HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference -- 27 May 2010

<oedipus> happy venerable bede's day (catholic observance) http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/obfuscation.html#may27

<oedipus> happy belated venerable bede's day (anglican observance) http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/obfuscation.html#may25

<oedipus> venerable bede is credited with conceiving the footnote

<MichaelC> trackbot, start meeting

<trackbot> Date: 27 May 2010

<oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

<janina> Meeting: HTML-A11Y telecon

<janina> agenda: this

<janina> +Business

<oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

<oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open

action items review

<cyns> action items review

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - items

<inserted> scribenick: cyns

Action 28 on Gregory on future of datamining

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - 28

GR: don't know publication status of alt techniques

JS: listed to publish with next round

GR: wanted that draft to go out an dbe commented on before adding appendix,so we don't have discussion on mulitple fronts

MC: push out 2 weeks

GR: ok

<MichaelC> action-28 due 10 June

<trackbot> ACTION-28 - prepare text for SteveF's guidance document about future of data-mining using RDFPic methodology outlined in post to list due date now 10 June

<MichaelC> action-44 due 10 June

<trackbot> ACTION-44 - monitor status of @alt in HTML5 spec; when SteveF's Alt Guidance is published, ensure that what is in SteveF's note supersedes or corrects HTML5 verbiage; propose changes to HTML5 based on SteveF's alt doc due date now 10 June

<scribe> ACTION: 44 to Cynthia to ensure that what's in Steve Notes superscedes spec verbiage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/05/27-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - 44

MC: waiting on same event?

CS: yes, push out 2 weeks

MC: action 20 on Charles on history of col element

<oedipus> CS: wendy waiting on this for summary and table algorithm work

<oedipus> JS: think that is right

CS: Wendy waiting on this.

MC: reasign to wendy to have her follow up with charles

<inserted> scribenick: oedipus

MC: deadline?

CS: a week - will talk to her today

JS: can you update her on summary so far?

CS: yes

JS: revised restore as was in HTML 4.01 at chairs' suggestion to take pressure off of time constraints so can engineer better

CS: not end of world if old stuff is there

JS: resolved following chair's suggestion, forwarded that

<inserted> scribenick: cyns

remaining actions are part of sub-groups

Canvas, Media, & ARIA Subteam Updates

JS: next topic sub team reports, first canvas

RS: feedback from Apple late last week. They want to add features to API.
... some group doesnt' agree with for a couple reasons:
... 1) feature creep
... 2) concerns about magnification
... also had some feautres we liked. Sent new draft with new features.

<oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010May/0172.html

RS: didn't expect new requiremetns this late. it slowed things down, but we have to reach consensus

<oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-canvas-api/2010AprJun/att-0015/2dcontext10-Apr-11.html

RS: assuming Apple is happy with changes, shouldn't take too long to finish. If they want more, it will take longer.
... haven't heard from Charles.

JS: sent note to Charles. Want image map proposals, but if the other proposals are ready, we won't wait. Days not weeks to get proposal in.
... we hope he'll get it done

RS: Apple was waiting until James got back from vacation. I wish I'd known that. Challenge we're having now is that james can't attend Monday calls. Hope we can resolve via email

JS: so, we can't come up with a new deadline now? Don't know exactly what needs to be done again?
... decided to wait and include Apple feedback

RS: apple created canvas, so we really wanted their feedback

JS: communications breakdown
... but moving forared now
... doesn't think canvas will hold up last call
... moving to media

<oedipus> http://www.w3.org/2010/05/26-html-a11y-minutes.html

<oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI

<JF> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements

JF: a couple weeks back we did a major regroup. had been workign from assumptions, and need to create list of requirements
... requirements list is now fairly complete. tried really hard to tighted it and cover everything
... broken out by types of disabilities. there are some terms that need clean up, and Judy will be doing this
... types of technologies and system requirements covered
... major thing yesterday, hoping that by EOD or early tomorrow there will be straw poll survey to get feedback on requirements. don't need to be media expert, just understand accessibility. do we have everything, did we miss anything, is it clear?
... once doc is finished, we'll do gap analysis against media work done so far
... those are waiting for this doc.
... other groups have expressed interest in this doc. We're getting our horse in front of the cart now.
... please do the survey

JS: we really want a wide review. hypertext coordination group discussing week from friday
... htmlwg also very interested
... please do the survey. we're very close to finished, need a sanity check.

RS: all comments in survey? or put them elsewhere?

JF: you can do it in survey with inline comments, but mail is ok if that's easier for you.
... total of 17 discussion points. Do we have this right? agree yes/no, provide comments
... survey is easier, but any format will be accepted.

RS: Is this wiki public?

JF: survey is task-force restricted

RS: Geoff is aware of the document

<oedipus> Media Accessibility Requirements (please review!)

JS: document is publicly viewable, but someone outside task force won't be able to fill in survey. have them send email.

<oedipus> JS: survey results and wiki are world-viewable; surveys and wiki content modification limited to TF members

JF: We are particularly looking for a deaf-blind user to give feedback

JS: thanks everyone who worked on this doc. Great contributions, and I think we'll be pleased with the results.
... there may be some terms that are used in accessibility that engineers won't understand. we're trying to find ways to define these better
... we hope this doc will live on beyond this task force

<JF> +1 to longer life of Media Accessibility Requirements document

SF: still working on mappings
... rich has started on his, Steve started on his, cynthia started on hers

<oedipus> plus 1 to longer life of Media Accessibility Requirements document

<inserted> scribenick: oedipus

CS: aggressive target date, but think still ok
... draft but without signoff for target date
... already implemented (most of it) -- have to copy from existing documentation

RS: was to address hixie's table -- that doc isn't going into the HTML5 spec?

CS: don't think so, don't care

RS: would not do that

CS: second gargantuan -- not opposed to it being in spec, as long as in HTML5 document set

RS: not alot of UA devs have done A11y API mappings

CS: safari has mappings, IE has mappings, FF has mapping

RS: concern about "command"

CS: that has always been point of emphasis to document older stuff -- not controversial

SF: what are we intending to produce to modify or replace what is currently in spec in regards to conformance

CS: not sure if we decided on that -- been data collecting so far

RS: hixie's current beef is that there isn't a 1-to-1 mapping for ARIA and says that is problem, but is not, since we want native solutions over ARIA

JS: reminder -- just 4 weeks away

SF: who owns requirements document?

CS: rich

JS: 24 June still target date

RS: have plethora of controls being added -- are they adding more to HTML5 spec

CS: ones that are in there have been there a long time

RS: biggest concern is HTML5 still a moving target -- can't say we are done until spec text correct/analyzed
... may be implemented but are not yet supported
... pragmatic view: say something by 24 june, but we will probably log bug against it -- too big

CS: big mapping table with wraparound text and re-write of override verbiage in HTML5 spec will be delivered 24 june 2010
... if spec changes, they will change

<inserted> scribenick: cyns

JS: a few points before next topic
... Steve sent email asking if ARIA title change was ok. we'll do an editorial pass later
... ARIA title chagne do this wekk

SF: will do

New Topics for the TF's Consideration

JS: new topics coming soon

<janina> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010May/0179.html

JS: in April F2F asked Gez Lemon to look at drag and drop. He has posted
... asked him to join call to discuss. He proposed June 3

<oedipus> plus 1 to sooner rather than later

<MikeSmith> yeah

JS: 10th and 24th ok too. Would prefer to schedule sooner rather that later, next week

<JF> +1 for next week

+1 next week

JS: drag and drop scheduled for next thursday's meeting. Please read ahead of time and discuss on list
... 2nd topic, accesskeys. Gregory plans to bring it here in 2-3 weeks

<oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2010May/att-0020/access-element-20100519.html

<oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2010May/0020.html

JS: not done with major issues, have at least these 2 left to look at

Bug Reporting & Processing

RS: I found some issues with HTML 5 spec, as did Cytnhia and Steve. What's the venue for getting those addressed? Is there someone assigned to raise issues
... for example, both details and the summary button can recieve focus. that's not going to work for mappings. how do we vet those

MS: file a bug

RS: who enters those. who tracks them. I'm concerned about the time to do this

MS: doens't work for me to file bug for someone, because i don't understand the bug report
... hixie will come back with questions

<oedipus> CS: tag with a11y tag, this group will track

MS: use the a11y tag
... this is the group policy

<MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/

CS: if you tag it a11y, it will get picked up in Laura's report, and tracked by the group

<Stevef> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/enter_bug.cgi?product=HTML%20WG&component=HTML5%20spec%20%28editor%3A%20Ian%20Hickson%29&priority=P3

MS: raise a new bug against HTML5 spec

You have to set up a bugzilla account with your email address

JF: wants to follow up with Gregory on accesskey, also has some notes from Charles. will take offline

JS: Laura's report about bugzilla
... what's a better way to handle these. but we dont' get to it in the call, and people are not up to speed on the actions needed
... we don't get through a lot in a call
... is there a better way to track these?
... identify easy ones?

CS: identify easy ones, and also important ones. maybe have a couple people do it, or schedule a special call

<oedipus> perhaps someone from a time zone that is incovenient can participate by fielding bugs

<oedipus> easy ones, important ones, things actually being implemented

CS: do bugs for 15 minutes at the beinging of the call, maybe not every week

JF: alternate weeks doing bugs and actions

JS: call for participation on email

CS: say in call for participation that it can happen all in email, no call required

JS: make recommendations on things that are easy, can be closed, which are important and need to get addressed by the group

CS: when we do bugs on teh call, we can do in priority order based on feedback of sub-grou[

<oedipus> fyi: https://wiki.mozilla.org/Accessibility/RichContentKeyboardBehaviour

JS: no Monday Canvas subgroup call, all other meetings on normal schedule next week

- DRAFT -

HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

27 May 2010

Attendees

Contents

action items review

Canvas, Media, & ARIA Subteam Updates

New Topics for the TF's Consideration

Bug Reporting & Processing

Summary of Action Items

Scribe.perl diagnostic output