<oedipus> happy venerable bede's day (catholic observance) http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/obfuscation.html#may27
<oedipus> happy belated venerable bede's day (anglican observance) http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/obfuscation.html#may25
<oedipus> venerable bede is credited with conceiving the footnote
<MichaelC> trackbot, start meeting
<trackbot> Date: 27 May 2010
<janina> Meeting: HTML-A11Y telecon
<janina> agenda: this
<cyns> action items review
<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - items
<inserted> scribenick: cyns
Action 28 on Gregory on future of datamining
<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - 28
GR: don't know publication status of alt techniques
JS: listed to publish with next round
GR: wanted that draft to go out an dbe commented on before adding appendix,so we don't have discussion on mulitple fronts
MC: push out 2 weeks
<MichaelC> action-28 due 10 June
<trackbot> ACTION-28 - prepare text for SteveF's guidance document about future of data-mining using RDFPic methodology outlined in post to list due date now 10 June
<MichaelC> action-44 due 10 June
<trackbot> ACTION-44 - monitor status of @alt in HTML5 spec; when SteveF's Alt Guidance is published, ensure that what is in SteveF's note supersedes or corrects HTML5 verbiage; propose changes to HTML5 based on SteveF's alt doc due date now 10 June
<scribe> ACTION: 44 to Cynthia to ensure that what's in Steve Notes superscedes spec verbiage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/05/27-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - 44
MC: waiting on same event?
CS: yes, push out 2 weeks
MC: action 20 on Charles on history of col element
<oedipus> CS: wendy waiting on this for summary and table algorithm work
<oedipus> JS: think that is right
CS: Wendy waiting on this.
MC: reasign to wendy to have her follow up with charles
<inserted> scribenick: oedipus
CS: a week - will talk to her today
JS: can you update her on summary so far?
JS: revised restore as was in HTML 4.01 at chairs' suggestion to take pressure off of time constraints so can engineer better
CS: not end of world if old stuff is there
JS: resolved following chair's suggestion, forwarded that
<inserted> scribenick: cyns
remaining actions are part of sub-groups
JS: next topic sub team reports, first canvas
RS: feedback from Apple late last
week. They want to add features to API.
... some group doesnt' agree with for a couple reasons:
... 1) feature creep
... 2) concerns about magnification
... also had some feautres we liked. Sent new draft with new features.
RS: didn't expect new requiremetns this late. it slowed things down, but we have to reach consensus
RS: assuming Apple is happy with
changes, shouldn't take too long to finish. If they want more,
it will take longer.
... haven't heard from Charles.
JS: sent note to Charles. Want
image map proposals, but if the other proposals are ready, we
won't wait. Days not weeks to get proposal in.
... we hope he'll get it done
RS: Apple was waiting until James got back from vacation. I wish I'd known that. Challenge we're having now is that james can't attend Monday calls. Hope we can resolve via email
JS: so, we can't come up with a
new deadline now? Don't know exactly what needs to be done
... decided to wait and include Apple feedback
RS: apple created canvas, so we really wanted their feedback
... but moving forared now
... doesn't think canvas will hold up last call
... moving to media
JF: a couple weeks back we did a
major regroup. had been workign from assumptions, and need to
create list of requirements
... requirements list is now fairly complete. tried really hard to tighted it and cover everything
... broken out by types of disabilities. there are some terms that need clean up, and Judy will be doing this
... types of technologies and system requirements covered
... major thing yesterday, hoping that by EOD or early tomorrow there will be straw poll survey to get feedback on requirements. don't need to be media expert, just understand accessibility. do we have everything, did we miss anything, is it clear?
... once doc is finished, we'll do gap analysis against media work done so far
... those are waiting for this doc.
... other groups have expressed interest in this doc. We're getting our horse in front of the cart now.
... please do the survey
JS: we really want a wide review.
hypertext coordination group discussing week from friday
... htmlwg also very interested
... please do the survey. we're very close to finished, need a sanity check.
RS: all comments in survey? or put them elsewhere?
JF: you can do it in survey with
inline comments, but mail is ok if that's easier for you.
... total of 17 discussion points. Do we have this right? agree yes/no, provide comments
... survey is easier, but any format will be accepted.
RS: Is this wiki public?
JF: survey is task-force restricted
RS: Geoff is aware of the document
JS: document is publicly viewable, but someone outside task force won't be able to fill in survey. have them send email.
<oedipus> JS: survey results and wiki are world-viewable; surveys and wiki content modification limited to TF members
JF: We are particularly looking for a deaf-blind user to give feedback
JS: thanks everyone who worked on
this doc. Great contributions, and I think we'll be pleased
with the results.
... there may be some terms that are used in accessibility that engineers won't understand. we're trying to find ways to define these better
... we hope this doc will live on beyond this task force
<JF> +1 to longer life of Media Accessibility Requirements document
SF: still working on
... rich has started on his, Steve started on his, cynthia started on hers
<oedipus> plus 1 to longer life of Media Accessibility Requirements document
<inserted> scribenick: oedipus
CS: aggressive target date, but
think still ok
... draft but without signoff for target date
... already implemented (most of it) -- have to copy from existing documentation
RS: was to address hixie's table -- that doc isn't going into the HTML5 spec?
CS: don't think so, don't care
RS: would not do that
CS: second gargantuan -- not opposed to it being in spec, as long as in HTML5 document set
RS: not alot of UA devs have done A11y API mappings
CS: safari has mappings, IE has mappings, FF has mapping
RS: concern about "command"
CS: that has always been point of emphasis to document older stuff -- not controversial
SF: what are we intending to produce to modify or replace what is currently in spec in regards to conformance
CS: not sure if we decided on that -- been data collecting so far
RS: hixie's current beef is that there isn't a 1-to-1 mapping for ARIA and says that is problem, but is not, since we want native solutions over ARIA
JS: reminder -- just 4 weeks away
SF: who owns requirements document?
JS: 24 June still target date
RS: have plethora of controls being added -- are they adding more to HTML5 spec
CS: ones that are in there have been there a long time
RS: biggest concern is HTML5
still a moving target -- can't say we are done until spec text
... may be implemented but are not yet supported
... pragmatic view: say something by 24 june, but we will probably log bug against it -- too big
CS: big mapping table with
wraparound text and re-write of override verbiage in HTML5 spec
will be delivered 24 june 2010
... if spec changes, they will change
<inserted> scribenick: cyns
JS: a few points before next
... Steve sent email asking if ARIA title change was ok. we'll do an editorial pass later
... ARIA title chagne do this wekk
SF: will do
JS: new topics coming soon
JS: in April F2F asked Gez Lemon
to look at drag and drop. He has posted
... asked him to join call to discuss. He proposed June 3
<oedipus> plus 1 to sooner rather than later
JS: 10th and 24th ok too. Would prefer to schedule sooner rather that later, next week
<JF> +1 for next week
+1 next week
JS: drag and drop scheduled for
next thursday's meeting. Please read ahead of time and discuss
... 2nd topic, accesskeys. Gregory plans to bring it here in 2-3 weeks
JS: not done with major issues, have at least these 2 left to look at
RS: I found some issues with HTML
5 spec, as did Cytnhia and Steve. What's the venue for getting
those addressed? Is there someone assigned to raise
... for example, both details and the summary button can recieve focus. that's not going to work for mappings. how do we vet those
MS: file a bug
RS: who enters those. who tracks them. I'm concerned about the time to do this
MS: doens't work for me to file
bug for someone, because i don't understand the bug
... hixie will come back with questions
<oedipus> CS: tag with a11y tag, this group will track
MS: use the a11y tag
... this is the group policy
CS: if you tag it a11y, it will get picked up in Laura's report, and tracked by the group
MS: raise a new bug against HTML5 spec
You have to set up a bugzilla account with your email address
JF: wants to follow up with Gregory on accesskey, also has some notes from Charles. will take offline
JS: Laura's report about
... what's a better way to handle these. but we dont' get to it in the call, and people are not up to speed on the actions needed
... we don't get through a lot in a call
... is there a better way to track these?
... identify easy ones?
CS: identify easy ones, and also important ones. maybe have a couple people do it, or schedule a special call
<oedipus> perhaps someone from a time zone that is incovenient can participate by fielding bugs
<oedipus> easy ones, important ones, things actually being implemented
CS: do bugs for 15 minutes at the beinging of the call, maybe not every week
JF: alternate weeks doing bugs and actions
JS: call for participation on email
CS: say in call for participation that it can happen all in email, no call required
JS: make recommendations on things that are easy, can be closed, which are important and need to get addressed by the group
CS: when we do bugs on teh call, we can do in priority order based on feedback of sub-grou[
JS: no Monday Canvas subgroup call, all other meetings on normal schedule next week
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