<trackbot> Date: 02 February 2011

<scribe> Scribe: Cameron

<scribe> ScribeNick: heycam

SVG 1.1 Second Edition progress

CL: i've finally finished off the abbra test, which helps with a few i think
... you just checked them in erik?

ED: yes i updated the tables

CL: i've also got another implementation from ekioh, which is a 1.2T implementation, but he claims that it passes 5 tests that we currently have listed as not being passed

<ChrisL> Ekioh

<ChrisL> > PW> animate-elem-46-t

<ChrisL> > PW> fonts-desc-02-t

<ChrisL> > PW> fonts-glyph-02-t

<ChrisL> > PW> painting-stroke-10-t

<ChrisL> > PW> text-intro-05-t

CL: I haven't run it yet
... i've also been talking with another company, they do an svg to pdf converter, and they're interested in running the test suite
... that won't help us with any dom tests, but it may help with some of the static ones
... lastly i can talk to alex, if we have a shortlist of items we don't pass, we could get him to work on those to fix them

CM: i think we should see which ones we should go for implementations, and which ones we should drop

CL: animate-elem-46-t we've already got one passing then

<ChrisL> animate-elem-46-t one pass from Opera and Ekioh claim a pass too

CM: the issue is font-weight animation with discrete/interpolated values

<ed> <animate attributeName="font-weight" values="bold;normal;bold" dur="3s" fill="freeze"/>

CL: ask jdagett about whether you can interpolate these

<ed> that's what the test is doing, so depends on how the interpolation there is meant to work

CL: I think it should interpolate from 0 to 1000
... because there are fonts existing that say their weights that are not multiples of 100
... 250s, 750s, etc.
... maybe we could just drop that sub-test, split it out
... clarify the issue, and then bring it back as a separate test
... if we think it's correct and we've got two passes then we're all right...

ED: afaics from firefox it's a timing issue rather than a font weight issue
... we did recently make a change to animation interpolation code that we had a bug on, not sure if it affected this test, but i can check internal builds to see how it goes
... it's possible it looks more like what firefox is doing now

CM: after the call i will test batik/firefox/webkit with the last subtest removed

<scribe> ACTION: Chris to read css3 fonts and ask jdaggett about interpolating font-weight animations [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2936 - Read css3 fonts and ask jdaggett about interpolating font-weight animations [on Chris Lilley - due 2011-02-09].

<scribe> ACTION: cameron to test batik/firefox/webkit with the last subtest removed (animate-elem-46-t) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2937 - Test batik/firefox/webkit with the last subtest removed (animate-elem-46-t) [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ChrisL> filters-light-02-f

CL: is this something that's been changed because of errata?

ED: yes, from memory

CL: so some of this is stable stuff and some just changed 6 months ago

CM: is this one affected by anthony's direction of the light erratum?

ED: it might be

AG: i will check

ED: it's about the same thing

<ed> ISSUE-2339?

<trackbot> ISSUE-2339 -- Last Call Comment: definition of azimuth, elevation for feDistantLight -- open

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2339

CL: opera is the only one that passes
... so we should lean on someone to fix it

AG: i think in the spec we've got it wrong

TB: inkscape does it backwards
... let me check

CL: if the spec is wrong or ambiguous, and inkscape has copied the spec, and we've now corrected the spec...

TB: i ran the test automatically and with our test harness it failed
... but when i open it in inkscape it passes, but the reference image is just a bit lighter

CL: i wouldn't worry about that too much

TB: we pass, then

CL: what about -03?

TB: that one we don't get the primitiveUnits=objectBoundingBox one correct

ED: so from our experience, the primitiveUnits thing is a day of work, not too hard, mostly just converting the coordinates
... if you have everything else in place it shouldn't be that hard to implement

TB: i'm not sure whether we do objectBoundingBox correct anywhere

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/filters-light-03-f.svg

<ChrisL> file://localhost/D:/WWW/dev/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/filters-light-03-f.svg

AG: looking at filters-light-02 i think we should be fine re the erratum
... since the test is testing azimuth, but the erratum is about elevation
... the difference might be a darker or lighter arc

<scribe> ACTION: cameron to look at batik for filters-light-03 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2938 - Look at batik for filters-light-03 [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/filters-overview-01-b.svg

<ChrisL> filters-overview-01-b.svg

CM: firefox doesn't implement those four inputs

TB: inkscape doesn't do fillpaint/strokepaint

CL: i noticed the ones that fail in firefox are different from those that fail in batik
... firefox doesn't do backgroundimage/backgroundalpha

CM: and fillpaint/fillstroke
... not sure how easy batik is to fix
... backgroundimage/backgroundalpha are harder to implement

<scribe> ACTION: cameron to look into batik failing filters-overview-01 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2939 - Look into batik failing filters-overview-01 [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/fonts-desc-04-t.svg

CL: abbra only has some small problems with italic/oblique
... maybe it can be fixed

CM: seems like this test might be passed by some tiny implementations

ED: for opera it's the last line that fails

CL: and i think that's a css 2.1 conformance failure

CM: what's it testing specifically?

<ChrisL> Italic can match against oblique or italic, but all other values must match exactly.

CM: seems like it should be a simple fix then

<scribe> ACTION: erik to look at opera failing fonts-desc-04 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2940 - Look at opera failing fonts-desc-04 [on Erik Dahlström - due 2011-02-09].

<scribe> ACTION: cameron to look into batik failing fonts-desc-04 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action06]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2941 - Look into batik failing fonts-desc-04 [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/fonts-desc-05-t.svg

ED: fonts-desc-05, is that testing the same thing? or something different?

CL: this is testing smallcaps or not, also testing the oblique thing

CM: seems to be testing precedence of the font descriptors too, looking at the pass criteria

<scribe> ACTION: cameron to check batik for fonts-desc-05 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action07]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2942 - Check batik for fonts-desc-05 [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

ED: might be hard for us to deal with, we do synthesis of smallcaps
... i think the fonts don't have uppercase glyphs
... so we would go to the missing glyph

CL: so you never use the real small cap font, only the synthesized one?

<scribe> ACTION: Erik to check opera for fonts-desc-05, but no promises! [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action08]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2943 - Check opera for fonts-desc-05, but no promises! [on Erik Dahlström - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/fonts-glyph-02-t.svg

ED: i know this one passes in internal builds

CL: it should be fairly easy, if you do svg fonts
... on the <glyph> element there's an arabic-form attribute
... which says whether it's isolated, medial, etc.
... that's what it's testing

ED: we could change it to use text-anchor=middle
... same in opera, it will pass with text-anchor=middle

<ChrisL> I just checked in the change on CVS

CM: not sure about this text-anchor issue

ED: the text has been backported from 1.2T

CL: the tests need fixing for those text-anchor issues

<scribe> ACTION: erik to regenerate reference image for fonts-glyph-02 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action09]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2944 - Regenerate reference image for fonts-glyph-02 [on Erik Dahlström - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/fonts-glyph-03-t.svg

CM: huh, i didn't know <glyph> had lang=""

CL: it's because of CJK unification, to select between different versions of character for chinese and japanese etc.

<scribe> ACTION: cameron to look into fonts-glyph-03 with no guarantees [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action10]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2945 - Look into fonts-glyph-03 with no guarantees [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

ACTION-2945: for batik

<trackbot> ACTION-2945 Look into fonts-glyph-03 with no guarantees notes added

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/interact-pevents-04-t.svg

ED: i could live with fonts-glyph-03 being dropped for now

<scribe> ACTION: Erik to change the font in fonts-glyph-03 to make the space glyphs be blank [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action11]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2946 - Change the font in fonts-glyph-03 to make the space glyphs be blank [on Erik Dahlström - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/linking-uri-01-b.svg

CL: this is also affected by errata
... svg use to say bare fragments mean nothing
... we changed it to mean centered on the thing with that id
... there's a seaprate issue about highlighting it, which i think we decided you shouldn't have to
... but the moving the viewport probably would be an easy thing
... if you already do views, it should be easy

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/publish/linking.html

<shepazu> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/publish/linking.html#SVGFragmentIdentifiers

DS: there may be UAs out there that do this, maybe we can change the spec to say "UAs can do highlighting if they support :target"

<scribe> ACTION: Chris to propose wording for highlighting and :target [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action12]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2947 - Propose wording for highlighting and :target [on Chris Lilley - due 2011-02-09].

<ChrisL> viewTarget = "XML_Name [XML_NAME]*"

<ChrisL> Indicates the target object associated with the view. If provided, then the target element(s) will be highlighted.

<scribe> ACTION: Chris to change linking-uri-01 and linking-uri-02 to remove the requirement to highlight [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action13]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2948 - Change linking-uri-01 and linking-uri-02 to remove the requirement to highlight [on Chris Lilley - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/painting-render-02-b.svg

CM: it should be testing alpha compositing with color-interpolation
... nobody passes, and comments saying that the test is wrong

CL: let's unapprove it

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to unapprove painting-render-02-b [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action14]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2949 - Unapprove painting-render-02-b [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/painting-stroke-10-t.svg

<ChrisL> This tests that stroking of zero length subpaths will result in

<ChrisL> some rendering if the 'stroke-linecap' property is set to

<ChrisL> 'square' or 'round', but not if it is set to 'butt'.

CM: jwatt has a patch for this, but it hasn't been approved to be landed yet

<ChrisL> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/harness/htmlObjectApproved/

ED: we have a bunch of bugs on zero length paths, and i don't think any of those are close to being fixed

CM: it's probably not simple in batik, or in webkit

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to see how easy painting-stroke-10-t is to fix in Batik [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action15]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2950 - See how easy painting-stroke-10-t is to fix in Batik [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/struct-dom-15-f.svg

CM: seems to be doing the use element correctly with event dispatch

<shepazu> ISSUE: for SVG2 / SVG Fonts, describe rational for @lang on <glyph>, e.g. because of CJK unification, to select between different versions of character for chinese and japanese etc.

<trackbot> Created ISSUE-2399 - For SVG2 / SVG Fonts, describe rational for @lang on <glyph>, e.g. because of CJK unification, to select between different versions of character for chinese and japanese etc. ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2399/edit .

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to review struct-dom-15 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action16]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2951 - Review struct-dom-15 [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

ED: we can split it up

<scribe> ACTION: Patrick to review struct-dom-15 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action17]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2952 - Review struct-dom-15 [on Patrick Dengler - due 2011-02-09].

http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/harness/htmlObjectApproved/struct-dom-15-f.html

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to look into off-colors in reference images on mac [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html#action18]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2953 - Look into off-colors in reference images on mac [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-09].

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/text-align-07-t.svg

CL: abbra passes -08 but not -07
... in unicode there are tables to determine which glyphs go from which baselines

PD: we only have two fonts that support ideographic baseline

<ChrisL> the problem is that for OT/TT fonts, there can be no baseline info at all so what should it align to?

<ChrisL> the svg version of the test has explicit baseline infor for all four lines

<ChrisL> so is the test correct, i am saying

CM: (summarises some fx tf discussions)
... if we will unapprove one we should unapprove both

<ChrisL> don't follow; one has explicit info and the other has implicit or missing info

ChrisL, ah you dropped off

ChrisL, I'll mail you a summary of what we discussed, since we're out of time now anyway

<ChrisL> yes I get dropped after 40 minutes

<ChrisL> ok

<ed> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0100.html

ed, ah right yes i will :)

trackbot, end telcon

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/ED/CL/
Found Scribe: Cameron
Found ScribeNick: heycam
Default Present: tbah, [IPcaller], ed, Shepazu, heycam, +39.524.9.aaaa, ChrisL, anthony_work, [Microsoft], adrianba
Present: tbah [IPcaller] ed Shepazu heycam +39.524.9.aaaa ChrisL anthony_work [Microsoft] adrianba
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0102.html

WARNING: No meeting chair found!
You should specify the meeting chair like this:
<dbooth> Chair: dbooth

Found Date: 02 Feb 2011
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2011/02/02-svg-minutes.html
People with action items: cameron chris erik patrick