HTML-A11Y telecon

01 Sep 2010

See also: IRC log


Sean_Hayes, John_Foliot, Judy, Janina, Eric_Carlson, silvia
jf, John_Foliot, janina


<janina> agenda: this

<JF> JF will scribe today

<janina> scribe: jf

<janina> scribe: John_Foliot

Identify Scribe

Actions Review

<JF> Action 52

<trackbot> Sorry, bad ACTION syntax

<JF> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_User_Requirements#T echnical_Requirements_Prioritizations_and_Dependencies

<JF> Missed action deadline, but working actively

<JF> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/54

<JF> PLH has taken on the issue of ensuring we have a good hosting location, and that all permissions are in order

<JF> Judy will follow up on confirmations and will advise

User Requirements: Status & Intro at HTML-WG

<JF> JS - proud and exicted after last weeks call - final edits are all in place

<JF> Will investigate if this should be published as a note at W3C - down the road

<JF> Judy - wants to cll out that Chairs have welcomed Janina to do a Q & A on tomorrow's call

<JF> suggest that members of the sub-team join in on that call

<JF> Re: Section 1 - Judy did do several re-arrangings of that sections - were provisional

<JF> still concerned abotu what is in that section: provisio in place

<JF> believes that Section 1 is still not properly organized

<JF> Question: who put in the Section 1 - autism section into the wiki? Hope to re-balance it somewhat

<JF> but doesn't want to dilute anything and cause offence

<JF> Sean- it was provided by a colleague

<JF> Judy - it is great material, but will re-work it slightly to fit the larger overal doc

<JF> JS - 1 quasi-substantive change after an exchange with Geoff

<JF> make a cleaner distincition between extended descrbed video and extended captioning

<JF> 'extended' might cause confusion, so suggesting extended descriptive description, and 'enhanced' captioing (i.e could contain HTML, etc.)

<JF> confusion seems to be resolved here

<JF> JS HTML weekly teleconference is Noon Bostom time tomorrow

<JF> irc channel = html-wg

<JF> JS intends to do a walk through on the doc at that call

<JF> focus on kinds of alternatives and requirements

<JF> hope to get more cooperation from the larger technical group - to date there has been no response from anyone on the HTML WG mailing list

<JF> need to get greater involvement in developing the technical solutions

Proof of Concept Demos

<JF> JS: not much to say at this point

<JF> Q: should we reference this in the user Reqs document?

<JF> Silvia: prefer if we keep this seperate, so that we could build up more demo examples

<JF> link to but keep seperate

<JF> Judy: thought - when WCAG2 was in CR, needed to provide 2 implementations of every requirement

<JF> some of the examples were not sure to remain stable, but many are

<JF> so perhaps accessible media examples could be rolled in as well

<JF> as demonstrations of what is expected/needed, not neccessarily how it is to be done in HTML5

<JF> JS: Eric, what is/was your question/ issue on what he saw?

<JF> ERic: was able to view one of the movies (and transcoded to Ogg and MP4)

<JF> but did not have a copy of RealPlayer to view the second video

<JF> Ogg and/or MP4 more 'viewable' today

<JF> demo is so lod that existing software to play back may no longer exist

<JF> Janina will follow up to see if we can do something about the second demo and view-ability

Technical Requirements Prioritizations and Dependencies

<JF> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_User_Requirements#T%20echnical_Requirements_Prioritizations_and_Dependencies

<janina> scribe: janina

jf is walking through his first cut, looking at controls access as an example, what is must, what is should, what is may ...

<scribe> scribe: jf

Judy: interested in approach

good time to ensure that this is in fact the right approach

impression was that when we talked about this that rather than prioritize all the user reqs, rather to prioritize what would be technically challenging

is there a narrower task that would be useful to implementors, that could be dealt with more quickly?

Judy: lot of pressure time-wise to deliver what we can ASAP
... can we identify the technical challenges alone?

Silvia: agrees with Judy that all we need is a table with the user-reqs and then keep them sorted in different areas

Need to focus on a smaller view

Sean: we need to go through the text (as it has been evolving) and pull it out as bullet points

i.e to ensure that all the procse is covered in bullet points

JS: is there anything in the prose that cannot be checked off in the bullet points?

Eric: this is a difficult issue - if we don't provide a prioritized list to the browser vendors then they will choose what they want

if it's difficult for hte experts, it will be even harder for the non-experts

Judy: accepts that this is an issue

but we don't have sufficient represntation of all expert communities

<silvia> I have moved the table to http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Checklist

if there is some way of finding a compromise that is helpful to browser implementors?

Sean: agrees with Eric that a prioritization is required

what can be reasonably implemented in the next few months?

it's about implementation priorities

step 1 get the list, then compare what has already been done?

Eric: what is most important that we all agree on what needs to be worked on - key is interoperability

JS: agrees, what can we get into the browsers now?

Silvia agrees that we need to get to a state where browsers are in synch

pages need a disclaimer that this is NOT for implementaion, but a work in progress

JS: would like to be sure that we note that the specification must support all of our user requirements

including the harder to implement features

we cannot put that off

Judy: was discussing earlier on how to take more advantage of process culture in HTML WG

wqe need to generate a bug-list against the specs for any gaps or mis-matches

thus having the technical challenges identified will assist in that

so generating a list of bugs of what we need as quickly as possible would be useful

JS: suspects that this is true, but not sure if this is what we are talking about here

Judy: is hoping that we could have a bug list in 2-3 weeks time (maximum)

JS: this relates to timing format discussion

Judy: thought we agreed not to 'choose' a time-format, but rather than offer informed opinion

JS: hopes we don't get forced into making a decision

Silvia: suggest to copy over the the bullet list from the user requirements

what is here is what we want, but this is not a fast nor easy process

are the bullet points complete?

JS: some bullet points might show up more than once

Silvia: agreed, but we need to start simple

JS: we have a plan...

(not completely captured in minutes, but Silvia will establish some early examples, and JF will then work to flesh out

Sean: TTML

Candidate Technologies: WebSRT; WMML; TTML; SMIL3; Etc.

Sean: waiting on the table, but wanted to check to make sure that there is a mapping in HTML5 to TTMl

Sean has put together a mapping on how to get from TTML to HTML5

there is a basic structure

first grab all the styles

TTML really only does inline styles

but there is a mechanism to group it all together

this is being explained

next is the time cue mechansim

so an examination of how to do that

once you have those 2 things, then take them and construct what Ian is calling an HTML cue object

there is a pretty straightforward mapping

there is an HTML abstract of cue

it seems that it is pretty much a one-toone mapping

the XML nature is actually a benefit here

Ian has a concept of rendering rules, and Sean has thought about how that would work

if you take the cue ( a rectangular region)

it can then be styled

and/or rendered elsewhere

Link for Sean (FYI) http://kazhack.org/?post/2010/08/26/HTML-Timing

Silvia: wants to point out that pieces of SMIL that are being used today may not be re-usable for video

Judy: seems we might be able to steer the discussion towards the capabilities of an established standard

has a powerful motivator

next meeting

JS: any further issues/questions?

Judy: to confirm, Silvia is 'priming the pump' for the prioritized tech challenges document

then JF will take it on to continue theat work

is that enough for now?

Judy: just want to ensure that we keep moving - are there any other additional tasks for this week?

<silvia> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Checklist

JS: closing up meeting

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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Found Scribe: jf
Found Scribe: John_Foliot
Found Scribe: janina
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Found Scribe: jf
Inferring ScribeNick: JF
Scribes: jf, John_Foliot, janina
ScribeNicks: janina, JF
Default Present: Sean_Hayes, John_Foliot, Judy, Janina, Eric_Carlson, silvia
Present: Sean_Hayes John_Foliot Judy Janina Eric_Carlson silvia
Got date from IRC log name: 01 Sep 2010
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2010/09/01-html-a11y-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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