eGovernment Interest Group Teleconference

29 Apr 2010


See also: IRC log




<trackbot> Date: 29 April 2010

<cygri> nice. thanks mhausenblas!

<cygri> Scribe: edsu

that's dc area

ww: are you on the call?

<PaulZH> I'm also calling IP

<vassilios> vassilios also on IP phone


cygri: agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010Apr/0084.html
... we'll have a presentation from martin of ctic, and hopefully one from li ding of rpi
... time permitting i'd like to talk about the scope and deliverables of the group
... and hopefully write those down on the wiki


<cygri> wiki page: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/Datos_de_Asturias

martin: here at ctic we develop an open data solution in spain, a good proof of concept of the linked data solution
... here you can see some metadata based on the VoID and Dublin Core vocabularies
... you can see license and provenance information, and the available data formats
... the generation of the catalog is using sparql and xslt

<martin> http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/CTIC_Dataset_List

martin: we have a list of catalogs (a meta catalog)
... similar to the deri dcat approach, title, description, license

<martin> http://datos.fundacionctic.org/sandbox/catalog/feeds/catalogs_en.rss

<martin> http://datos.fundacionctic.org/sandbox/catalog/map.html.en

martin: also have a rss feed of the catalogs, which is used to geenrate a map of the catalogs

cygri: you have used void for the data catalog, are the datasets in the catalog all available as rdf? this is not the case for most catalogs (e.g. data.gov)
... do you think it makes sense to use void when the dataset is not rdf?

martin: i think void is by definition only for rdf data sets ... so i think no?

cygri: that's what void was made for originally, but it possibly could be applied in a broader scope ... but i take your answer as saying you'd only use it for rdf data sets?

martin: i think void could be useful


cygri: do we have a new attendee from dc?
... ok, it's brandt from epa in washington

bobbin: i'm on the call too

<DavidJames> LuigiMontanez and I are sharing a conference phone

<bobbin> Bobbin Teegarden, semantic consultant in Seattle

cygri: seems like Li isn't going to make the call


cygri: there wasn't a clear consensus at the end of the last call, about defining an abstract vocabulary about the data you find in catalogs, and then we could have several different documents that explain how you could use these terms in a concrete syntax: rdf/xml, rdfa, atom, etc
... a couple of points were raised on the mailing list
... erik suggested we should be clear about the types of serices we want to enable
... so that's where i would like to pick up

<DavidJames> we're getting a lot of echo and delay on the line

cygri: i sent an email http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010Apr/0083.html
... one deliverable might be use cases and requirements
... a second thing could be an rdf vocabulary and reference that lists the terms, which required/optional, examples
... it would make sense to use some sort of formalism, uml, or perhaps rdf schema, since it will give us one possible way of deploying dcat data
... in the email the choice of concrete format maybe we should not decide on this yet ... if we have some clear requirements for using syndication formats for example ; or if we can do everything with rdfa -- it's hard to say before we know what requirements we have
... do you think we could delay the decision about the concrete format until we do use cases requuirements?

<PaulZH> I do agree to postpone the decision

edsu: i agree in principle, but it will take more time

<LI_DING> hi

<LI_DING> li is joining

LI_DING: we're reviewing cygri's proposal at http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010Apr/0083.html

cygri: i think by writing down use cases and requirements we'll get a better understanding about technical choices

LI_DING: what is the current status, discussion the requirements?

cygri: yes, basically we're discussing whether we should abstract out of the concrete syntax, and write use cases and requirements
... there doesn't seem to be a lot of disagreement or agreement with this

LI_DING: i want to hear more voices first i think

<DavidJames> Regarding http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2010Apr/0083.html ... I like the list of requirements.

<DavidJames> The deliverables also look good to me.

LI_DING: i'd need more time to review the proposal, but i think we want to keep things as minimal as possible to get something out there quick, also i think we should keep use cases simple, how much do we want to get?
... we should try to produce something actionable

cygri: i don't hear any strong objection to moving forwards with the deliverables i outlined in the email ; for now we should continue working with this assumption

<LI_DING> one thing could be a challenge

<DavidJames> Can we ask everyone to vote (or something similar)?

LI_DING: maybe we can have a challenge a deliverable: how many gov't data sets can you find?
... lets grow the number of government data sets, more people using the vocabulary

cygri: but what does this mean for the format we want to design?

<vassilios> i think it is not a matter of number of datasets but number of catalogues

LI_DING: it's a parallel effort: one side we grow the datasets, and on the other we develop the terminology, vocabulary that can be used

cygri: DavidJames you asked whether we should do a vote, i'm not sure what point this would serve
... since there doesn't seem to be any strong disagreement

DavidJames: i think it would be nice to hear the agreement

cygri: i think this is something i'd like to do on the next call, rather than rushing it
... to make sure there is enough time

Use Cases

cygri: we want to have use case or stories for what people want to be able to do: for example i want to be able to get a list of datasets from data.gov that are not supported by the current data.gov user interface
... i'd be interested to hear about what use cases people on the call have
... for standard formats for data catalogs

vassilios: i'd like to be able to query multiple catalogs, to be able to query other geographic regions

<vassilios> cross-catalogue querying

cygri: so you want to be able to federate national catalogs into say a european union catalog?

vassilios: yes

<george> (fed/state/local) gov agency independently published catalog using (some set of standard) vocab for dynamic aggregation of catalogs

<george> would like to see bottom up (as per Li - in use) drive basic (extensible) rdfs vocab convergence for w3c blessing

DavidJames: for the nationaldatacatalog we'd like to consume data from other data catalogs, we'd like to have one uniform way of getting at catalog data
... for municipalities and state governments we'd like to do a similar thing, enabling federation across many levels

george: i think i share the interest that david and luigi have ; would be great to have some sort of vocabulary at the w3c that reflects what's in use as much as possible

cygri: agreed

martin: i think federation is soemthing i would like to do ; i agree with vassilios with his approach

<LI_DING> I was dropped from the call

cygri: it might be a good next step to draft this use case as a little document, to sketch how it could look in practice as a story

<vassilios> i could help on this

cygri: there are a couple of other use cases on the mailing list, maybe we can get those into written form too

<vassilios> OK

<vassilios> and i thin kit is more or less the same whether we speak about EU or USA

cygri: would be great if you could start it, and we could see if other use cases are covered

<scribe> ACTION: vassilios to document a federation use case for dcat [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/04/29-egov-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Could not create new action (unparseable data in server response: No child element named 'id') - please contact sysreq with the details of what happened.

<george> +1

<LuigiMontanez> yes, I have access

<LuigiMontanez> +1

<DavidJames> +1


<martin> +1

<fadi> +1

cygri: wiki is ok?

<cygri> http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/Use_Cases_and_Requirements

cygri: great, there is a page where i've copy pasted stuff from the email, i propose we add subsections there, use this as a live document
... so that's it for this week, thank you all for joining in

<DavidJames> thanks

<george> thank you cygri

<cygri> thanks all!

<LuigiMontanez> thank you cygri, edsu for transcribing

<vassilios> thank you!

<george> thanks edsu

np: -)

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: vassilios to document a federation use case for dcat [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/04/29-egov-minutes.html#action01]
[End of minutes]

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WARNING: No "Present: ... " found!
Possibly Present: LI_DING LuigiMontanez P3 P7 P8 PaulZH aaaa aacc aaee aaff aagg bobbin brand cygri davidjames edsu fadi george hughb jonphipps lindstream martin mhausenblas n8fr8__ sandro trackbot vassilios ww
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        <dbooth> Present+ amy

Agenda: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Data_Catalog_Vocabulary/2010-04-29
Found Date: 29 Apr 2010
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2010/04/29-egov-minutes.html
People with action items: vassilios

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