor's draft. I have to leave now. ←
15:02:12 <Zakim> -JohnArwe
Zakim IRC Bot: -JohnArwe ←
15:02:45 <betehess> I'd like to hear what we do next
Alexandre Bertails: I'd like to hear what we do next ←
15:03:07 <betehess> thanks, /me is leaving now
Alexandre Bertails: thanks, /me is leaving now ←
15:03:09 <deiu> I would like to see a resolution so I can move on
Andrei Sambra: I would like to see a resolution so I can move on ←
15:03:12 <Zakim> -Alexandre
Zakim IRC Bot: -Alexandre ←
15:14:23 <Zakim> -Sandro
(No events recorded for 11 minutes)
Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro ←
15:39:16 <deiu> btw, LD-Patch is currently implemented in python: https://github.com/pchampin/rdfpatch
(No events recorded for 24 minutes)
Andrei Sambra: btw, LD-Patch is currently implemented in python: https://github.com/pchampin/rdfpatch ←
15:42:08 <bblfish> http://www.scala-js.org/
15:44:33 <bblfish> https://github.com/read-write-web/banana-rdf/commits/rdfstorew
https://github.com/read-write-web/banana-rdf/commits/rdfstorew ←
15:48:13 <deiu> I have to leave too
Andrei Sambra: I have to leave too ←
15:48:16 <deiu> bye bye!
Andrei Sambra: bye bye! ←
15:48:20 <Zakim> -deiu
Zakim IRC Bot: -deiu ←
15:49:01 <Zakim> -bblfish
Zakim IRC Bot: -bblfish ←
15:49:03 <Zakim> -Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: -Arnaud ←
15:49:05 <Zakim> -TallTed
Zakim IRC Bot: -TallTed ←
15:54:05 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, EricP, in SW_LDP()10:00AM
Zakim IRC Bot: disconnecting the lone participant, EricP, in SW_LDP()10:00AM ←
15:54:07 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended ←
15:54:07 <Zakim> Attendees were Arnaud, deiu, JohnArwe, Alexandre, Sandro, bblfish, TallTed, EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were Arnaud, deiu, JohnArwe, Alexandre, Sandro, bblfish, TallTed, EricP ←
<bblfish> Present: Arnaud, deiu, JohnArwe, Alexandre, Sandro, bblfish, TallTed, EricP
Formatted by CommonScribe