See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 06 May 2010
<scribe> scribenick: adrianba
<scribe> scribe: adrianba
<rubys> action-178?
<trackbot> ACTION-178 -- Philippe Le Hégaret to contact the various chairs/co-chairs to resolve the use of the text/html mime type -- due 2010-04-29 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/178
<pimpbot> Title: ACTION-178 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
plh: will do this tomorrow
... at hypertext cg
<rubys> action-179?
<trackbot> ACTION-179 -- Philippe Le Hégaret to set automatic copy of HG to www.w3.org -- due 2010-04-27 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/179
<pimpbot> Title: ACTION-179 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
plh: this one is part of testing
TF - should be end of may
... reported this to TF on Tues
<scribe> ...in progress
<rubys> action-179 due may 27
<trackbot> ACTION-179 Set automatic copy of HG to www.w3.org due date now may 27
<rubys> issue-27?
<trackbot> ISSUE-27 -- @rel value ownership, registry consideration -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/27
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-27 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
rubys: seem to still be waiting
on iesg
... any updates?
julian: i think iesq will happen
shortly
... issues have been resolved - need ok of area director
... then be added to rfc editor queue
<pimpbot> Title: HTML5: Techniques for the provision of text alternatives (at dev.w3.org)
julian: that being said, if ppl
want to volunteer to test then now would be a good time
... delaying any further doesn't help - it's a matter of days
away
rubys: do they have something they can test now?
julian: no but it will be soon so we should encourage people to think about what they want to do now
rubys: we do have volunteers, not
sure what their plans are
... once there is something to test, if nothing happens we can
do something then
<rubys> issue-82?
<trackbot> ISSUE-82 -- Suggested replacement for head/@profile does not provide for disambiguation -- CLOSED
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/82
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-82 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> issue-81?
<trackbot> ISSUE-81 -- Offline Web Applications section should use the term "representation" instead of "resource" -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/81
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-81 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
rubys: current status is if
people find issues they should open bugs
... no reason to keep this open?
<rubys> close issue-81
<trackbot> ISSUE-81 Offline Web Applications section should use the term "representation" instead of "resource" closed
rubys: no objections, closing the issue
<rubys> issue-81: people who note remaining discrepancies are encouraged to open bugs
<trackbot> ISSUE-81 Offline Web Applications section should use the term "representation" instead of "resource" notes added
<rubys> issue-90
<rubys> issue-90?
<trackbot> ISSUE-90 -- Tighten the focus and allowable content in the figure element -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/90
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-90 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> issue-91?
<trackbot> ISSUE-91 -- Re-focus and tighten definition of the aside element -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/91
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-91 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> issue-93?
<trackbot> ISSUE-93 -- Delete Details Element -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/93
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-93 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> issue-95?
<trackbot> ISSUE-95 -- Remove/Discard the Hidden Attribute -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/95
<rubys> issue-96?
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-95 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<trackbot> ISSUE-96 -- Remove/Discard the Progress Element -- OPEN
<rubys> issue-97?
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/96
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-96 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<trackbot> ISSUE-97 -- Remove/Discard the Meter Element -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/97
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-97 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
rubys: on issues
90,91,93,95,96,97 - for each of these issues there is a
counterproposal
... this is being discussed but no convergence yet
... likely to go to a survey
... any comments?
<rubys> issue-106?
<trackbot> ISSUE-106 -- Return the concept of Obsolete but conforming back to using obsolete and deprecated -- RAISED
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/106
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-106 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
rubys: we have not got any
volunteers for issue 106
... if no one wants this now we will close without
prejudice
<rubys> close issue-106
<trackbot> ISSUE-106 Return the concept of Obsolete but conforming back to using obsolete and deprecated closed
rubys: okay, closing
<rubys> issue-106: closed without prejudice, as nobody has volunteered to write a change proposal
<trackbot> ISSUE-106 Return the concept of Obsolete but conforming back to using obsolete and deprecated notes added
rubys: mjs dropped off the
call
... he did post resolutions to all bugs except 8895
(FPWD)
... this will be addressed by the time we get to the next
FPWD
... if you have any interest in these, please look at the
individual bugs
mjs: one bug in particular i
would like comments on
... the one that proposes a consistent system for bugzilla
resolutions
<MikeSmith> bug 9284
<pimpbot> 11http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=9284 mjs@apple.com, P2, REOPENED, 13Consider giving guidelines for use of different bug resolutions
mjs: there is a specific proposal
there, there have been a couple of comments
... would like to make sure we end up with something
reasonable
MikeSmith: there is a comment
from Henri there
... I can add a comment there as someone editing a
document
... would be good to get others editing to add comments
there
rubys: anything else?
mjs: that's all
rubys: none
<rubys> issue-85?
<trackbot> ISSUE-85 -- ARIA roles added to the a element should be conforming in HTML5 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/85
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-85 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> issue-101?
<trackbot> ISSUE-101 -- Spec reference for US-ASCII -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/101
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-101 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> issue-105?
<trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- allow image maps on the canvas element -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/105
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-105 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
rubys: 3 that are calls for
counter proposals - will correct mistake in call after
meeting
... any questions?
Mike: I thought we had more time on this?
rubys: we have proposals, there is a call for counter proposals - ppl will have time after they volunteer
cyns: issue 85 was discussing in TF this morning
janina: it will be news that we
agreed for june 24
... we spent a lot of the call discussing trying to bring in
earlier
... but we think this is appropriate for a clean and precise
suggestion
... there is now an active group - chance they will beat the
deadline but everyone comfortable with the deadline
... canvas map we are waiting for chaals
... caret proposal is needing dev feedback from msft and
apple
... actions taken to ping people that need to provide
feedback
... may need to slip into june because of lack of feedback
rubys: obviously lots of work to
do on canvas
... is the map proposal not ready yet?
janina: not sure which this is
<rubys> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/addimagemaptocanvas
<pimpbot> Title: ChangeProposals/addimagemaptocanvas - HTML WG Wiki (at www.w3.org)
rubys: issue 105 on the status proposal page
janina: we have an action on
chaals to provide more spec ready text
... we would like to hold on that a couple more weeks
... he took that action in april
<JF> don't want to speak for Chaals or SteveF, but I beleive that Steve *did* write that up on Chaal's behalf
mjs: this isn't a final deadline for proposals - call for counter proposals doesn't cut anyone off
janina: okay, my misunderstanding
rubys: you'd rather 85 not proceed?
<rubys> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/ARIAonanchor
<pimpbot> Title: ChangeProposals/ARIAonanchor - HTML WG Wiki (at www.w3.org)
janina: yes, i think we don't
want to move forward until misunderstandings resolved
... we want to be very clear about definitions and what is
included
... in the past there has been misunderstanding
cyns: clear and systematic
... instead of list of roles that can override, point to a
piece of tree of related elements
... so it is clear why certain overrides are allowed
... so both to be more clear and more logical and
understandable
... we're making good progress
Laura: should this be separate from other aria work
rubys: this was received in feb,
once the discussion dies down we give people opportunity to
counter proposal
... perhaps steve could withdraw is proposal
janina: if that was on steve then
perhaps
... think at that point he was acting individually
... we didn't have this level of organisation
cyns: we concluded that
individually wasn't the best way to work
... don't think we have another issue to track the work
rubys: my preference is specific feedback should have bugs
Laura: this does have a bug
rubys: true, nothing prevents new bugs
cyns: true, but we need work to figure out what those bugs are
rubys: janina, will you speak to steve about this
janina: sure
... that does beg the question about how we want to deal with
all aria mapping
rubys: not proposing to close
issue
... think it's confusing to have a proposal on the table when
you don't want to proceed
... would like to get this withdrawn
janina: i will talk with him
rubys: last time we got off topic comments
<rubys> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010May/0052.html
<pimpbot> Title: Preparing for Surveys - Ground Rules from Sam Ruby on 2010-05-05 (public-html@w3.org from May 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
rubys: this time we will do more
to enforce scope of survey
... two that we're considering
<rubys> Issue-66?
<trackbot> ISSUE-66 -- image analysis heuristics -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/66
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-66 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
<rubys> Issue-88?
<trackbot> ISSUE-88 -- Should meta/@content allow a list of languages instead of just a single language? -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/88
<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-88 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
rubys: think we're reading on
issue 66
... still some last minute tweaks on 88 - will give people a
few more days
... for example, new proposal and more discussion ongoing
... any discussion?
rubys: none
<pimpbot> Title: 4.8.6 The video element HTML 5 (at dev.w3.org)
<pimpbot> Title: 4.8.6 The video element HTML 5 (at dev.w3.org)
<Zakim> MikeSmith, you wanted to ask about CFC for FPWD publication of http://dev.w3.org/html5/alt-techniques/ (as part of next round of heartbeat publications?) and to comment about a11y
<pimpbot> Title: HTML5: Techniques for the provision of text alternatives (at dev.w3.org)
<pimpbot> Title: 4.8.6 The video element HTML 5 (at dev.w3.org)
<pimpbot> Title: 4.8.6 The video element HTML 5 (at dev.w3.org)
MikeSmith: steve working on document for some time on guidance for alt text for images
<Laura> http://dev.w3.org/html5/alt-techniques/
<pimpbot> Title: HTML5: Techniques for the provision of text alternatives (at dev.w3.org)
MikeSmith: he would like for that
doc to be considered for FPWD publication
... would like to bring this to attention of chairs
... would need call for consensus on that
... speaking for the a11y tf, we'd like this to be published
alongside the next heartbeat publications
rubys: noted, will add it to list
of tracked docs
... can this be on public-html
MikeSmith: we'll get that done
rubys: now would be an appropriate time with discussion of other docs
<rubys> docs: HTML5,HTML+RDFa, HTML Microdata, HTML Canvas 2D Context, HTML: The Markup Language, HTML5 diffs from HTML4, HTML/XHTML Compatibility Authoring Guidelines
<pimpbot> Title: HTML Weekly Teleconference -- 06 May 2010 (at www.w3.org)
plh: just reading e-mail about this - my concern is that for next round of publication we might start get objections because of captioning format being out of scope for the WG
MikeSmith: yes, we had discussion
about WebSRT on TF call
... we will get objections about WebSRT
plh: not just because it is in
the HTML5 spec but because it isn't in scope for WG
... might be hard to argue that this is in scope
<Laura> http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/video.html#websrt
<pimpbot> Title: 4.8.6 The video element HTML 5 (at dev.w3.org)
plh: relatively new to group
<dsinger> it seems that the 'it' is the captioning format SRT
rubys: please open bugs
<plh> david, correct
janina: think the hope might be
to possible to avoid this process until requirements
determined
... consternation in media sub-group and main tf that this kind
of text adds to the work load of the tf
... when people know we are already working on this and in
process of providing input
... concerned not following good w3c process
... tf want to object
rubys: we have a decision
process, we should follow it - that starts with a bug
... bug could be rip out the following because it's not ready
yet
... not taking a position on the topic - just saying that if
this is known as an issue let's have someone write up the
bug
janina: i'm going to find someone to open the bug
rubys: thanks
plh: i'm reluctant to open bug because i will be part of process to resolve
rubys: bug will require ian to
say why he wants to leave it
... he will provide the rationale
janina: concern is meanwhile
while it is there people will start to build
... felt to be unfortunate on the part of people in the tf
including developers
rubys: encourage you not to wait
dsinger: very quickly, not sure
what the concern is
... don't think we can mandate srt
... anyone that implements text captioning will do srt because
of the content out there
<JF> not talking about SRT, but rather WebSRT
dsinger: not sure why we should have a debate on srt
plh: problem is defining srt in html5
dsinger: why would we want to do that?
plh: what is in the spec not only defines srt but also extensions to srt
dsinger: okay i missed that
<Laura> 4.8.10.11 WebSRT
<Laura> http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/video.html#websrt
<pimpbot> Title: 4.8.6 The video element HTML 5 (at dev.w3.org)
plh: my concerns is that from the scope of the group, will have a hard time justifying this being in scope
dsinger: i agree, i don't think it is
mattmay: there has been a
subgroup dedicated to filling this hole
... the editor knows this work is going on
... difference between filing a bug against something already
there and adding text while work is going on
<JF> +1 with Matt
mattmay: unfortunate that this happened this way
plh: don't think anyone is making technical judgement on websrt
rubys: people are concerned about
process
... if people want to remove it that might be fine - we just
want to document this - we might need to change decision
process
... start with a bug
... does everyone understand how to proceed?
janina: i'm clear and i agree with your last statement
rubys: this was about document publishing candidates
<pimpbot> planet: Getting ready for learn html5 <11http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2782582/getting-ready-for-learn-html5> 4** Web 2.0 Expo Browser Panel <11http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/ajaxian/~3/h-vyMw2Vt6g/web-2-0-expo-browser-panel>
rubys: anything else on this?
rubys: anything else to talk about?
<pimpbot> Title: HTML Weekly Teleconference -- 06 May 2010 (at www.w3.org)
rubys: i will volunteer
rubys: meeting adjourned, thanks everyone
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