HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

07 Feb 2011

See also: IRC log




<trackbot> Date: 07 February 2011

<scribe> meeting: W3C HTML Canvas Accessibility Working Group


<scribe> scribe: Rich

Caret/Selection Position

Rich: We should finish the spec as is before we decide on moving caret selection


Chuck: I think that that leaving it as a rectangle is fine.
... CSS has a scale command but it has to be mapped to the old coordinate space for the mouse
... I think what we have is fine. We can say we use the current transformation matrix
... We need to transform the width and height based on the current transformation matrix
... I think adding w, and h to the transformation of the caret is fine
... I need to prototype it
... Dominic (Google) will implement it in Chrome

Rich: It looks like Benjamin wants us to move caret and selection position to a normative definition in the spec.
... I will do that and send it out for review
... anything else on caret blink rate?

Chuck: This does not help in and and by itself

Rich: I will add text in blink rate to refer to WCAG 2 requirements on flashing

Chuck: there can really be so much animation and movement going on that caret seems inadequate but putting text underneath blink rate that refers to WCAG 2 seems like a good move

Rich: Will add a note that generalizes on flashing wrt. caret and general canvas updates

<Downchuck> was considering removing the actual caretBlink method and just having the note there

Rich: we need to expose blink rate somehow

Chuck: most display caret by a more stable cursor

ZoomText: sets a non-blinking caret

Rich: yes, but they probably do that in the system.
... If an AT changes the blink rate and we don't respond to the blink rate in canvas apps we have a problem.
... update canvas blink rate with note and run by Zoomtext team

<Downchuck> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=11328


Rich: Did Hixie respond to your text extent?

Chuck: He now understands what we are asking and I am waiting to hear back.

Limiting content in the canvas subtree

Chuck: Browser manufacturers do not want to limit content in the canvas shadow DOM.

Frank: Do you agree with this?

to Frank Olivier: Do you agree with this?

<frankolivier> I agree

<frankolivier> It would be good to have a discussion with all browser implementors on this topic (in the html5 wg)

<frankolivier> ...as we are creating a new non-visual 'mode' for all element

Resolution: Do not want to limit canvas subtree in this group

To Frank: How do you propose we raise this question?

To Frank: Want me to have Janina raise this?

<frankolivier> I think a mail on this topic to html-wg should be sufficient

To Frank: I can her raise this on the next HTML call Thursday

<frankolivier> we need dom experts to weigh in here

To Frank: Do you want to post the question?

<frankolivier> Sure, will do


<scribe> ACTION: Olivier: Post question to HTML working group on whether to limit HTML elements in non-visible content such as the Canvas fallback content [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-104 - Post question to HTML working group on whether to limit HTML elements in non-visible content such as the Canvas fallback content [on Frank Olivier - due 2011-02-14].


Chuck: WhatWG squashed it over the concern over Rich Text Editing. This was raised by Japan engineers

Spelling, grammar, selection

Rich: We can use the HTML selection methods across the browsers

Chuck: Webkit does not allow disconnected selections

<Downchuck> <div>node A</div><div>node C</div><div>node B</div>

<Downchuck> if for whatever reason it was in that format, and A & B were to be selected, but not C

<Downchuck> re: "- Positioning information of content is required - per AISquared feedback"

Rich: We could a caret using <mark aria-selected="true"></mark> if needed in the content but would need to make aria-selected a global attribute

<Downchuck> We only need to respond to a subset of the dom

Rich: Other than aria-selected I don't see any blocking items
... for us

To Frank: We need to be able to populate the bounding rectangles for MSAA.

To Frank: Have you given any thoughts to this?

<frankolivier> Our current approach is to report the boudnign rectangle of the cnavas element

Rich: yes but all the fallback content can't be in the same place

<Downchuck> drawFocusRing reports the live bounding rectangle; <div aria-live="polite">Text to display</div> reports the content

we could take x,y coordinates from area maps and apply it to elements - worst case?

<frankolivier> ...that seems like an ok approach...

<frankolivier> we'd need top, left, width, height


<frankolivier> ...or we could have the author set those on the actual elements

Rich: true

<frankolivier> i getelementbyid on the fake checkbox, set the t, l, w, h

<frankolivier> that seems like a better approach and will fix our architecture a bit better


Rich: Could be a lot of IDs but it would work

Chuck: I have some thoughts. I will show an example for next week
... I will show how this will work in a live application for next week

VNC Clients

Chuck: We can get MSAA data/events sent over the pipe

To Frank: Have you thought about doing this for Windows VNCs?

<Downchuck> remote desktop

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: Olivier: Post question to HTML working group on whether to limit HTML elements in non-visible content such as the Canvas fallback content [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]
[End of minutes]

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$Date: 2011/02/07 21:04:55 $

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Found Date: 07 Feb 2011
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People with action items: olivier

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