<Bailey> scribe:bailey

<Joshue108> scribeNick: Bruce

<Bailey> Main concern is people taking up techniques

<Bailey> LGR: Rough drafts encouraged

<Bailey> Adam working on resize

<Bailey> David working on landmarks

<Bailey> Question if David work got into survey?

<Bailey> Discuss approach to write up, when to separate, when to group.

<David> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_ARIA_landmarks

<Bailey> ACTION: All -- take a look a davids technique [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/03/05-html-techs-tf-minutes.html#action01]

<David> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/20120126misc/results

<Bailey> Josh working on section elements

<Bailey> Bruce thinks to works on data table techniques this week.

<Loretta> Loretta: I *will* write up the track technqiues this week...

<Bailey> ITEM: Using ARIA Landmarks

<Bailey> Survey was closed 2012-01-26

<Bailey> Issue with commenting on closed survey.

<Bailey> Loretta making up survey for new comments.

<Bailey> Providing real-time feedback to David. David editing in wiki.

<David> dmacdona

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/20120305misc/

<Bailey> Discussion of techniques which really only benefit AT screen reader users.

<Bailey> Adam to add this talking point in survey response.

<Bailey> open issue Using ARIA landmarks

Using ARIA landmarks

<Joshue108> For anyone not on the call who wishes to comment on the ARIA landmarks technique please visit http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/20120305misc/

<Bailey> David raises question of HTML5 vs. HTML4/XHTML issues. This is good example of that because DIV is a hack compared to elements available in HTML5.

<Loretta> ok, I added some comments to the survey.

<Joshue108> me too

<Joshue108> and Adam

<David> moving to text in irc...

<Bailey> Discussing survey responses.

<Bailey> Discussing how much user agent support required for a technique to be sufficient.

<Bailey> Techniques must be specific to Success Criteria.

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/H42.html

<Bailey> It is possible that some ARIA techniques may not map directly to S.C.

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/G141.html

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/H69.html

<Bailey> Advisory techniques not followed nearly as much as sufficient techniques.

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20-20101014/navigation-mechanisms-skip.html

<Bailey> Loretta provides examples using heading for organization and navigation.

<Bailey> Recall that H69 as sufficient is being criticized and may be reduced to advisory at some point.

<David> i have to step away to figure out the jackhammer... be back in 2 minutes

<Bailey> Issue: Concern that some ARIA may end up being purely advisory.

<Bailey> Sufficiency on a per-SC basis.

<Bailey> Proposed: Work from SC and look for ARIA techniques rather than from ARIA techniques to SC.

<David> back but on mute

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Techniques/HTML5

<Loretta> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Techniques/ARIA

<Bailey> Loretta points out that this is the way techniques are organized now.

<Joshue108> ACTION: Josh to check if ARIA roles etc are mapped to success criteria they may satisfy [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/03/05-html-techs-tf-minutes.html#action02]

<Bailey> Loretta points out that landmark roles not listed as sufficient for 1.3.1

<adam> sorry but i have to leave in two minutes

<Bailey> May need to combine ARIA with scripting

<Loretta> H70: Using frame elements to group blocks of repeated material (HTML) AND H64: Using the title attribute of the frame and iframe elements (HTML)

<Bailey> Combining techniques (e.g. ARIA plus scripting) has been used for satisfying SC

<Bailey> Consensus is importance with ARIA being non-advisory techniques

<Bailey> Discussion on proof-of-concept for navigating by keyboard.

<Joshue108> ACTION: Josh to find out if anyone is interested in creating accessibility test cases that go beyond screen reader use. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/03/05-html-techs-tf-minutes.html#action03]

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found Scribe: bailey
Found ScribeNick: Bruce
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Default Present: Joshue, Bruce_Bailey, David_MacDonald, +1.650.253.aaaa
Present: Joshue Bruce_Bailey David_MacDonald +1.650.253.aaaa
Regrets: James_Nurthen Michael_Cooper David_Todd Christophe_Strobbe Marc_Johlic
Got date from IRC log name: 05 Mar 2012
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2012/03/05-html-techs-tf-minutes.html
People with action items: all josh