XHTML2 WG Weekly Call

19 Dec 2007


See also: IRC log



+020768aabb, +1.763.767.aaaa, Gregory_Rosmaita, Roland, ShaneM, ShaneM_, alessio, markbirbeck, yamx
Steven, Rich




<scribe> scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita

<scribe> scribeNick: oedipus

Testing XHTML Basic 1.1

RM: testing complete, yam?

Yam: sent report to steven -- still need 2 independent implementations
... opera offers browser for japanese implementations

RM: can you approach them?

Yam: no contacts

GJR: i can follow up with openwave

Yam: steven has mentioned openwave
... produced internal version testing -- need to find out what they are doing

RM: guess it will have to wait until new year and steven's return

Yam: access input mode - requested to test by mike(tm)smith

RM: mike w3c staff, right?

Yam: staff contact for MWI

GJR: now staff contact for HTML WG

RM: find out where we are from steven's point of view -- don't know why didn't share report -- perhaps not around -- will discuss in the new year

Open Action Items

RM: processed Role comments last week -- any more shane?

shane: working through them

RM: modularization comment on IRIs

mark: thought someone took action on this -- think sent mail to RichS on this topic

RM: item in question from frank -- addressed?

mark: not yet addressed


<Roland> WD xhtml-modularization -- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007OctDec/0017

RM: underway on that one?

mark: never done anything on this -- let's ponder a moment, shall we?

[the group ponders]

RM: suggesting we plagerize schema spec for URIs?

mark: already do

RM: comment in 4.3 -- may be superfluous -- if remove note and just refer to schema should be ok

mark: ok -- wish i knew why note was added...

RM: people asked about IRIs in past
... shane, can you remove not?

shane: doing it right now -- done

RM: can close this particular item

shane: not in issue tracking system -- no formal comment on spec in comment period

RM: wouldn't do any harm to reply to poster that removing note

shane: will send response

RM: great

Name of Serialization of HTML5

RM: not sure can do much about this

<Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2007Nov/0001


GJR thoughts: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2007Nov/0006.html

RM: not sure anything to do here -- talking about XHTML5 -- consumer confusion concerns -- why not just HTML5 with XML serialization

shane: not XHTML -- nothing in common with actual HTML5

RM: just anounced public draft to be published

GJR: 26 February 2008 -- trying to move up (issuing the first public draft of HTML5)

RM: approval for issuing first WD done


RM: looking at ChrisL's approval - HTML5 spec first WD will be published next week 27 december 2007
... not sure should agonize over what HTML5 is doing

shane: agree

GJR: agree

XHTML 1.1 - xml:space in validator


[the sound of silent reading]

shane: already dealt with this

RM: complete?

shane: yes

RM: how to write up what to do in this area?

shane: moved DTDs out of TR space -- under /MarkUp now -- may be part of problem

<scribe> ACTION: Roland to sort out versioning and shortnames [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action01]

shane: if have updated WD if something is already a rec, is it our responsibility to alert the validator people

RM: dated version goes to TR space when actually recommendation -- can't replace 1.1
... also versined through dated name

shane: going forward, need to say DTD identifier is gotten to from dated name -- otherwise go to wrong DTD

RM: will review and share info with WG
... close this item in tracker

Prefix mapping in role and/or RDFa



RM: replied to item 33?

shane: yes, had as action last week

<ShaneM> http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml/vocab

shane: real topic is producing vocabulary document at end of vocabulary reference
... needs to use new content-negotiation stuff TAG currently debating; Ralph Swick offered assisstance
... plan is to produce document at URI i cited that uses RDFa to encode the vocabulary

<markbirbeck> :)

shane: think that should go long way towards resolution -- what is the default prefix in XHTML family documents -- we've said "it is this"

mark: agree (for the time-being)

<markbirbeck> (Should have '#' on the end.)

RM: going to be a while before finish?

shane: before end of year -- relatively simple, just has to be done

<ShaneM> ACTION: ShaneM to produce a vocabulary document that will go at the vocab# URI and use RDFa to annotate the items. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action02]

RM: ok, we can move on then...
... state of HTML5 still in flux -- just received note from Ian Jacobs -- in middle of publishing moratorium

Legacy Module


shane: m12n 2 doesn't have legacy module -- doesn't mean can't, just don't have one
... 2 issues: 1) put those in legacy module; 2) should there be a legacy module in XHTML2 or not -- should it be part of language or available to those extending language

RM: shouldn't make decision until discern what legacy will be needed
... how to dispose of note - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2007Aug/0009

shane: [re-reads comment] suggesting we make changes to what is in legacy module for 1.1 -- asking us to add things to 1.1
... it isn't a bad suggestion --

RM: anyone any thoughts on this?

shane: legacy module not used by anybody in reality

RM: problems with legacy module

Yam: used legacy modules to define so could apply CSS

shane: would introducing these attributes help or hurt?

Yam: if have legacy module don't think will hurt

<ShaneM> Concerned that adding things to legacy will change conformance requirements...

RM: please think about it shane and yam and everyone else -- return to it in new year -- been around for a long time, so should clear ASAP

shane: want to hear StevenP's opinion on it, too

RM: will discuss in new year

@Talign (erratum)


azkim, draft minutes

shane: DL with "type" attribute -- this is ancient stuff -- asking for reply to older post; HTML4 comment not our balliwick -- comment about modularization legacy which can't find (no pointer provided)

RM: no reference to previous note

shane: found it -- sent on 27 july -- found in personal mailbox
... sent to html-editor -- says DL doesn't take type attribute in m12n -- he's right
... think i can just fix it -- have to update the decisions and comments document

<ShaneM> ACTION: Update M12N DoC and M12N to remove the erroneous @type from the dl element in legacy. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action03]

RM: you'll reply to commenter directly as well

shane: yes

XML Schema implementation for XHTML 2.0 (request from UWA WG)


shane: already responded and told them we will do it

RM: ok another issue cleared

Items relating to CURIES

RM: syntax problems

Suffix ambiguity: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2007JanMar/0066.html

Syntax problems (PR#8010) - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007JanMar/0051

Comments on WD-curie-20070307 - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html-editor/2007AprJun/0000

RM: double colon is valid -- first colon delimiter, second part of URI -- first prefix has to be named
... thought we investigated this

shane: numbers are in hex without leading zero

RM: http://blah.blah[hexvalue]

<markbirbeck> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6#Literal_IPv6_addresses_in_URLs

[much reading and pondering]

<markbirbeck> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6#Notation

mark: to get double-colon using feature that allows substitution of two colons for zero
... could be six quadruple zeros

shane: what's the real issue?
... is it actually a problem?

mark: if an IPv6 appears without protocol at front and relative path at end can be (mark can you finish your thought in IRC?)

<markbirbeck> i.e., if it's possible to have this: "[dead::beef]", then we hvae a problem.

<markbirbeck> But...

<markbirbeck> if you have to hvae this: "http://[dead::beef]/" then we don't.

2 minute warning

<markbirbeck> ...just looking at rfc 2732 ...

MB: like hostname

shane: has to have scheme


shane: ever replied to this?
... check and see if in issue tracking system

RM: quoting "alternatively, the ambiguity brackets... could be disposed of using suffixes and CURIEs"

it's a might be a problem, not a documented problem

shane: what to do with this

mark: need to reply

shane: typing it now -- i'll do it (curie suffix URI ambiguity)

GJR wants to publicly thank shane for work on improving the W3C diffmarking service

mark: clarify -- "CURIE syntax document should warn..." -- should just tighten up -- should say thanks for comment we will be tightening up

RM: some other CURIE bits and RDFa module issues -- syntax issues and comments; let's work our way through this on list and get onto more current issues

<markbirbeck> happy Xmas everyone!

<yamx> Season's greetings and happy holidays!

set logs public

rrsagent set logs public

<ShaneM> ahh okay

thanks shane

<ShaneM> my cats are climbing my xmas tree - way funny

my cats are climbing me and have been all telecon long - not very funny (well, it would be if i weren't the object of their climbing)

<alessio> haha

who's in the 763 area code?

<ShaneM> me


<Roland> minutes now look good, thanks for scribing

no problem -- just trying to tie up loose ends

<Roland> excellent

roland, do you know who the other mystery phone number belongs to?


<Roland> could be mark birbeck


<Roland> looks like a London number

sometimes the syntax for correcting/removing numbers doesn't seem to work, other times it does...

<Roland> 020768 is the start of Mark.B's phone number

should i just leave the numbers in the attendees list?

<Roland> I do not think they create any difficulties


<Roland> thanks again. Season's Greetings!

same to you!

<alessio> same to you :)

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: Roland to sort out versioning and shortnames [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: ShaneM to produce a vocabulary document that will go at the vocab# URI and use RDFa to annotate the items. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: Update M12N DoC and M12N to remove the erroneous @type from the dl element in legacy. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html#action03]
[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.128 (CVS log)
$Date: 2008/03/13 15:52:42 $

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/opera/openwave/
Succeeded: s/Zwick/Swick/
Succeeded: s/postname/hostname/
FAILED: s/postname/hostname/
Found Scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita
Found ScribeNick: oedipus
Default Present: Roland, +1.763.767.aaaa, ShaneM_, Gregory_Rosmaita, alessio, yamx, +020768aabb, markbirbeck
Present: +020768aabb +1.763.767.aaaa Gregory_Rosmaita Roland ShaneM ShaneM_ alessio markbirbeck yamx
Regrets: Steven Rich
Got date from IRC log name: 19 Dec 2007
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2007/12/19-xhtml-minutes.html
People with action items: doc m12n roland shanem update

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