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<scribe> Scribe: Addison Phillips
<scribe> ScribeNick: aphillip
Check on HTML5 language tag validator and send any comments
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Write to i18n public groups and ask for opinion on whether <br> should be a paragraph separator or whitespace to be used to determin consensus
write to public-i18n-bidi@
trackbot, close ACTION-10
<trackbot> ACTION-10 Write to i18n public groups and ask for opinion on whether <br> should be a paragraph separator or whitespace to be used to determin consensus closed
reopened bug and made comment
discussing bug 10828
whethere <br> should be a paragraph separator
aharon: when reopened bug didn't
say what we wanted; hoping hixie will ask what we want done or
have an opinion
... in response on public-i18n-bidi
... got replies from Martin and Asmus
... bring it to the editor's attention was the basic reply
aharon: intention of email
... all of the bugs are in a reasonable status to me
... have reached end of line for each of these
... aim in dividing into groups was to ensure that WG opinion could be applied in cases where consensus is in question
... my groupings were "100% satisfied", "rejected but solid reasoning" (okay to close, but discuss), and "middle ground" (accepted with significant change)
... don't expect to open many of these
David: on "middle ground" ones, the solution proposed doesn't quite match the "ideal solution"?
aharon: might be less than ideal, but at least significant difference
David: if they go ahead, will there be compatibility problems with doing things correct way?
Proposes new ubi=on|off|”” attribute, mapping to unicode-bidi:isolate for ubi=on|””.
aharon: CSS3 has new bidi
attribute "isolate", we proposed exposing in HTML as ubi
... instead they created element <bdi>
... like the name change
... but it's harder to use as an element than as an attribute
... but they think it represents an fundamental entity (an "isolated" somehting or other)
... but I think it is less easy to use
... they also changed the default stylesheet
... so that the <outlook> element also has "bidi:isolate"
... a little uncomfortable about that
... should we ask to get rid of that?
... <output> inconsistent?
... once it has that property, more difficult to override
... and usually used for numbers, which don't generally need this
addison: should be separate comment/bug? maybe save for last call?
<scribe> chair: any objection to leaving 10807 alone?
Proposes new “auto” value for the dir attribute, and a new attribute, autodirmethod=first-strong|any-rtl|plaintext. Elements with dir=auto to be isolated by default (via separately-proposed ubi attribute, see 2.1 above).
aharon: 'auto' used to guess at
... this was accepted
... also proposed another attribute, autodirmethod
... which would specify the algorithm for deciding the direction of auto
... autodirmethod not accepted
... also makes things simpler
... end user can more easily control outcome by putting LRM or RLM or rephrasing etc.
<scribe> chair: any changes?
matial: think this is a good
... keep things simple
... don't have proven better algorithms
Proposes new submitdir attribute (boolean) for input and textarea elements, which would add a control to the submission whose name is that of the element suffixed with “_dir”, and whose value is the element’s computed direction at the time of submission.
Aharon: proposed submitdir which
would add a field to submission, which would have either ltr or
rtl as the value
... and additional field would be the element's name plus "_dir"
... long discussion; current resolution is new attribute 'dirname'
... some people assumed 'submitdir' would change the "directory" to which to submit to
... also, they didn't want a boolean attribute and wanted the field name controlled
... not that happy with 'dirname' because it is kind of unclear
... and probably don't want 'dir' itself, since dir now has three values (including auto)
... but value can't be auto
<scribe> chair: satisfied enough?
aharon: yes, okay enough
Proposes requiring user agents to implement the Unicode spec re Default Ignorable Code Points (Unicode Standard version 5.2, Chapter 5<http://unicode.org/versions/Unicode5.2.0/ch05.pdf>, section 5.21), even if the underlying platform does not handle them properly. In particular, this must be the case for the directional formatting characters in script dialog text, page titles, and tooltips. The HTML author can then use such characters to indicate the directio
aharon: if an app doesn't know
how to deal with LRM/RLO, etc. etc.
... it should just ignore them
... as opposed to trying to draw them (e.g. as tofu boxes)
... this is not followed by some well-known platforms
... proposal was to add to html that user-agents implement DICP part of Unicode to the extent that they don't rely on platform to implement correctly
... hixie's response was "it's already in Unicode, so why repeat it..."
... but control characters no longer so important (since we have dir attributes) and platforms getting better anyway, okay with forgetting about it
matial: hixie rejected because has nothing to do with HTML protocol, just a recommendation for user-agents
aharon: possible to add, since there is some place for native controls, etc., so could include a note there
<scribe> chair: any objections?
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/of that/of that?/ Succeeded: s/submit do/submit to/ Found Scribe: Addison Phillips Found ScribeNick: aphillip WARNING: No "Present: ... " found! Possibly Present: David DavidClarke Gwyneth Microsoft ScribeNick addison aharon aphillip freedom i18n joined matial trackbot You can indicate people for the Present list like this: <dbooth> Present: dbooth jonathan mary <dbooth> Present+ amy Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2011Jan/0000.html Got date from IRC log name: 05 Jan 2011 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2011/01/05-i18n-minutes.html People with action items:[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]