SPARQL Working Group Teleconference

Minutes of 14 December 2010

Agenda
http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2010-12-14
Seen
Alexandre Passant, Andy Seaborne, Axel Polleres, Birte Glimm, Carlos Buil Aranda, Chimezie Ogbuji, Gregory Williams, Lee Feigenbaum, Matthew Perry, Nicholas Humfrey, Olivier Corby, Paul Gearon, Sandro Hawke, Souripriya Das, Steve Harris
Regrets
Lee Feigenbaum, Steve Harris
Chair
Axel Polleres
Scribe
Birte Glimm
IRC Log
Original and Editable Wiki Version
Resolutions

None.

Topics
14:52:06 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/12/14-sparql-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/12/14-sparql-irc

14:52:23 <AxelPolleres> Zakim, this will be SPARQL

Axel Polleres: Zakim, this will be SPARQL

14:52:23 <Zakim> ok, AxelPolleres; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, AxelPolleres; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes

14:57:22 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started

14:57:29 <Zakim> +??P5

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P5

14:57:42 <cbuilara> Zakim, ??P5 is me

Carlos Buil Aranda: Zakim, ??P5 is me

14:57:42 <Zakim> +cbuilara; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +cbuilara; got it

14:58:20 <Zakim> +??P10

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P10

14:58:33 <NickH> Zakim, ??P10 is me

Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, ??P10 is me

14:58:33 <Zakim> +NickH; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +NickH; got it

14:58:54 <Zakim> +OlivierCorby

Zakim IRC Bot: +OlivierCorby

14:59:27 <Zakim> +kasei

Zakim IRC Bot: +kasei

15:00:03 <AxelPolleres> trackbot, start meeting

Axel Polleres: trackbot, start meeting

15:00:05 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world

15:00:07 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 77277

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be 77277

15:00:07 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start now

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start now

15:00:08 <trackbot> Meeting: SPARQL Working Group Teleconference
15:00:08 <trackbot> Date: 14 December 2010
15:00:20 <bglimm> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Birte Glimm: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:00:21 <AxelPolleres> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Axel Polleres: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:00:23 <Zakim> I notice SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has restarted

Zakim IRC Bot: I notice SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has restarted

15:00:24 <Zakim> On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, Sandro

15:00:25 <Zakim> On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, Sandro

15:00:26 <Zakim> +??P18

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P18

15:00:33 <AndyS> zakim, PP18 is me

Andy Seaborne: zakim, PP18 is me

15:00:33 <Zakim> sorry, AndyS, I do not recognize a party named 'PP18'

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, AndyS, I do not recognize a party named 'PP18'

15:00:40 <AndyS> zakim, P18 is me

Andy Seaborne: zakim, P18 is me

15:00:40 <Zakim> sorry, AndyS, I do not recognize a party named 'P18'

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, AndyS, I do not recognize a party named 'P18'

15:00:44 <Zakim> +AxelPolleres

Zakim IRC Bot: +AxelPolleres

15:00:44 <Zakim> +Chimezie_Ogbuji

Zakim IRC Bot: +Chimezie_Ogbuji

15:00:50 <AndyS> zakim, ??P18 is me

Andy Seaborne: zakim, ??P18 is me

15:00:50 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS; got it

15:01:05 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me

15:01:05 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

15:01:16 <Zakim> +MattPerry

Zakim IRC Bot: +MattPerry

15:01:17 <Zakim> -Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro

15:01:25 <bglimm> Zakim, who am I?

Birte Glimm: Zakim, who am I?

15:01:27 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, bglimm.

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand your question, bglimm.

15:01:45 <bglimm> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Birte Glimm: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:01:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, AndyS, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji (muted), MattPerry

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, AndyS, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji (muted), MattPerry

15:01:59 <Zakim> + +1.617.489.aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.617.489.aaaa

15:02:08 <sandro> zakim, +1.617.489.aaaa is Sandr

Sandro Hawke: zakim, +1.617.489.aaaa is Sandr

15:02:22 <Zakim> +Sandr; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandr; got it

15:02:27 <sandro> zakim, Sandr is Sandro

Sandro Hawke: zakim, Sandr is Sandro

15:02:29 <AxelPolleres> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Axel Polleres: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:02:40 <Zakim> +Sandro; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro; got it

15:02:43 <AxelPolleres> ack AxelPolleres

Axel Polleres: ack AxelPolleres

15:02:47 <Zakim> On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, AndyS, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji (muted), MattPerry, Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, AndyS, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji (muted), MattPerry, Sandro

15:02:50 <AxelPolleres> q-

Axel Polleres: q-

15:02:54 <AxelPolleres> q?

Axel Polleres: q?

15:02:57 <Zakim> +pgearon

Zakim IRC Bot: +pgearon

15:04:10 <AxelPolleres> agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2010-12-14
15:04:16 <AxelPolleres> chair: axel Polleres
15:04:27 <Zakim> +bglimm; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +bglimm; got it

15:04:45 <AxelPolleres> scribe: Birte Glimm

(Scribe set to Birte Glimm)

15:05:01 <AxelPolleres> PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2010-12-07

PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2010-12-07

15:05:01 <bglimm> Topic: Admin

1. Admin

15:05:31 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Any comments?

Axel Polleres: Any comments?

15:05:35 <NickH> missing the word Agenda

Nicholas Humfrey: missing the word Agenda

15:05:39 <chimezie> "Sorry, Not Found"

Chimezie Ogbuji: "Sorry, Not Found"

15:05:45 <bglimm> Chimezie: I don't get any minutes there.

Chimezie Ogbuji: I don't get any minutes there.

15:06:22 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: I'll check and we approve them next time

Axel Polleres: I'll check and we approve them next time

15:06:30 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: axel to check minutes from  last time

ACTION: axel to check minutes from last time

15:06:30 <trackbot> Created ACTION-342 - Check minutes from  last time [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-342 - Check minutes from last time [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

15:06:44 <bglimm> Topic: Comments

2. Comments

15:07:00 <sandro> (the IRC log isnt even on the wiki where it should be at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Chatlog_2010-12-07 )

Sandro Hawke: (the IRC log isnt even on the wiki where it should be at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Chatlog_2010-12-07 )

15:07:10 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Please try to get comments approved and send

Axel Polleres: Please try to get comments approved and send

15:07:40 <bglimm> ... next meeting in a week

... next meeting in a week

15:07:57 <bglimm> ... Olivier is next on the scribe list

... Olivier is next on the scribe list

15:08:12 <bglimm> Olivier: I am not sure I can attend next week

Olivier Corby: I am not sure I can attend next week

15:08:37 <bglimm> Topic: Report from the protocol teleconf

3. Report from the protocol teleconf

15:09:11 <AxelPolleres> summary is http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Protocol plus the minutes at http://www.w3.org/2010/12/08-sparql-minutes.html

Axel Polleres: summary is http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Protocol plus the minutes at http://www.w3.org/2010/12/08-sparql-minutes.html

15:09:15 <bglimm> Greg: We talked about 5 issues

Gregory Williams: We talked about 5 issues

15:09:34 <bglimm> ... first content format for update request

... first content format for update request

15:10:00 <bglimm> .... a) string with key-value pairs or b) a raw format with appropriate media type

.... a) string with key-value pairs or b) a raw format with appropriate media type

15:10:23 <Zakim> -AndyS

Zakim IRC Bot: -AndyS

15:10:24 <AxelPolleres> alex, can u scribe next week?

Axel Polleres: alex, can u scribe next week?

15:10:31 <bglimm> ... ability to pass extra arguments like the default dataset

... ability to pass extra arguments like the default dataset

15:10:45 <Zakim> +AlexPassant

Zakim IRC Bot: +AlexPassant

15:10:47 <bglimm> ... and how that can be done

... and how that can be done

15:10:51 <AndyS> zakim, why did you cut me off?

Andy Seaborne: zakim, why did you cut me off?

15:10:51 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, AndyS.

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand your question, AndyS.

15:10:59 <AlexPassant> AxelPolleres: no I have to send regrets for next week sorry

Axel Polleres: no I have to send regrets for next week sorry [ Scribe Assist by Alexandre Passant ]

15:11:02 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller]

15:11:04 <bglimm> ... we'll add a note to the doc to ask for feedback

... we'll add a note to the doc to ask for feedback

15:11:06 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]

Zakim IRC Bot: -[IPcaller]

15:11:24 <bglimm> ... related to issue 60 is what is in the response to an update

... related to ISSUE-60 is what is in the response to an update

15:11:28 <Zakim> +??P44

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P44

15:11:35 <AndyS> zakim, ??P44 is me

Andy Seaborne: zakim, ??P44 is me

15:11:35 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS; got it

15:11:42 <bglimm> ... we probably didn't get there, but we discussed response and error code

... we probably didn't get there, but we discussed response and error code

15:12:08 <bglimm> ... 200 code for success? Could be problematic if systems want to redirect (e.g., from POST to GET)

... 200 code for success? Could be problematic if systems want to redirect (e.g., from POST to GET)

15:12:28 <bglimm> ... we decided not to describe something here, should fall out from HTTP good practises

... we decided not to describe something here, should fall out from HTTP good practises

15:13:01 <bglimm> AndyS: My understanding is we would follow HTTP in what that says, so most is predefined

Andy Seaborne: My understanding is we would follow HTTP in what that says, so most is predefined

15:13:18 <bglimm> ... we could mention the common practise

... we could mention the common practise

15:13:27 <bglimm> Greg: That's also my understanding

Gregory Williams: That's also my understanding

15:13:42 <AxelPolleres> HTTP doesn't leave much freedom on return codes... will tell us what to do.

Axel Polleres: HTTP doesn't leave much freedom on return codes... will tell us what to do.

15:13:47 <bglimm> ... forth issue is faults and error messages

... forth issue is faults and error messages

15:14:34 <bglimm> .... there was consensus that we want to express error messages in plain text, more structures errors can be dealt with in a next WG

.... there was consensus that we want to express error messages in plain text, more structures errors can be dealt with in a next WG

15:14:35 <AxelPolleres> plain text errors and leaving more structured error descriptions to a future group.

Axel Polleres: plain text errors and leaving more structured error descriptions to a future group.

15:14:53 <bglimm> ... final issues: patch, issue 56

... final issues: patch, ISSUE-56

15:14:53 <AxelPolleres> HTTP PATCH ?

Axel Polleres: HTTP PATCH ?

15:15:03 <bglimm> ... looking into patch for update issues.

... looking into patch for update issues.

15:15:34 <sandro> !!!

Sandro Hawke: !!!

15:15:36 <bglimm> .... patch says that the resource should not me modified, otherwise POST should be used

.... patch says that the resource should not me modified, otherwise POST should be used

15:15:58 <bglimm> ... we agreed to not pursue PATCH since it does not seem to be a good fit for our situation

... we agreed to not pursue PATCH since it does not seem to be a good fit for our situation

15:16:06 <sandro> (I don't care about PATCH, but yes, of course "the resource" is the graph store.)

Sandro Hawke: (I don't care about PATCH, but yes, of course "the resource" is the graph store.)

15:16:41 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: We probably need a concrete proposal to close issue 56

Axel Polleres: We probably need a concrete proposal to close ISSUE-56

15:17:02 <AxelPolleres> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Axel Polleres: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:17:02 <Zakim> On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji (muted), MattPerry, Sandro, pgearon, bglimm, AlexPassant, AndyS

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji (muted), MattPerry, Sandro, pgearon, bglimm, AlexPassant, AndyS

15:17:02 <bglimm> Sandro: Who wanted to use PATCH? I don't think we can close the issue now.

Sandro Hawke: Who wanted to use PATCH? I don't think we can close the issue now.

15:17:10 <Zakim> +Souri

Zakim IRC Bot: +Souri

15:17:15 <bglimm> Greg: I think Paul suggested it initially.

Gregory Williams: I think Paul suggested it initially.

15:17:33 <pgearon> that's correct. I was interested, but it seemed like I'm the only one, so the outcome was not to use it

Paul Gearon: that's correct. I was interested, but it seemed like I'm the only one, so the outcome was not to use it

15:17:44 <pgearon> I did not suggest it initially

Paul Gearon: I did not suggest it initially

15:17:50 <chimezie> Zakim, unmute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, unmute me

15:17:50 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should no longer be muted

15:18:13 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: I think Sandro and Greg agree that the issues is closable.

Axel Polleres: I think Sandro and Greg agree that the issues is closable.

15:18:26 <sandro> sandro: Okay, if GET on the endpoint gives you the service description, then yes, using PATCH on the endpoint shouldn't be used to update the quad store.

Sandro Hawke: Okay, if GET on the endpoint gives you the service description, then yes, using PATCH on the endpoint shouldn't be used to update the quad store. [ Scribe Assist by Sandro Hawke ]

15:18:57 <AxelPolleres> ISSUE-56 can be closed from Protocol's point of view, but still open for http-rdf-update ?

Axel Polleres: ISSUE-56 can be closed from Protocol's point of view, but still open for http-rdf-update ?

15:19:28 <AndyS> q+ to ask in what way it is still open for the REST-protocol

Andy Seaborne: q+ to ask in what way it is still open for the REST-protocol

15:19:38 <bglimm> Chime: I can close issue 56 and open a new one for http-update

Chimezie Ogbuji: I can close ISSUE-56 and open a new one for http-update

15:19:51 <bglimm> AndyS: In what way is it still open?

Andy Seaborne: In what way is it still open?

15:20:31 <AndyS> ack AndyS

Andy Seaborne: ack AndyS

15:20:31 <Zakim> AndyS, you wanted to ask in what way it is still open for the REST-protocol

Zakim IRC Bot: AndyS, you wanted to ask in what way it is still open for the REST-protocol

15:20:39 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Is patch allowed for http-update?

Axel Polleres: Is patch allowed for http-update?

15:21:05 <bglimm> Chime: It is not always clear what is to be modified, but if it is clear, it can be used

Chimezie Ogbuji: It is not always clear what is to be modified, but if it is clear, it can be used

15:21:35 <bglimm> ... I suggested some text in an email to get more feedback, but other than that I think it can be closed

... I suggested some text in an email to get more feedback, but other than that I think it can be closed

15:21:48 <chimezie> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0352.html

Chimezie Ogbuji: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0352.html

15:22:13 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Can people please have a look at that email.

Axel Polleres: Can people please have a look at that email.

15:22:31 <bglimm> ... I suggest we proceed by email and see whether we can close it next week

... I suggest we proceed by email and see whether we can close it next week

15:22:35 <bglimm> Chime: ok

Chimezie Ogbuji: ok

15:22:47 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me

15:22:47 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

15:23:04 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: Axel to put closing of ISSUE-56 on next week's agenda, asking for more discussion on the proposal in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0352.html on email.

ACTION: Axel to put closing of ISSUE-56 on next week's agenda, asking for more discussion on the proposal in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0352.html on email.

15:23:04 <trackbot> Created ACTION-343 - Put closing of ISSUE-56 on next week's agenda, asking for more discussion on the proposal in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0352.html on email. [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-343 - Put closing of ISSUE-56 on next week's agenda, asking for more discussion on the proposal in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0352.html on email. [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

15:23:21 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Anything more from the protocol teleconf?

Axel Polleres: Anything more from the protocol teleconf?

15:23:29 <bglimm> Greg: No, that's all

Gregory Williams: No, that's all

15:23:35 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Anything on the schedule?

Axel Polleres: Anything on the schedule?

15:23:46 <bglimm> Greg: No, not discussed

Gregory Williams: No, not discussed

15:23:58 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Lee and I have to look into that then

Axel Polleres: Lee and I have to look into that then

15:24:13 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: Axel to talk with Lee about protocol schedule

ACTION: Axel to talk with Lee about protocol schedule

15:24:13 <trackbot> Created ACTION-344 - Talk with Lee about protocol schedule  [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-344 - Talk with Lee about protocol schedule [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

15:24:35 <AxelPolleres> topic: rif:usedWithProfile

4. rif:usedWithProfile

15:24:47 <AxelPolleres> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0430.html

Axel Polleres: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0430.html

15:25:01 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: The email summarizes the status

Axel Polleres: The email summarizes the status

15:25:28 <bglimm> ... I went back to the RIF WG, to discuss how we can refer to RIF docs from within RDF docs

... I went back to the RIF WG, to discuss how we can refer to RIF docs from within RDF docs

15:25:51 <bglimm> The predicate would have a rule set as subject and ent. profile from RIF as object

The predicate would have a rule set as subject and ent. profile from RIF as object

15:26:12 <AxelPolleres> <r1> rif:usedWithProfile <http://www.w3.org/ns/entailment/Simple> .

Axel Polleres: <r1> rif:usedWithProfile <http://www.w3.org/ns/entailment/Simple> .

15:26:37 <bglimm> .... <r1> imports rules that are to be used with the simple ent. profile

.... <r1> imports rules that are to be used with the simple ent. profile

15:26:49 <bglimm> ... we added a section to the ent. regimes doc

... we added a section to the ent. regimes doc

15:26:57 <AxelPolleres> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/xmlspec.xml#id0x278d4530

Axel Polleres: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/xmlspec.xml#id0x278d4530

15:27:33 <bglimm> ... happy about comments

... happy about comments

15:27:58 <bglimm> .... Sandro, we refer to the RIF-in-RDF encoding, can you check the example that we have?

.... Sandro, we refer to the RIF-in-RDF encoding, can you check the example that we have?

15:28:06 <bglimm> Sandro: Yes, I'll check that

Sandro Hawke: Yes, I'll check that

15:28:16 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: sandro to check example in http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/xmlspec.xml#id0x278d4530

ACTION: sandro to check example in http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/xmlspec.xml#id0x278d4530

15:28:16 <trackbot> Created ACTION-345 - Check example in http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/xmlspec.xml#id0x278d4530 [on Sandro Hawke - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-345 - Check example in http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/xmlspec.xml#id0x278d4530 [on Sandro Hawke - due 2010-12-21].

15:28:35 <chimezie> Zakim, unmute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, unmute me

15:28:35 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should no longer be muted

15:28:45 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Chime, can you have a look over the new part (7.1)

Axel Polleres: Chime, can you have a look over the new part (7.1)

15:29:02 <bglimm> ... I just replaced rif:import with rif:usedWithProfile

... I just replaced rif:import with rif:usedWithProfile

15:29:19 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: chime to look over "side effects" of the new section for RIF entailment regime

ACTION: chime to look over "side effects" of the new section for RIF entailment regime

15:29:19 <trackbot> Created ACTION-346 - Look over "side effects" of the new section for RIF entailment regime [on Chimezie Ogbuji - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-346 - Look over "side effects" of the new section for RIF entailment regime [on Chimezie Ogbuji - due 2010-12-21].

15:29:40 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Birte gave some comments already

Axel Polleres: Birte gave some comments already

15:29:51 <bglimm> bglimm: I am happy with the section

Birte Glimm: I am happy with the section

15:30:15 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: I suggest we move that to the end of the section

Axel Polleres: I suggest we move that to the end of the section

15:30:25 <bglimm> ... it is quite long now

... it is quite long now

15:31:03 <bglimm> ... if that's ok with everybody, I'll action myself

... if that's ok with everybody, I'll action myself

15:31:18 <bglimm> ... to move it to the end of Sec. 7

... to move it to the end of Sec. 7

15:31:22 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: Axel to move "referencing RIF" section to the end of section 7 in ER

ACTION: Axel to move "referencing RIF" section to the end of section 7 in ER

15:31:22 <trackbot> Created ACTION-347 - Move "referencing RIF" section to the end of section 7 in ER [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-347 - Move "referencing RIF" section to the end of section 7 in ER [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

15:32:04 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: We used in the ent. document the term Informative in others we use non-normative

Axel Polleres: We used in the ent. document the term Informative in others we use non-normative

15:32:10 <bglimm> ... any preference

... any preference

15:32:25 <bglimm> Sandro: Informative is unfortunate jargon

Sandro Hawke: Informative is unfortunate jargon

15:32:37 <bglimm> ... OWL switched to non-normative

... OWL switched to non-normative

15:32:49 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: I suggest we switch to non-normative

Axel Polleres: I suggest we switch to non-normative

15:32:53 <AndyS> SPARQL 1.0 used "informative"

Andy Seaborne: SPARQL 1.0 used "informative"

15:33:08 <bglimm> .... Any objections to switch to non-normative

.... Any objections to switch to non-normative

15:33:18 <bglimm> AndyS: I don't see why we should switch

Andy Seaborne: I don't see why we should switch

15:33:43 <AxelPolleres> let's stick with "informative"

Axel Polleres: let's stick with "informative"

15:33:44 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Ok, then we just stick with Informative

Axel Polleres: Ok, then we just stick with Informative

15:34:03 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me

15:34:03 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

15:34:17 <AxelPolleres> q?

Axel Polleres: q?

15:34:21 <bglimm> Topic: Review of actions

5. Review of actions

15:34:40 <AxelPolleres> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0447.html

Axel Polleres: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2010OctDec/0447.html

15:34:56 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: I tried to identify actions that are critical for LC

Axel Polleres: I tried to identify actions that are critical for LC

15:35:10 <AxelPolleres> ACTION-200 Steve to Work with Andy to add CONSTRUCT WHERE { triple pattern } shortcut to query spec

Axel Polleres: ACTION-200 Steve to Work with Andy to add CONSTRUCT WHERE { triple pattern } shortcut to query spec

15:35:10 <trackbot> ACTION-200 Work with Andy to add CONSTRUCT WHERE { triple pattern } shortcut to query spec notes added

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-200 Work with Andy to add CONSTRUCT WHERE { triple pattern } shortcut to query spec notes added

15:35:17 <bglimm> ... Action-200 CONSTRUCT WHERE

... ACTION-200 CONSTRUCT WHERE

15:35:31 <bglimm> .... can we have quick opinions?

.... can we have quick opinions?

15:35:53 <kasei> q+

Gregory Williams: q+

15:36:35 <bglimm> AndyS: We should be careful not to get into conflicts for named graphs and quads

Andy Seaborne: We should be careful not to get into conflicts for named graphs and quads

15:37:03 <AndyS> see also LALR(1) checking needed

Andy Seaborne: see also LALR(1) checking needed

15:37:29 <bglimm> Greg: I am against this. Even if it does not cause parsing problems, the optional where clause is problematic for humans

Gregory Williams: I am against this. Even if it does not cause parsing problems, the optional where clause is problematic for humans

15:37:58 <AxelPolleres> strawpoll... Do you want CONSTRUCT WHERE as a shortcut?

Axel Polleres: strawpoll... Do you want CONSTRUCT WHERE as a shortcut?

15:38:07 <AndyS> no opinion

Andy Seaborne: no opinion

15:38:11 <kasei> i've seen discussion in the past of a "CONSTRUCT *" syntax that I think would at least mitigate the human confusion...

Gregory Williams: i've seen discussion in the past of a "CONSTRUCT *" syntax that I think would at least mitigate the human confusion...

15:38:11 <chimezie> 0

Chimezie Ogbuji: 0

15:38:16 <kasei> -1

Gregory Williams: -1

15:38:17 <pgearon> 0

Paul Gearon: 0

15:38:19 <AxelPolleres> 0

Axel Polleres: 0

15:38:20 <bglimm> -0

-0

15:38:24 <corby> 0

Olivier Corby: 0

15:39:09 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: There seems to be no strong support from the WG, I'll get back to Steve to see whether he really think we need it or whether we can live without it

Axel Polleres: There seems to be no strong support from the WG, I'll get back to Steve to see whether he really think we need it or whether we can live without it

15:39:28 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: Axel to get back to Steve on ACTION-200 ... suggesting to pursue without that shortcut or refreshing my memories on it :-)

ACTION: Axel to get back to Steve on ACTION-200 ... suggesting to pursue without that shortcut or refreshing my memories on it :-)

15:39:28 <trackbot> Created ACTION-348 - Get back to Steve on ACTION-200 ... suggesting to pursue without that shortcut or refreshing my memories on it :-) [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-348 - Get back to Steve on ACTION-200 ... suggesting to pursue without that shortcut or refreshing my memories on it :-) [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

15:39:51 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Action 209 Steve to Disallow projected variables being reused in HAVING in the spec

Axel Polleres: ACTION-209 Steve to Disallow projected variables being reused in HAVING in the spec

15:39:58 <AxelPolleres> done

Axel Polleres: done

15:40:13 <AxelPolleres>  ACTION-285 Paul to Collect update security issues and report back to mailinglist regarding ISSUE-19

Axel Polleres: ACTION-285 Paul to Collect update security issues and report back to mailinglist regarding ISSUE-19

15:40:34 <bglimm> .... has this ever been on the mailing list?

.... has this ever been on the mailing list?

15:40:49 <bglimm> Paul: Yes, but I didn't write a summary of the discussion

Paul Gearon: Yes, but I didn't write a summary of the discussion

15:40:51 <AxelPolleres> before christmas...

Axel Polleres: before christmas...

15:41:06 <AxelPolleres> ACTION-286 Lee to Add a note on dropping of SOAP binding to next WD of protocol11 and explicitly solicit feedback on usage of SOAP in SPARQL

Axel Polleres: ACTION-286 Lee to Add a note on dropping of SOAP binding to next WD of protocol11 and explicitly solicit feedback on usage of SOAP in SPARQL

15:41:06 <trackbot> ACTION-286 Add a note on dropping of SOAP binding to next WD of protocol11 and explicitly solicit feedback on usage of SOAP in SPARQL notes added

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-286 Add a note on dropping of SOAP binding to next WD of protocol11 and explicitly solicit feedback on usage of SOAP in SPARQL notes added

15:41:32 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: There is an action for Lee to drop the SOAP protocol

Axel Polleres: There is an action for Lee to drop the SOAP protocol

15:42:07 <bglimm> ... we had some discussion and we decided to hint explicitly that SOAP is no longer official supported/needed

... we had some discussion and we decided to hint explicitly that SOAP is no longer official supported/needed

15:42:16 <bglimm> ... any opinions

... any opinions

15:43:00 <bglimm> ... I think it is important to do this

... I think it is important to do this

15:43:01 <AxelPolleres> will talk avbout it with lee

Axel Polleres: will talk avbout it with lee

15:43:13 <AxelPolleres> ACTION-290 Lee to Make sure that the relationship between SPARQL protocol and HTTP protocol is clearly laid out before Last Call

Axel Polleres: ACTION-290 Lee to Make sure that the relationship between SPARQL protocol and HTTP protocol is clearly laid out before Last Call

15:43:13 <trackbot> ACTION-290 Make sure that the relationship between SPARQL protocol and HTTP protocol is clearly laid out before Last Call notes added

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-290 Make sure that the relationship between SPARQL protocol and HTTP protocol is clearly laid out before Last Call notes added

15:43:13 <AxelPolleres>  *critical for LC *

Axel Polleres: *critical for LC *

15:43:52 <AxelPolleres>  ACTION-291 Work MIME type registration information into SPARQL Update document based on Sandro's suggestion for formatting etc.

Axel Polleres: ACTION-291 Work MIME type registration information into SPARQL Update document based on Sandro's suggestion for formatting etc.

15:44:14 <bglimm> AxelPolleres:  That was on Paul

Axel Polleres: That was on Paul

15:44:25 <bglimm> Paul: I didn't do that, maybe Alex did

Paul Gearon: I didn't do that, maybe Alex did

15:44:36 <bglimm> Alex: I didn't do it

Alexandre Passant: I didn't do it

15:44:55 <bglimm> AxelPolleres:  Can something happen before Christmas? Can I leave the action with Paul?

Axel Polleres: Can something happen before Christmas? Can I leave the action with Paul?

15:44:59 <AndyS> I'd like to add a registration for query as well.  Completeness

Andy Seaborne: I'd like to add a registration for query as well. Completeness

15:44:59 <AxelPolleres> that one was for Paul... before Christmas? :-)

Axel Polleres: that one was for Paul... before Christmas? :-)

15:44:59 <bglimm> Paul: OK

Paul Gearon: OK

15:45:39 <AxelPolleres>  ACTION-292 Lee to Make sure text on transactionality/concurrency gets added to protocol document

Axel Polleres: ACTION-292 Lee to Make sure text on transactionality/concurrency gets added to protocol document

15:45:39 <AxelPolleres>  *Is this critical for LC? Was it discussed in the protocol call?*

Axel Polleres: *Is this critical for LC? Was it discussed in the protocol call?*

15:45:52 <bglimm> AxelPolleres:  I have to discuss this with Lee

Axel Polleres: I have to discuss this with Lee

15:45:58 <AxelPolleres>  ACTION-306 Lee to Work with Axel to identify potential editor(s) to shepherd through JSON document on Rec track

Axel Polleres: ACTION-306 Lee to Work with Axel to identify potential editor(s) to shepherd through JSON document on Rec track

15:46:01 <AndyS> query content-type gets .rq registered.  Can C&P update, change, remove security issues.

Andy Seaborne: query content-type gets .rq registered. Can C&P update, change, remove security issues.

15:46:21 <bglimm> ... we didn't find editors for the JSON format doc yet

... we didn't find editors for the JSON format doc yet

15:46:51 <bglimm> ... nobody volunteered and we didn't pursue it either

... nobody volunteered and we didn't pursue it either

15:47:00 <bglimm> ... anybody interested to do that?

... anybody interested to do that?

15:47:18 <bglimm> ... AndyS said he could help, but has many other things to do

... AndyS said he could help, but has many other things to do

15:47:41 <bglimm> AndyS: There is not too much to do, adding a schema section would be nice

Andy Seaborne: There is not too much to do, adding a schema section would be nice

15:47:48 <AxelPolleres> schema section would be nice, but not critical, mostly formatting only.

Axel Polleres: schema section would be nice, but not critical, mostly formatting only.

15:47:57 <bglimm> AndyS: Does anybody know of outstanding issues?

Andy Seaborne: Does anybody know of outstanding issues?

15:48:08 <kasei> My feelings are similar to AndyS: willing to help/edit, but less sure if there's lots of work outstanding.

Gregory Williams: My feelings are similar to AndyS: willing to help/edit, but less sure if there's lots of work outstanding.

15:48:33 <bglimm> ... it is just a JSON version of the XML result format

... it is just a JSON version of the XML result format

15:49:40 <bglimm> Greg: I am pretty loaded, but if it is not too much work I can do it, but I can't tell how much work

Gregory Williams: I am pretty loaded, but if it is not too much work I can do it, but I can't tell how much work

15:49:56 <bglimm> AndyS: How about checking this week what is involved?

Andy Seaborne: How about checking this week what is involved?

15:49:57 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: greg to send out question for ISSUES on json format, if no comments ship out as LC

ACTION: greg to send out question for ISSUES on json format, if no comments ship out as LC

15:49:57 <trackbot> Created ACTION-349 - Send out question for ISSUES on json format, if no comments ship out as LC [on Gregory Williams - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-349 - Send out question for ISSUES on json format, if no comments ship out as LC [on Gregory Williams - due 2010-12-21].

15:50:17 <AxelPolleres>  ACTION-324 carlos to Ping carlos/eric in 2-3 weeks for progress on Fed query issues

Axel Polleres: ACTION-324 carlos to Ping carlos/eric in 2-3 weeks for progress on Fed query issues

15:50:59 <bglimm> Carlos ???: Idea was to finish the work this week, I plan to have something for review next week

Carlos ???: Idea was to finish the work this week, I plan to have something for review next week

15:51:05 <AxelPolleres> carlos plans to send out request for review within the week.

Axel Polleres: carlos plans to send out request for review within the week.

15:51:17 <bglimm> ... Friday I'll ask for reviews and proceed with comments

... Friday I'll ask for reviews and proceed with comments

15:51:48 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: ACTION 328 can be closed, Steve confirmed he completed it

Axel Polleres: ACTION-328 can be closed, Steve confirmed he completed it

15:51:56 <AxelPolleres> ACTION-328 can be closed according to steve

Axel Polleres: ACTION-328 can be closed according to steve

15:52:13 <bglimm> ACTION-331 Andy to Clarify the meaning of "potentially bound" vis a vis what

ACTION-331 Andy to Clarify the meaning of "potentially bound" vis a vis what

15:52:13 <trackbot> ACTION-331 Clarify the meaning of "potentially bound" vis a vis what can go on the right hand side of an AS in a SELECT list notes added

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-331 Clarify the meaning of "potentially bound" vis a vis what can go on the right hand side of an AS in a SELECT list notes added

15:52:14 <bglimm> can go on the right hand side of an AS in a SELECT list

can go on the right hand side of an AS in a SELECT list

15:52:27 <bglimm> AndyS: I am working on it

Andy Seaborne: I am working on it

15:52:38 <bglimm> ... I've send a message to the list

... I've send a message to the list

15:52:58 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Thanks for the update

Axel Polleres: Thanks for the update

15:53:11 <bglimm> ... any updates for the schedule regarding LC?

... any updates for the schedule regarding LC?

15:53:32 <bglimm> ... from now on I'll ask in teleconfs for a status

... from now on I'll ask in teleconfs for a status

15:53:34 <AxelPolleres>  topic: schedule

Axel Polleres: topic: schedule

15:53:38 <bglimm> ... Query?

... Query?

15:54:04 <bglimm> AndyS: little progress, group has been adding lots of things, I am working through the details

Andy Seaborne: little progress, group has been adding lots of things, I am working through the details

15:54:17 <AxelPolleres> place-holders were added, people submitting content would be helpful

Axel Polleres: place-holders were added, people submitting content would be helpful

15:54:20 <bglimm> people could help by sending details and test cases

people could help by sending details and test cases

15:54:30 <AxelPolleres> ... test cases would be very helpful

Axel Polleres: ... test cases would be very helpful

15:55:03 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Can anybody help with the function library section?

Axel Polleres: Can anybody help with the function library section?

15:55:13 <bglimm> .... It should be easy to do, but time consuming

.... It should be easy to do, but time consuming

15:55:35 <bglimm> ... I can try and give you some input on this

... I can try and give you some input on this

15:55:43 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: Axel to draft some input for the function library section

ACTION: Axel to draft some input for the function library section

15:55:43 <trackbot> Created ACTION-350 - Draft some input for the function library section [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-350 - Draft some input for the function library section [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

15:56:03 <bglimm> ... next doc: update

... next doc: update

15:56:19 <bglimm> Alex: I added the shortcuts and asked for feedback

Alexandre Passant: I added the shortcuts and asked for feedback

15:56:28 <bglimm> ... I have to go through the pending actions

... I have to go through the pending actions

15:56:42 <bglimm> ... most of them have been taken into account

... most of them have been taken into account

15:57:16 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Lets see whether we can discuss the formal model in the next couple of days

Axel Polleres: Lets see whether we can discuss the formal model in the next couple of days

15:57:23 <bglimm> ... how far from LC?

... how far from LC?

15:57:43 <AxelPolleres> 2nd week of Jan seems realistic.

Axel Polleres: 2nd week of Jan seems realistic.

15:57:45 <bglimm> Alex: I think second week of Jan could be doable, mid January

Alexandre Passant: I think second week of Jan could be doable, mid January

15:58:02 <bglimm> AxelPolleres:  Ent. Regimes

Axel Polleres: Ent. Regimes

15:58:25 <bglimm> RIF-imports is now resolved

RIF-imports is now resolved

15:58:44 <bglimm> ... next week we discuss Enrico's comments

... next week we discuss Enrico's comments

15:59:04 <bglimm> Sandro: I have some issues that I'll try to make precise

Sandro Hawke: I have some issues that I'll try to make precise

15:59:24 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: next doc: Service Descriptions

Axel Polleres: next doc: Service Descriptions

15:59:33 <bglimm> Chime: No outstanding issues

Chimezie Ogbuji: No outstanding issues

15:59:38 <chimezie> Zakim, unmute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, unmute me

15:59:38 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should no longer be muted

15:59:47 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: HTTP-update?

Axel Polleres: HTTP-update?

16:00:03 <chimezie> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/HTTP-UPDATE-ISSUES

Chimezie Ogbuji: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/HTTP-UPDATE-ISSUES

16:00:03 <bglimm> Chime: I tried to solve open issues on the wiki

Chimezie Ogbuji: I tried to solve open issues on the wiki

16:00:48 <bglimm> ... AndyS and Steve had some issues with relative URIs and I summarized them

... AndyS and Steve had some issues with relative URIs and I summarized them

16:01:02 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: We can go through that in one of the next tele conferences

Axel Polleres: We can go through that in one of the next tele conferences

16:01:15 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: Axel to put http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/HTTP-UPDATE-ISSUES on one of the next agendas

ACTION: Axel to put http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/HTTP-UPDATE-ISSUES on one of the next agendas

16:01:15 <trackbot> Created ACTION-351 - Put http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/HTTP-UPDATE-ISSUES on one of the next agendas [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-351 - Put http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/HTTP-UPDATE-ISSUES on one of the next agendas [on Axel Polleres - due 2010-12-21].

16:01:21 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me

16:01:21 <Zakim> Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Chimezie_Ogbuji should now be muted

16:01:36 <bglimm> AxelPolleres: Fed. Queries we'll get an update from Carlos shortly

Axel Polleres: Fed. Queries we'll get an update from Carlos shortly

16:01:55 <bglimm> ... Overview is just one afternoon's work and not that critical

... Overview is just one afternoon's work and not that critical

16:02:13 <Zakim> -Chimezie_Ogbuji

Zakim IRC Bot: -Chimezie_Ogbuji

16:02:13 <MattPerry> bye

Matthew Perry: bye

16:02:14 <bglimm> adjourned

adjourned

16:02:14 <AxelPolleres> adjourned

Axel Polleres: adjourned

16:02:15 <Zakim> -Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro

16:02:16 <Zakim> -cbuilara

Zakim IRC Bot: -cbuilara

16:02:16 <Zakim> -pgearon

Zakim IRC Bot: -pgearon

16:02:19 <Zakim> -AlexPassant

Zakim IRC Bot: -AlexPassant

16:02:20 <Zakim> -MattPerry

Zakim IRC Bot: -MattPerry

16:02:21 <Zakim> -AxelPolleres

Zakim IRC Bot: -AxelPolleres

16:02:22 <Zakim> -OlivierCorby

Zakim IRC Bot: -OlivierCorby

16:02:23 <Zakim> -NickH

Zakim IRC Bot: -NickH

16:02:28 <Zakim> -AndyS

Zakim IRC Bot: -AndyS

16:02:30 <Zakim> -kasei

Zakim IRC Bot: -kasei

16:03:14 <bglimm> RRSAgent, generate minutes

RRSAgent, generate minutes

16:03:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/14-sparql-minutes.html bglimm

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/14-sparql-minutes.html bglimm

16:03:20 <Zakim> -Souri

Zakim IRC Bot: -Souri

16:03:34 <bglimm> rrsagent, make logs world

rrsagent, make logs world

16:04:45 <Zakim> -bglimm

Zakim IRC Bot: -bglimm

16:04:46 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has ended

16:04:47 <Zakim> Attendees were cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, Sandro, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji, AndyS, MattPerry, pgearon, bglimm, AlexPassant, [IPcaller], Souri

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were cbuilara, NickH, OlivierCorby, kasei, Sandro, AxelPolleres, Chimezie_Ogbuji, AndyS, MattPerry, pgearon, bglimm, AlexPassant, [IPcaller], Souri

16:06:52 <AxelPolleres> regrets: LeeF, SteveH


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This revision (#2) generated 2010-12-14 23:40:40 UTC by 'bglimm', comments: 'topic cleanup'