See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 12 November 2009
<mth> will join by phone in a few minutes
<AllanJ> scribe: KimPatch
Kelly: face-to-face Thursday Friday Wednesday afternoon -- I felt we worked well together. We started looking at our techniques -- intent, examples, resources
Kelly: speech input demonstration
refreshing to help us think about ways to expedite commands
that don't force the speech user to go through the keyboard or
mouse model -- that was reinforced
... meeting minutes have links to other presentations
... progress on section five guidelines -- for some segments of the disabled and aging population still too hard to use -- anything we can do to make controls discoverable
... HTML five was a hot topic
protocols on formats group trying to drive review -- the ascent of a joint task force between HTML five and protocols and formats to make or progress on accessibility issues
<AllanJ> Mark and Jim are members of HTML5 A11y Taskforce
three broad areas -- canvas accessibility, media accessibility, overall adds a lot of things
Kelly: turning our comments into bugs
Jim: Mark and I spent two hours in the accessibility group. when our media accessibility comes up again, there are a couple of people from that meeting I want to invite.
Mark: it was good to see TV exec. understand.
Jim: we were able to pipe up and say we are to have guidelines for that
Jean: the received a number of comments from the W3C team about our group being so visible -- dedication, enthusiasm, that was very nice to hear
<kford> html 5 task force info http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/html-task-force
Greg: the way we were working -- we tried breaking out into pairs, that worked out pretty well
Jim: hammered on and reorganized
action items down to about 35 -- it would be different it clear
that while before the end of the year
... maybe take some of the writing off-line
<kford> html 5 task force mailing list. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/
Jim: possible face-to-face in January?
<jeanne> I am available
<AllanJ> Jim Available
Week of the 18th in Austin, 2 1/2 days
Jim: or UC Sun
Jim: 4.5.6 all or just accessibility related -- difficult to tell
<AllanJ> KP: restoring to default is getting back to a known state. that is important. even if it is not the best for a particular.
Greg: 5.8 restoring defaults outside the user interface accomplishes that better
<AllanJ> GL: 4.5.8 changing settings from outside the UA
Greg: to the less useful one be level a?
Kelly: do browsers have (4.5.6) today
Greg: Firefox lets you specify user profile
Kelly: IE does
Greg: question is is there a
sitting inside the browser to specify user settings
... the other question is what is the thing that for either of these would justify level A
<kford> One example of how to restore FF http://www.universefirefox.com/how-to/restore-firefox-default-settings-without-uninstalling-it
Jim: if there aren't any we can always knock it back to AA
Kelly: IE has restore feature
Jim: we'll leave it at A pending last call report if no objections
<AllanJ> ACTION: Jeanne to update draft 4.5.6 Restore all to default. The user can restore all preference settings to their default values. (Level A) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-ua-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-244 - Update draft 4.5.6 Restore all to default. The user can restore all preference settings to their default values. (Level A) [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2009-11-19].
<AllanJ> NOTE: The user must not be required to know or enter the default values.
Greg: groups subjective
Kelly: I think the ambiguity is acceptable given the overall initiative that it's trying to move the industry towards
<AllanJ> ACTION: Jeanne to update draft 4.5.7 Restore related preferences to default. The user can restore groups of related preference settings to their default values (e.g. reset keyboard shortcuts, reset colors and sizes of rendered content, etc.). (Level AA) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-ua-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-245 - Update draft 4.5.7 Restore related preferences to default. The user can restore groups of related preference settings to their default values (e.g. reset keyboard shortcuts, reset colors and sizes of rendered content, etc.). (Level AA) [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2009-11-19].
<AllanJ> NOTE: Allowing the user to reset groups of related preference settings is more valuable than merely providing the ability to reset all preference settings together, because some users will be unable to use the product without a few specific custom settings. [@@This may be better in the understanding document@@]
<Greg> Suggest changing "This allows the user to configure a product that would be inaccessible in its default state" to end with "in its default or current state".
Greg: seems more important than the one we put at single-A
Kelly: my biggest concern about level is from an implementation perspective you're asking a manufacturer to do something outside their main application
Kelly: if you have to fix it important, but in the real world are things ever so screwed up that you can't do anything until it hit some kind of reset
Greg: analogy is compare with sticky keys -- you can' t get there without having turned on and the first place
Kelly: analogy different -- by the time you get to the browser you've resolved
Greg: seems easier than 4.6
Jim: this is filling and around
the edges -- if the interface is messed up for there is a
setting you can't get to you've already failed 4.1...
... 4.5 is the guideline -- store preference settings
two different methods good for different users
Greg: looking at this in context it would be more useful if it wasn't restore default, but change settings -- more generalized
<Greg> For comparison, here is from ISO 9241-171:
<Greg> 8.2.5 Provide user-preference profiles
<Greg> Software should enable users to create, save, edit and recall profiles of preference settings, including input and output characteristics, without having to carry out any restart that would cause a change of state or data.
<Greg> NOTE 1 For systems that provide access for multiple users, such as library systems, conversion back to a default profile can be advisable.
<AllanJ> proposed: Change preference setting outside the UA
Greg: I'm willing to live with AA even though I think it's very important accessibility feature
<AllanJ> ACTION: Jeanne to update the draft 4.5.8 Change preference setting outside the UI: The user can adjust preference settings from outside the user agent user interface. (Level AA) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-ua-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-246 - Update the draft 4.5.8 Change preference setting outside the UI: The user can adjust preference settings from outside the user agent user interface. (Level AA) [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2009-11-19].
<AllanJ> NOTE: This allows the user to configure a product that would be inaccessible in its default state.
<AllanJ> EXAMPLE 1: A user agent ships with a separate utility for resetting or loading user preference settings.
<AllanJ> EXAMPLE 2: Holding down a modifier keys or specifying a command-line switch when starting the user agent could force it to use the default settings, or previously used and known-good settings, or a specified user profile.
<AllanJ> [@@note and examples may be better in the understanding document@@]
<AllanJ> close ACTION-201
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Found Scribe: KimPatch Inferring ScribeNick: KimPatch Default Present: allanj, Jeanne, kford, iheni, Greg, +1.617.325.aaaa, KimPatch, mth Present: Greg Jeanne KimPatch allanj iheni kford mth Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-ua-agenda.rdf Found Date: 12 Nov 2009 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-ua-minutes.html People with action items: jeanne WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]