See also: IRC log
<scribe> Scribe: Jan
<oedipus> calling in a minute -- html call went a tad long
<oedipus> i'll still call in
<oedipus> GJR's ARIA status report:
<oedipus> ARIA Suite will now contain: 1) ARIA Roadmap; 2) Roles, States, and Properties for Accessible Rich Internet Applications (combination of 2 previously seperate documents); 3) ARIA Best Practices; and 4) ARIA Primer (new)
<oedipus> two approaches to embedding ARIA:
<oedipus> 1) no namespaces, no prefixes -- host languages reserve all attribute names matching the pattern aria-*. This allows the ARIA states and properties to be controlled by the PFWG specification, including future maintenance.
<oedipus> 2) by Namespaces in XML -- Role Attribute Module () will give @role a 'home' namespace from which it can be cited using the Namespaces in XML Recommendation technique, so that ARIA can be used in DIAL and other dialects of XHTML, which are likely to be used primarily to feed middleware, as there is no immediate prospect of this technology being picked up widely by browsers any time soon
<oedipus> GJR: ARIA work listed as 1 of 4 deliverables -- matt may of adobe in PF, but lurking more than participating
JA: CSUN coming up in 6 weeks
<scribe> ACTION: JR to Look into a TR draft of UAAG 2.0 by CSUN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/24-ua-minutes.html#action01]
<AllanJ> Jan review GL 10
<AllanJ> 10.1 Associate table cells and headers
<oedipus> UIA discussion in open a11y: http://www.linux-foundation.org/en/Accessiblity/Minutes/Minutes20080123
<AllanJ> this is just a special case of associating labels with the thing they label
<AllanJ> GR: ARIA may mitigate- collisions of bindings
<AllanJ> with screen readers you must be in table reading mode, and loose other information
<AllanJ> problems with screen reader non-stateless browsing
<AllanJ> ...forms mode, table mode, links, acronyms, etc.
<AllanJ> JR: perhaps move to interacting checkpoints
<oedipus> expert handlers CSUN 2008 panel http://accessibility.linux-foundation.org/a11yweb/presentations/csun2008/open_a11y.html
<oedipus> GJR: http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/ExplicitAssociationPatterns
<AllanJ> JA: this is good. associations are fine in isolation, what about combinitorics of associations
<AllanJ> GJR: see tabindex on ESW page
<AllanJ> second example shows using tabindex to change default tabbing order, and with screen reader you cannot be in table and forms mode at the same time
<AllanJ> example shows html 5 coding
<AllanJ> JR: if selection on Grooms last name, what is problem?
<AllanJ> GJR: depends if scope is supported.
<AllanJ> ...even if header/id binding, by navigating into form control, the title trumps all other associations, so user would have to query other information...
<AllanJ> leave forms mode, switch to table mode.
<AllanJ> JR: layers of label,
<AllanJ> JA: like conditional content
<AllanJ> JR: but its not. conditional content appears and disappears, this information is always there
<AllanJ> ... but user may had difficulty accessing it.
GR: Maybe tie in with ubiquitous web...
<AllanJ> GJR: ubiquitious web application. Screen reader users and mobile device user share similar access issues
<AllanJ> ... onus on the author.
JA: Can some of cond content
stuff handle 10.1?
... Or do we need more...
... Really think cascade of associations is really important
<scribe> ACTION: JR to Look through UAAG for things to pull together with 10.1 into a cascades of associations requirment [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/24-ua-minutes.html#action02]
GR: Maybe talk to Rich S about
... He's bringing these issues to ubiquitous web group
<AllanJ> complex table http://www.tsbvi.edu/technology/web/508/43.htm
<AllanJ> - Highlighting "Enabled elements" may be problematic in an AJAX context
<AllanJ> in AJAX the control is out of tab order. with widgets all interwoven elements what gets the highlight
<AllanJ> - what if link used as a button?
<AllanJ> - "do not rely on rendered text foreground and background colors alone" seems to mean mean "use a border"?
<AllanJ> JA: yes, use border
<AllanJ> PR is reviewing "selectors api" from WEBapi group
GR: PF is reviewing the "Selector's API" from Web Applications group
JA: Thinks AJAX one is most problematic
<oedipus> Selectors API - http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/selectors-api/
<oedipus> ABSTRACT: Selectors, which are widely used in CSS, are patterns that match against elements in a tree structure [Selectors] [CSS21]. The Selectors API specification defines methods for retrieving Element nodes from the DOM by matching against a group of selectors. It is often desirable to perform DOM operations on a specific set of elements in a document. These methods simplify the process of aquiring specific elements, especially compared with the more verbose
JR: Saying remove the out in #4
<AllanJ> JR: hilight 'recognized' elements, for elements with 'aria' roles state then aria would control highlighting
<oedipus> some users will be only able to interact with the graphic as an object, and will not be able to access content contained in the object because rather than using declaritive markup to distinguish and label the links conatined in the object are scripted links which contain no hyperlink text nor any programmatic binding to a textual equivalent defined for them
<scribe> ACTION: JR rewording ideas for 10.1. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/24-ua-minutes.html#action03]
<scribe> ACTION: JR rewording ideas for 10.2. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/24-ua-minutes.html#action04]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133 of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Found Scribe: Jan Inferring ScribeNick: Jan Default Present: Jan, Allanj, Gregory_Rosmaita Present: Jan Allanj Gregory_Rosmaita WARNING: Replacing previous Regrets list. (Old list: Kelly, Ford) Use 'Regrets+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Regrets+ Kathy, Laws WARNING: Replacing previous Regrets list. (Old list: Kathy, Laws) Use 'Regrets+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Regrets+ Peter, Parente Regrets: Peter Parente Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008JanMar/0017.html Got date from IRC log name: 24 Jan 2008 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/01/24-ua-minutes.html People with action items: jr[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]