Independent User Interface Task Force Teleconference -- 10 Jul 2013

<trackbot> Date: 10 July 2013

<janina> Meeting: IndieUI Task Force Teleconference

preview agenda with items from two minutes

<MichaelC> scribe: Ryladog

Editor's Update

TPAC2013 http://www.w3.org/WAI/IndieUI/wiki/Meetings/TPAC2013

JS: TPAC
... You need visas, means visiting a consulate office and surrendering your Passport for several week. You need to prepare. There is page, a hotel with block of rooms
... Can you help with that the hotel sign up information is not accessible. The hotel looks like a compound

RS; is this a jail?

JS: No , it is where the Chinese take their foreign guests
... In terms of flight I have suggested Hong Kong there is a border between you need another visa for that. There is a ChenChen Airport that you can get to from Japan with out the multiple Visas

Katie: I will share my flight info with Janina so we might go together

Testing Events Discussion

JC: I got 2 of the 3 I said that wanted to finished. It was a bit more complicated. Should have by this weekend

JS: It will be a 7 day

JC: With in 7 days I will be a father by next wednesday. I am working frantically to catch up. I plan to be off of work for about a month

JS; Our plan is that you will ahve that 3rd item checked in

JS: Once we see it we will issue a Call for Consensus before the next call if possible

JC: The call was the last one.

User Context Requirements: next steps http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-indie-ui/2013Jun/0060.html

JS: It couldnt be issues ext week because Shawn Henry is away, because she is the public relations - so it will be the week following that
... There has been some very good conversation Off list that maybe should be put on list. Can we get some of that on the list so others can see it. esting is important and we want to start that early

MC: We talked about test harness that the W#C is under developement that may provid ethe features we need. Self excutable self made tests will be relevena for INdieUI
... They develop self executing web-based scripts
... If we determine that this is possible or not viable with the current technology - if not we will have to d manual testing
... It might be better suited to do manual testing. I know Rich has been doing research on his own

JW: s designed for automated testing to sunhesei automated test and the Infie UI to dospatch event
... I think you could also use the Harness if you register the event and do csomething remote to gererate event san reports
... This could covere a number of Working Group test suites. DOMM EVnets, Pointer Evenets that are important to us
... taht is where we are, but we need to find out from the impleenter what they are ging to do to trigger the events so that will give us the basis for our Testing Plan

JS: Implementers that normally attend are from Apple
... Is IBM and implementor

RS: Yes, but, too swamped by ARIA at the moment...

JS: Maybe James can tell us more of what would be ina DRAFT event.
... I think our last call will be 90 days

J: Then the Candidiate recommendation - and that is all about PROVING that it is implemetatble - by having 2 implemnatationd

JS: Normally that would not happen until the end of last call
... I see no probeln with us starting the testing - what Are test cases are and. If we had that all ready early that would be great. But that would be overly optomstic

JW: We do not know who else is actually writing anything - that will influense the time line and the spec
... They will come up with issue sas they processd

JS: THat will lgive us an idea of how long it will take

JC: We rae adding sutomated teste for every feature that we have to webkit - i hope the other implementer s will f=do the same

JCL In the webkit soureces we have Indie UI - mother browser vendors oculd start with that - they woul eed to change them a bi

JW: They are testing the same thing on the client side for the AAPI

Katie: am I on?

MC: We would have to find them ourselves anyway

JC: Why cant we just assocuaite each test in aech user agent

MC: we need two impleetations in 2 browsers
... If we dont have the test cases in our info we do not knwo which test cases map to
... We need to have deficed test statememnts

RS: The actaull content has to be the same
... The intent is to run test that will work across multiple browsers
... What are you testing to knwo that it works. Native? I am not quie sure

<jcraig> https://svn.webkit.org/repository/webkit/trunk/LayoutTests/indieui/

JC: iwill give you an example

<jcraig> https://svn.webkit.org/repository/webkit/trunk/LayoutTests/indieui/create-uirequestevent.html

JC: This directory in the Web kit tests whether or not the type and cancellable. Functions that should be true that re specific to eb kit requester files

JW: Could somebody take that and rewrite it generic to run on the W3C test harness?

JC: Yes

JS: That is what the W3C is about generic

MCL We not necisarily

MC: The big thing is if UA 1 has the same UA 2 information and treats it the same way

JC: that is fair enough
... If there is a way to make these completely generic - that would be fine. In the case of ARIA the API was platform specific

RS: I think that could be included in the test case. It is only differrnet in how you exersize it for vaiou platfomrs?
... lets say for iOS they may have a special IA model for voice and keyboad it may be different on an Android machine

JC: I think what Rich is asking for is we can run simulated events

JS: we do not expect every machne is going to provid ethe same UI - we do expect then to be dofferenet atctaully
... We do expect authors to provide simplified markup

MC: We are expect user input event is made on-click event it made
... Do we need that abstarction layer otr not
... Thsi is also important for test reporting ona platform by platform basis

JW: We can test at that level genrucaly at that level

JS: It would eryainly be a win for us if this could be automated - is that it woudd allow users to test their work while devloping

MC: I thinnk someone is trying to speak but they are not getting through

JW; If we knew what 2 seperate impleneters were going to do it would help us

JS: Chrome is also implementing, didnt Dominic say that. Maybe we should ping them

RS: yes

JS: Mizilla wa s a little less specific about it

JC: : They are probably just going to make what we did for SP which woukd mean it is the smae implemetation

JS: That would be the same sources code with out any changes I would say no
... It has to be 2 different implementations - if the code base is sugnificantly differeent'
... Which means we really do need Mozilla or something else

RS: What if is was the same codes on the same broswer on different platforms?

JS: I do not thonk that woud be OK

JW: Again if we can find out if it is not confidentail - that would help us quite a bit

RS: Well I can reach out to the Mozilla rep on thos group?

JS: I do not knwo that we have one

MC: We do not have one - thathasjoined

JS: so that may be somethong

RS: Microsoft just joined - we proably reach out to MOzilla

JS: I would be much more comfortable if we knoew MOzilla were doing this
... Hpw many seperate test case we would have in 1.0, will we have more than 100

JC: Possible

JS; Not the size of ARIA 700 hundered something

User Contexts: identifying AT

JS: Are we done collecting?

JW: Yes the document I had posted and was taken tp the WIKI thanks MC
...

we do need to obtain use cases 1 for each section at a monimum

JW: If we could come up wt test cases that would be useful as well
... I dod review ISO req
... I am still waiting to get a copy of the document

AH: I will get that to you

JW: It will take it in that cotext
... I will consult with others on ISO 27452
... I will compleet that after I read it

AH: I will post it after this call

JW: Next week is fine for me - the only thing is Use Cases to justify and explain all that we need for the vaious requiremenets
... I think we have covred that all have proposed to the WG

AH: I ill try to get you something ont he Use cases
... I can write

JW: Use the same model we have

MC: I foul the Events to be over-froaml
... The biggest thing is to capture the thought

MC I was going to go looking for something from other WG - W3C does not have any canonical requirement s for Usse cases

<scribe> ACTION: Andy Heath to provide Use Cases [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/07/10-indie-ui-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-61 - Heath to provide Use Cases [on Andy Heath - due 2013-07-17].

JW: We do not have any rationale for any of them - and I think that is very important. If we dont have justification that will be a problem

JS: I think we will not have that conversation until James is able to retyrn

AH; My youngest is 22 and I am stil doing the job

RS; Dont scare him Andy

JS: That give sus about a month anyway before we have th knoock down drag out as to what we keep and what gets trhouwn out

RS: How close are we to getting to what we came u with in Lyon?

<MichaelC> action-61: use cases for user context

<trackbot> Notes added to ACTION-61 Heath to provide Use Cases.

<jcraig> https://www.w3.org/WAI/IndieUI/track/products/2

JC; Verey close. The existing stuff for the prodcut is here...

JCL Which is 4 issue and 15 actions

JC: Potetailly all of those would need to be done, Some are quicj fixes

<MichaelC> trackbot, assocaite action-61 with product-3

<trackbot> Sorry, MichaelC, I don't understand 'trackbot, assocaite action-61 with product-3'. Please refer to <http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for help.

<MichaelC> trackbot, associate action-61 with product-3

<trackbot> ACTION-61 (Heath to provide Use Cases) associated with PRODUCT-3.

JC; I think there is a potential ROLE

JC; If we didnt address marquee for this release would that be OK?

JC: If we are relying on ARIA we would fail
... We have to make clear to the est of W3C

JS: We have always said it but I do not think it has had much uptake

JW: People who have access needs who are not using AT will not be able to yatake advatage of it

RS: Are we going to update to have device independent stuff so it does not depend on keyboard events

MC: WebDeveloper.org and move the

RS: I would rather have it there too

JSl I agree

<jcraig> s/yatake/to take/gi

- DRAFT -

Independent User Interface Task Force Teleconference

10 Jul 2013

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