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<Stuart> Scribe: David Orchard
<jar> FYI, I am muted
<dorchard> scribenick: dorchard
<scribe> scribe: dorchard
<DanC> +1 cxl 30 Oct (I'll be jet-lagged)
stuart: propose next meeting after tpac is Nov 6th
Approved: Next meeting after TPAC is Nov 6th
Jonathan will scribe Nov 6th
<ht> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Oct/0012
<ht> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Drafts#curie
<ht> scribenick: ht
HT: There appears to be a new
draft, URI above
... Dated 8 October
... I've had a look at it
<scribe> scribenick: dorchard
<DanC> (above? hmm.. this one? http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2008/ED-curie-20081008/ )
<noah> Yes, I think that's it.
ht: I looked at the draft, they
tried to address all the points (#curie ref).
... they have changed whether :foo is a curie or not over
time.
... this is now legal and is a valid curie
<Stuart> as I believe is ""
<DanC> (it _is_? I can't derive :foo from the grammar in http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2008/ED-curie-20081008/ )
ht: the problem is that implies
that this is a curie with an empty string prefix as opposed to
no prefix
... the main part of the prefix is optional
<ht> [[prefix]:]
<DanC> (ok. I see now.)
<Stuart> curie := [ [ prefix ] ':' ] reference
<jar> I thought that in ':foo', the ':' gets replaced by some distinguished prefix (e.g. the base URI?) -- as in Turtle/N3
ht: they must tell us what this means
<Stuart> The draft says "A host language MAY interpret a reference value that is not preceded by a prefix and a colon as being a member of a host-language defined set of reserved values. Such reserved values MUST translate into an IRI, just as with any other CURIE
<jar> yes, me. let me dial back in. sorry
<DanC> (I'd like our minutes to quote text that's responsive to our comment. I don't remember the gist of our comment.)
<DanC> "Accordingly, CURIEs and Safe_CURIEs MUST NOT be used as values for attributes or other content that are specified to contain only URIs, IRIs, URI-references, IRI-references, etc."
<DanC> is it worth recording a TAG decision contingent on jar's review?
<Stuart> action jonathan to review the current CURIE editors draft against the changes requested by the TAG and inform the group of his disposition.
<trackbot> Created ACTION-186 - Review the current CURIE editors draft against the changes requested by the TAG and inform the group of his disposition. [on Jonathan Rees - due 2008-10-23].
<Stuart> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2008/10/tpac
stuart: EXI would like to meet mon/tues
noah: not intereste in evening meetings
discussion about tag and exi continues..
henry: I gave them feedback about xml and exi distinction
stuart: they are meeting mon/tues
henry: and I think they wanted to at least meet about my feedback.
noah: can you write up a summary for me?
<noah> Or just send some links
stuart: perhaps we should not meet if that's too hard.
noah: the big issues are around
not speed, and perhaps test case selection.
... they don't even claim speed yet.
stuart will continue to set up a meeting
stuart: any other comments on meeting schedule?
<noah> Actually, I think speed is a big issue, and I think we've said that in the past. What I was pointing out is that they don't >claim< to have a quantitative justification speed-wise until CR, or at least that's my recollection. My notion would be to remind them that they either need to come up with a justification based on speed as well as compactness, or else make the case that EXI is...
<noah> ...justified without a speed claim.
chrisl: origins of tag on plenary
day
... ian said that web arch was useless, etc. But then retracted
to 3 specific positions
raman: and I responded saying that 3 positions were not Google official positions
<ht> WRT TAG-EXI interaction, here's one relevant pointer (not on the encoding issue): http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-exi/2007Nov/0004.html
chrisl: invited ian to tech
plenary day but he declined, and more said privately.
... Issues should be done case by case, but not opt out of the
whole thing.
... Wanted a bit of discussion, perhaps some updates to web
arch, but most of it is good and should be followed.
... title of talk at plenary changed over time, the first was a
little too rushed.
... hoping you find the new title better
raman: I like the title
I won't be there..
<noah> I think the missing bit in recipe vs. blueprint is that the consequences of bad cooking are pretty localized to those eating the meal. With Web arch, your app my run just fine, while the collection of such badly coded apps gradually sink the Web as a whole.
I could have easily played devil's advocate on EPRs, but no joy.
raman: how many people actually
know what web arch says? cynical answer is no...
... and you need to conform or be hit on the head..
... people do understand HTML
<Zakim> noah, you wanted to ask about format
noah: definitely want
skeptics.
... format in mind?
... add Larry Masinter?
<ChrisL> 3-5 minute intros would be good
<ChrisL> +1 to Larry.
raman: some of what is going on
should be tag's responsibility for solving, he has a *lot* of
experience.
... But one more "old guy" that the 20 year olds won't listen
to
<ht> Noah, more background on the TAG-EXI discussion: minutes from last year at http://www.w3.org/2007/11/08-exi-minutes.html; my message referenced there (with a different conclusion than I would now reach, but useful background): http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2007Nov/0014.html
noah: would like to talk about more than just web arch, and talk about findings
raman: +1 on findings
<Stuart> I think that some positive war stories would be good, and indeed some that may motivate us to re-think.
<ChrisL> Findings update the webarch dod; webarch is not just the one document
chrisl: henri sivonen was
suggested, but he's alread on the xml vs html
... I'd like to invite larry
<ChrisL> how many have benefitted from tag work
stuart: meeting adjourned
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133 of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Found Scribe: David Orchard Found ScribeNick: dorchard Found Scribe: dorchard Inferring ScribeNick: dorchard Found ScribeNick: ht Found ScribeNick: dorchard Scribes: David Orchard, dorchard ScribeNicks: dorchard, ht WARNING: No "Present: ... " found! Possibly Present: Approved ChrisL DanC Dave_Orchard Ht IBMCambridge Jonathan_Rees P2 Raman Stuart dorchard henry jar noah noah_away scribenick trackbot You can indicate people for the Present list like this: <dbooth> Present: dbooth jonathan mary <dbooth> Present+ amy Regrets: Norm_Walsh Tim_Berners-Lee Ashok_Malhotra Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2008/10/16-agenda Got date from IRC log name: 16 Oct 2008 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/10/16-tagmem-minutes.html People with action items:[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]