<Alan> Testing...

<scribe> Scribe: KFord

JB: Can we talk about group members and such.

JB reviewing active group members.

JB: Thinks someone from Opera, and RNIB may be interested. And perhaps two more.

<scribe> ACTION: JA to follow up with contacts from RNIB and Opera on membership. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-60 - Follow up with contacts from RNIB and Opera on participation. [on Jim Allan - due 2008-11-06].

JB: Everyone who was at tech planning meeting please remember other interested folks and establish appropriate contacts.

<jeanne> ACTION: JS to check with contacts at TPAC for new members [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-61 - Check with contacts at TPAC for new members [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2008-11-06].

Use of surveys in meetings

JA: I thought there might be a way each person can take care of items but I think there needs to be a gatekeepoer and that will probably have to be Jeanne.

JS: Other groups do funnel through one person. Once you setup a survey, folks with appropriate access can edit surveys. It is easiest if I do it because I know I have the appropriate access.

J

JB: WCAG has a unique survey format, partly because of the number of issues they were putting through.
... Further explanation of process, quite complex, we probably don'tneed something that complicated.
... If we use a process where surveys go out a few days ahead, you get a quick list where you can quickly scan and see where folks agree and then focus on areas of question/disagreement more easily.

JA: If we are going to use this survey, this would mean action items need to be in to JS by Monday.

JB: Is this reasonable? It gives two days to complete action items.

JS: I think so.

general agreement with this.

KF: What does Monday really mean?

JS: This really means to me by 8A eastern on Tuesday mornings.

<AllanJ> additional contact at TPAC was with HTML video person, sent Mark contact information, and issues. I should approach her about participation.

JA discusses another possible contact.

Finishing principle 4, action items 30 and 33.

<AllanJ> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008OctDec/0035.html

JA: 4.1.7 was keyboard navigation.

4.1.1 was inter-group navigation.

JA reads items.

JA: At F2F we agreed these should all be combined.

<jeanne> 4.1.7 Keyboard Navigation: The user can navigate from group to group of

<jeanne> focusable items and use the keyboard to traverse forwards and backwards all

<jeanne> of the focusable items within each group. Groups include but are not limited

<jeanne> to toolbars, panels, and user agent extensions. Level AA

<jeanne> 4.1.7 Keyboard Navigation: The user can use the keyboard to navigate from group to group of focusable items and to traverse forwards and backwards all of the focusable items within each group. Groups include but are not limited to toolbars, panels, and user agent extensions. Level AA

some discussion about language and specific wording of structure for all guidelines.

JA: We have talked about this but should decide about what the stems for each guideline should look like.

<jeanne> +1

JA: Can we all live with the new 4.7?

Group agrees.

<jeanne> ACTION: JS to update draft with new text for 4.7 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-62 - Update draft with new text for 4.7 [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2008-11-06].

<jeanne> trackbot, close action-30

<trackbot> ACTION-30 Combine 4.1.7 and 4.1.11 sequential and among group navigation closed

trackbot close action 30

<AllanJ> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008OctDec/0036.html

JA reads old and new wordings.

<AllanJ> <new>

<AllanJ> 4.6.2 Bi-Directional: The user has the option of searching forward or

<AllanJ> backward from any selected or focused location in content. (Level AA)@@NEW@@

<AllanJ> </new>

<AllanJ> Note: removed (in document order), seems redundant. My thinking is...the

<AllanJ> rendered view and DOM tree is created from the HTML. Searching in any

<AllanJ> direction will move through the DOM tree and content in the appropriate

<AllanJ> direction as necessary. To go in some arbitrary order would be more work for

<AllanJ> the developers and they are unlikely to do that. The author may have created

<AllanJ> the HTML in one order and repositioned elements using CSS or JavaScript. The

<AllanJ> UA cannot guess at intentions or know how elements are assembled visually

<AllanJ> via CSS. The simplest way to search would be the order in which information

<AllanJ> appears in the HTML and the subsequent DOM tree.

<jeanne> +1

<AllanJ> +1

<jeanne> ACTION:JS to update draft with new text for 4.6.2 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action04]

group agrees to wording of 4.6.2.

trackbot, close action-33

<trackbot> ACTION-33 Create a proposal for rewording of 4.6.2 closed

<AllanJ> current draft: http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2008/WD-UAAG20-20081022/WD-UAAG20-20081022.html

JB: I'm assuming we didn't complete all the reviews of the document for things like organization and our other areas. Do we want to use time to continue that process?

Stem/handle consistency

Some discussion about has this area been thought about?

JB: W3C has thought about this but has no overall policy.

JR: ATAG has gone to the WCAG style. Each statement is a declarative

statement.

JB Starting with a verb is more comprehensible.

Alan, the verb is more inline with what we are trying to do.

<mth> i am wrapping another call, will join with voice soon.

JR: /me can someone scribe for one second, I need to step out for about one minute.

Much discussion about whether starting with a verb is correct.

<AllanJ> http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2008/WD-UAAG20-20081022/WD-UAAG20-20081022.html

JA: I think we need to start by agreeing on what the format of the stem/shandles should be?

Alan: What I was commenting on was after the title.

<jeanne> +1

JA: Do we have agreement that the stems should all be noun phrases?

JB: Proposing we come back to this.
... Let's talk about the syntax after the stems.

<AllanJ> proposal: make available the name, role, state, value, and description for all user interface components including the user interface and rendered content via an accessibility platform architecture

<Alan> For all user interface components -- including the user interface and rendered content -- make available the name, role, state, value, and description via an accessibility platform architecture.

<judy> For all user interface components including the user interface and rendered content, make available the name, role, state, value, and description via an accessibility platform architecture.

<AllanJ> above is 2.1.2

<JR> If any functionality is not supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s), then provide a separate accessible alternative for that functionality that is supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s) and provide a description of the inaccessible functionality appears in the conformance claim.

<JR> If any functionality is not supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s), then provide a separate accessible alternative for that functionality that is supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s) and provide a description of the inaccessible functionality in the conformance claim.

<JR> If any functionality is not supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s), provide a separate accessible alternative for that functionality that is supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s) and provide a description of the inaccessible functionality in the conformance claim.

<JR> If any functionality is not supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s), provide a separate accessible alternative for that functionality that is supported by the implemented accessibility platform architecture(s) and describe the inaccessible functionality in the conformance claim.

Orrsagent, make minutes

<Alan> If the user agent implements one or more DOMs, make them programmatically available to assistive technologies.

<AllanJ> > If the user agent implements one or more DOMs, make the programmatically available to assistive technologies.

<AllanJ> > If the user agent implements one or more DOMs, make the DOMS programmatically available to assistive technologies.

<AllanJ> above is 2.14

<Alan> If the user can modify the state or value of a piece of content through the user interface (e.g., by checking a box or editing a text area), make the same degree of write access available programmatically.

<AllanJ> JR above with 4 versions...they are all 2.1.3 - use the last version

<AllanJ> Alan above ... "if the user can modify..." is 2.1.5

<AllanJ> If the user can modify the state or value of a piece of content through the user interface (e.g., by checking a box or editing a text area) allow programatically modify the same state or value

<AllanJ> If the user can modify the state or value of a piece of content through the user interface (e.g., by checking a box or editing a text area) allow programatic modification of the same state or value.

<AllanJ> above is 2.1.5

<AllanJ> ACTION: MTH to rewrite 2.1.5 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - MTH

<AllanJ> ACTION: Mark to rewrite 2.1.5 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action06]

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Mark

<AllanJ> ACTION: Mark_Hakkenin to rewrite 2.1.5 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action07]

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Mark_Hakkenin

<AllanJ> ACTION: Mark_Hakkinen to rewrite 2.1.5 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action08]

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Mark_Hakkinen

<AllanJ> ACTION: Alan to rewrite 2.1.6 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action09]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-63 - Rewrite 2.1.6 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [on Alan Cantor - due 2008-11-06].

<AllanJ> ACTION: Alan to rewrite 2.1.7 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action10]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-64 - Rewrite 2.1.7 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [on Alan Cantor - due 2008-11-06].

<Alan> Done.

<Alan> Bye!

<Alan> exit

<AllanJ> ACTION: Kelly to rewrite 3.1.1 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action11]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-65 - Rewrite 3.1.1 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [on Kelly Ford - due 2008-11-06].

<AllanJ> ACTION: Markku to rewrite 2.1.5 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action12]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-66 - Rewrite 2.1.5 to be active voice with condtionals at the beginning [on Markku Hakkinen - due 2008-11-06].

<AllanJ> ACTION: Jim to post 'final' versions of 2.1.2 - 2.1.4 to Jeanne for inclusion in survey for next meeting [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action13]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-67 - Post 'final' versions of 2.1.2 - 2.1.4 to Jeanne for inclusion in survey for next meeting [on Jim Allan - due 2008-11-06].

<AllanJ> ACTION: Jeanne to create survey for next meeting for final versions of 2.1.2 - 2.1.4 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html#action14]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-68 - Create survey for next meeting for final versions of 2.1.2 - 2.1.4 [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2008-11-06].

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133  of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/membership/participation/
Succeeded: s/B:/JB:/
Succeeded: s/KIF:/KF:/
Succeeded: s/we agrees/we agreed/
Succeeded: s/woring/wording/
Found Scribe: KFord
Inferring ScribeNick: KFord
Default Present: [Microsoft], +1.512.206.aaaa, Cantor, allanj, Jeanne, Jan, Judy, Mark_Hakkinen
Present: Jim Judy Alan Kelly Jan Jeanne
Regrets: Mark Simon
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008OctDec/0029.html
Got date from IRC log name: 30 Oct 2008
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/10/30-ua-minutes.html
People with action items: alan ja jeanne jim js kelly mark mark_hakkenin mark_hakkinen markku mth

WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines.
You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.