See also: IRC log
<Steven> better to use trackbot
<Steven> trackbot, start telcon
<trackbot> Date: 12 November 2008
<Tina> As mentioned I am without a functional phone due to teleco salesfellow.
<scribe> Scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita
<scribe> ScribeNick: oedipus
<scribe> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Nov/0005.html
previous: http://www.w3.org/2008/11/04-xhtml-minutes.html
TOPIC 1: Agenda Review
RM: anything anyone wants to address specifically?
SP: did you see reqeest for review for Selectors
API
... fear we may not have reviewed first time around
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Nov/0004.html
http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/selectors-api/
quote: "As with LC #1, we explicitly request a review from the following WGs:
CSS, HTML, Math, P&F, SVG, XHTML2 and XML Core.
RM: relevant to us
SP: remember Mark dismissive of this; of opinion not worth dealing with but should revisit
RM: does it cause any difficulties or does it help us?
SM: namespace things in it relevant to XML Events 2 and may be to CURIEs
SP: CSS selectors api
http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/selectors-api/
SM: talks about DOM3 and namespaces
SP: title of the document makes it sound more
general than is -- selecting items using CSS selectors
... string parameter - text of CSS selector
SM: [role=foo:bar] - how does that get mapped?
SP: foo is any URI string?
SM: maybe not
SP: namespace suppport for elements, namespace support for attributes, but no namespace support for values; need to use literal prefixes
SM: treats as token
SP: biggest objection is that CSS Selectors
designed for very specific use case - serial rendering of documents; shaped
syntax of selectors: some things possible, some impossible, and some get in the
way of incremental rendering; can't collect previous sibling, but following
sibling because previous sibling already rendered; CSS Selectors a bad API
selector -- really need something more general
... that's why i think of little relevance -- decided to use XPath in XForms
and XHTML2 to avoid such a problem
RM: will someone review on our behalf and make reocommendation as to how to respond?
SP: when does LC end?
GJR: 12 December 2008
SP: second last call, so shorter review
... not sure if i have sufficient expertise - very much a DOM-thing
RM: look at it from our perspective - from our PoV looks ok
SP: anyone think could do this?
RM: SP familiar with CSS it is based on
SP: least interesting part of this - here is syntax over there, will do it
<scribe> ACTION: Steven - respond to LC2 call for Selectors API - 2008-11-30 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/12-xhtml-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-20 - - respond to LC2 call for Selectors API - 2008-11-30 [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-19].
SP: due to unused vacation days will be gone most of december
RM: 3 resolved to go to CR: CURIE, Role and Access
SP: CURIE request sent; other 2 will be sent by end of week
SM: sent how?
SP: transmission requests
RM's summary of TPAC resolutions & related stuff: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Oct/0040.html
RM: status of XML Events 2?
SM: updated draft on 24 October 2008 - believe that addresses everything discussed at meeting - sent out post to that effect
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Oct/0024.html
RM: please read and review before next week
<Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Drafts/#xml-events2
RM: XHTML Mime
SM: appendix needs to be updated
RM: in response to comments on mime document
SM: that's my action item
<Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Drafts/#xhtmlmime
SM: example doesn't match guidelines, but we knew that and will fix
SP: never been through reissuing a note before - announced to HTC, fielded comments, and when we are done, just publish - no pub approval cycle for Note
SM: shouldn't update until example more complete
RM: odd thing is XHTML Media Types Second Edition, but doesn't say note
SP: in statement - status also goes where "Editor's Draft" is now
SM: careful to keep editor's draft until ready to push
RM: only thing outstanding is appendix?
SM: yes
... have an action (18) to fix appendix
SP: when republish, are we going to consider doing PER of 1.0 without appendix C
GJR: as long as we point to Mime Types 2008
SP: appendix guidelines get a lot of flack as not
being part of spec and just informative
... olivier has problem that normative parts refer to informative appendix
C
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/18
SP: outstanding errata for 1.0?
SM: never envisioned re-releasing 1.0
SP: no errata logged for 1.0
RM: seems strange not even any minor editorial nits
SP: already Second Edition, so this would be Third Edition
SM: include schema implementation?
SP: why not?
SM: don't know if trust current schema
SP: think it was feed as DTD through a transformer and hand-tweaked
SM: don't need to do
<scribe> ACTION: Shane - prepare 1.0 PER by removing appendix C and replace with pointer / reference to XHTML Mime [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/12-xhtml-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-21 - - prepare 1.0 PER by removing appendix C and replace with pointer / reference to XHTML Mime [on Shane McCarron - due 2008-11-19].
RM: should be after XHTML Mime goes to transition
SM: a lot of fruit from XHTML Mime, so need to get that pushed
RM: Mime critical path for all PERs on list
SM: yes;
... haven't heard anything more from melinda -- will ping her to ensure
nothing else for XHTML Print
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/21
(will annotate after meeting)
RM: errata for XML Events need to be addressed
SM: did it - done
RM: 4 PERs (excluding 1.0) - where are we with
those?
... Basic should be issued; further dialog with Yam?
SP: there is example near end that we didn't create - in appendix says: "here is example" "here is how would look" working on updating that with Yam directly
RM: RDFa not keen to issue PER so soon after
issuing spec
... XHTML 1.1 PER status?
SM: ready to go
... Print is ready to og
RM: all refer to Mime document?
SM: Print does not refer to mime doc; 1.1, Basic,
RDFa do
... decision of RDFa TF was wait until january and then reissue and correct
any errata that arise
... if can get example done, Basic will be ready for PER
... will get 1.0 PER together as well, but first priority is get example done
in Mime document - try to get done by tomorrow - will alert group - review
changes on list and sign off on it next call
RM: no action outstanding to do example in basic
<scribe> ACTION: Steven - work with Yam on missing example for XHTML Basic - 2008-11-19 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/12-xhtml-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-22 - - work with Yam on missing example for XHTML Basic - 2008-11-19 [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-19].
<Roland> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/open
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/agenda
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/open
RM: action 4?
SM: checking status now
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/4
RM: role action on GJR
GJR: still need to pin down AlG's response
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/5
RM: Script Implement Attribute model (15) http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/15
SM: working on it
RM: IDREF change http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/16
SM: in process
... http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/19
- origins?
<Steven> close action-19
<trackbot> ACTION-19 craft text to about transformation of XHTML to HTML for the XHTMLMIME draft closed
RM: processor -- moved into tracker list - discussed at phone call of 15 june; put in and ripped out during F2F so think is close
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/agenda
RM: lot of historical actions still in agenda not
in tracker
... review and remove or move to tracker
<scribe> ACTION: Shane to start implementing xml schema for xhtml 2.0 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/12-xhtml-minutes.html#action04]
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/08-xhtml-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-23 - Start implementing xml schema for xhtml 2.0 [on Shane McCarron - due 2008-11-19].
drop action 4
RM: move into tracker
<scribe> new action on Shane: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/23
SP: speak to mark
RM: not sure how been changed
SP: Mark done a lot of modularization
RM: but not in spec
SP: not XHTML schema, but XForms; think Mark has one that implements ???
RM: ACTION: Shane to split 8024 into two issues.
http://www.w3.org/2007/12/12-xhtml-minutes.html#action04
RM: next action on steven redundant
... from f2f to venice: Steven to add text to embedding module saying how it
works
<scribe> ACTION: Steven to add text to embedding module saying how it works [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/12-xhtml-minutes.html#action05]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-24 - Add text to embedding module saying how it works [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-19].
SM: action on 8024 done
RM: do we need 4 types of list in XHTML2
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2008May/0005.html
SP: everlasting discussion - where "magic" of semantics resides: element or attribute names; better to have list titled UL with nexted LIs - could say 4 different types of list (UL,OL,DL)
SM: DL only different in that has user defined label
GJR: aria terms "ownedby"
SM: why break compatibility with world?
RM: created new one with navigation list
SP: with addition of role, someone said, now we have role with value of navigation, perhaps navigation list in XHTML2 superfluous
SM: nav list already has implicit role
SP: navigation list the one on the chopping block now that we have role
SM: special behavioral semantics associated with navigation lists
SP: meant to identify certain types of lists;
could represent in diff ways on diff devices; if no room for navigation bar,
could do as drop down list, which would be a navigation list; circumstantial
usage
... if base semantics on role, don't need extra syntax
SM: suggestion is get rid of navigation list in XHTML2 because role makes redundant
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-xhtml2-20071024/mod-list.html#edef_list_nl
proposed RESOLVED: review need for nl now that Role exists
RESOLUTION: review need for nl now that Role exists and prepare for discussion at next week's meeting
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-xhtml2-20071024/mod-list.html#s_listmodule
RM: Access + RDFa into XHTML2 - still open?
SM: open
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action05
SM: from 31 may 2005
... may be moot
... Media Type and how source type or href type are resolved during requests
for content-negotiation
SP: a double-asterisk says will accept anything - don't know how can expand asterisks
SM: doesn't make sense to me, either
RM: close 7800 and 7999 in issue tracking?
SM: can change to rejected because request should still say asterisk
RM: action on steven to devote brain cycles to solving quality values question
SP: needs more thought - clarify what asterisk means
ADJOURN
RM: XHTML2 development topic for next week
<Tina> oedipus: * ;)
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133 of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/statement/status/ Succeeded: s/7099/7999/ Found Scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita Found ScribeNick: oedipus Default Present: Roland, ShaneM, Steven, Gregory_Rosmaita Present: Roland ShaneM Steven Gregory_Rosmaita WARNING: Replacing previous Regrets list. (Old list: Alessio, Mark) Use 'Regrets+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Regrets+ Mark_Birbeck, Alessio_Cartocci, Tina_Holmboe Regrets: Mark_Birbeck Alessio_Cartocci Tina_Holmboe Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Nov/0005.html Found Date: 12 Nov 2008 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/11/12-xhtml-minutes.html People with action items: - 1.0 appendix by c per pointer prepare reference removing replace respond shane steven with WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]