HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

19 May 2011

See also: IRC log


Michael_Cooper, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, John_Foliot, Janina, Steve_Faulkner, Cynthia, Lynn_Holdsworth
Steve_Faulkner, Stevef


MC: lets do action reviw and subteam reports

Subteam Reports: Media; Canvas; Bug Triage

CYNS: asks for delay in text subteam report until janina, judy presenat

JF: made progress yeaterday, in regards to text alternatives and poster img, a pattern where stuff is a child element of the video element

video takes video descriptions and poster description using aria-describedat

JF: question about concatenation of id values content

<JF> aria-describedby="foo bar"

not descibedat, describedby

RS: unclear about how it will work

JF: in trad video, inside is fallback content

<janina> Should I post the votes we received overnight via email now?

JF: onscreen html text embedded in video

RS: is the text hidden by the video, JF: yes

JF: silvia sent an email out about the pattern
... authros and user agents need to understand the pattern
... please provide feedback as its important

MC: must move on in ten to other items

RS: outstanding issues, i posted a link

<richardschwerdtfe> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011May/0457.html

RS: we had a meeting chairs reviewed posposal, caveats did not get adressed should be addressed during LC
... wanted to seperate drawing calls, alos problems with text metrics, but never got discussed
... finally, really big thing is providing bounds of objects drawn on canvas, solution is to do hit testing on canvas
... cannot enter defect yet as it will take time to work up
... issue raised on public html
... ian asked for use cases, they were provided, but he didn't repsond
... going into last call still open issues need to be addressed, open up issue 131 after last call

MC: understand that is an issue for a number of a11y issues
... nothing from bug sub team

Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open

<MichaelC> close action-111

<trackbot> ACTION-111 Send e-mail message to a11y TF mailing list with a draft summary of the TF consensus position on what exceptions should be allowed for alt-less images (e.g., role=presentation, aria-labeledby, etc.) closed

<MichaelC> close action-113

<trackbot> ACTION-113 Create a change proposal for longdesc that includes example of how a user agent might render longdesc information closed

<MichaelC> close action-114

<trackbot> ACTION-114 Work with Steve and go through decisions from Lyon and document them regarding HTML-ISSUE-31 closed

Forwarded Text Subteam Issues (See Below)

JS: 2 things we need to revisit today

2 consensus decisions made, need to be rerun

JS: once last call dealt with should revisit procedures

JS: we need to follow published procedures, must vote on taskforce call
... must run a wbs

for 3 days

RS: what happens with the survey

JS: is same question

do you support the proposal, do you support filing a formal objection

RS: tring to get a last call published looking for comments, we can still adress these duing call

<JF> +q

<JF> +1 to rich

JS: lets discuss pf yesterday
... will most probably be second last call
... survey may be extended
... PF cannot support last call in its current state, but could support it with inline annotation
... each of us able to vote as individuals

JF: PF is memebr private, i haven't seen the language
... i cannot comment on it, last call is deep freeze
... when we hit last call stuff will not be added

JS: there will be continued editors drafts

after last call

JF: wg being asked to vote on moving goal posts

RS: there are so many thiongs not addressed on a11y, all of a sudden we are going to last call

CYNS: its risky to slow it down
... HTML5 needs to meet it milestone and schedule and longdesc is not the thing to block it on

<JF> +jf

<JF> +q

JS: i am most troubled by html4 features are not there

<JF> +1 to SteveF

JF: they knew this was an issue and played games with longdesc

acl JF

JF: impression inside the wg that accessibility issues have no stop action

RS: not rying to give priority to a11y issues, all i want to hear from the chairs of the html wg is that the last call draft includes accessibility issues
... i have provided the issues

JS: i want to see it in writing

sorry RS: in writing

JF: if they put it in writing then it will be ok


<JF> The Task Force supports the Issue 30 Change Proposal at:

<JF> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/InstateLongdesc


<JF> +1

<MRanon> +1

<richardschwerdtfe> +1

<LynnH_RNIB> +1

<cyns> -1

<richardschwerdtfe> -1

<eric_carlson> -1

<cyns> without this bullet, I could support it

<cyns> It is unlikely that many content creators or developers will learn ARIA (something not native HTML). They already feel like they've learned far more than they should have to know under their job description. And in many cases, their supervisors agree. (reference Cliff Tyllick)"

<JF> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/InstateLongdesc/AlternativesAreNotViableSolutions#aria-describedat

i agree that "It is unlikely that many content creators or developers will learn ARIA (something not native HTML). They already feel like they've learned far more than they should have to know under their job description. And in many cases, their supervisors agree. (reference Cliff Tyllick)" should be removed

<richardschwerdtfe> +1 if that sentence is removed

<MRanon> (I can live with that sentence, but I want the highest chaces of success for the CP, so happy to let it go)

<JF> +1 to MRanon's point


JF: longdesc is worth fighting for, has become symbolic of the brokeness of accessibility support

JS: strategic value is high

CYNS: that is part of the problem, it has lots of good things in it

JF: we have more proof and evidence that longdesc should stay in HTML5
... consensus is not unanimity

JS: can't pull it in time


<JF> The Task Force supports a Formal Objection escalation should it appear that HTML last call is to be published without the longdesc as in our supported proposal

<janina> +1

<janina> Laura_Carlson, Leonie_Watson, Geoff_Freed, Joshue_OConnor, Gez_Lemon voting yes by email

<JF> +1

<cyns> -1

<janina> Silvia_Pfeiffer, Charlesr_ McCathieNevile, Sean_Hayes gvoting no by email

<richardschwerdtfe> -1

<LynnH_RNIB> +1

<JF> Leif H. silli by email +1

<MRanon> +1


gotta go bye

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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