W3C

I18N ITS WG

24 Aug 2005

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Christian, Diane, Felix, Goutam, Karunesh, Richard, Yves
Regrets: Andrzej, Tim
Chair
Yves
Scribe
Christian

Contents


 

Action Items

<YvesS> public void CallHelp (string p_sFile)

<YvesS> {

<YvesS> MessageBox.Show("TODO: call help file "+p_sFile);

<YvesS> }

<YvesS> public void CallHelp (string p_sFile)

<YvesS> {

<YvesS> MessageBox.Show("TODO: call help file "+p_sFile);

<YvesS> }

<YvesS> http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqCulturalAspects

RI: pending

<scribe> ACTION: ITEMS to 1.2. FS to contact person for ATOM [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action01]

<fsasaki> ACTION: ITEM to RI to contact person from W3C about feedback from non-wg members (pending) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action02]

cl: describes the rationale behind the change in the http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqCulturalAspects req
... ability to refer to non-textual content
... catching up s.t. from Tim
... he would like to see a controlled vocabulary for style
... I think we did not discuss that

yves: do we need a mechanism for extension?

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.3. CL to put a note about content style. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action03]

<chriLi> YS: CL has put in comments

cl: having a recommended set of values would be nice (if it could be extended)

yves: we have to look at style values

<chriLi> felix: coming up with set of recommendations presumably will be difficult

<chriLi> yves: I will modify the wiki page

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.4. Felix to create a reading list about the different mechanisms for mapping solutions. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action04]

<chriLi> felix: reading list has been posted

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0040.html

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to for all browse readling list and suggest subset which should be read [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action05]

<chriLi> yves: for next meeting please complete the action item

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.6. YS to adapt changes from WD into the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action06]

<chriLi> yves: done for everything labeled "WD"; in addition for "almost WD"

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.7. YS to adapt changes in the "Unique Identifier" requirement. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action07]

<YvesS> http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505ReqUniqueID

<chriLi> yves: I have done this

<chriLi> yves: ready for WD

<chriLi> felix: think it is ready

<chriLi> yves: will turn into WD

<YvesS> http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505Translatability

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.8. YS to drop paragraph from Indicator of Translatability requirement. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action08]

<chriLi> yves: done

<chriLi> yves: Req. should also be turned into WD

<chriLi> Richard: Nice use case: indicate translatibility of keywords, or tags

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.9. YS to gather definitions for I18N/L10N from the various groups. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action09]

<chriLi> yves: discussed with Richard who now owns the item

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.10. YS to get information about hotels in Antibes, together with FS to find one hotel. (done) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action10]

<chriLi> yves: will discuss at end of meeting

<chriLi> ACTION: ITEM to 1.11 YS to take the requirements sections he owns in the WD back to the wiki. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action11]

<YvesS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0036.html

<chriLi> yves: basically done

Discuss feedback from EML presentation

<chriLi> yves: Felix send feedback by mail

<fsasaki> cl: one comment

<fsasaki> .. about the usage of processing instructions

<YvesS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0036.html

<fsasaki> .. a comment from eric van der vlist

<fsasaki> .. I heard that pi might not make it into a future version of xml - is it a rumor?

<fsasaki> .. another point: only the syntax of a PI is standardized

<fsasaki> .. that is, they can really be misused

<fsasaki> .. I take erics comments very seriously, but we should take PI problems into account

<fsasaki> Yves: I see PI problems as well

<GoutamSaha> Hi Karunesh, have you decide to attend f2f meeting ?

felix: even if sth. happens to PIs in a future version of XML, it will be backward compatible

yves: I noted the comments on UBL
... presumably, UBL could make use of some presentational aspects for i18n

richard: I guess we are not talking about presentational aspects, but about semantic markup

yves: examples would be related to ruby and bidi

felix: One solution would be to define sth. on an abstract level, and then recommend a concrete implementation

<GoutamSaha> Hi Karunesh, we will have very good opportunity to learn the technologies from Yves, Felix at the f2f meeting

felix: I suggest that we tackle ruby at our f2f

<r12a> Dear colleagues,

<r12a> The ITS WG would like to include definitions of "internationalization" and "localization" in the document "Internationalization and Localization Markup Requirements" http://www.w3.org/TR/itsreq/

<r12a> We thought the I18N Activity would have already something (at least for "internationalization"). But it turned out that we were wrong. As far as we can tell, there is no "standard" definitions for these two terms.

<r12a> The GEO-WG has, some time ago, tried to worked out something, but set the work aside while it tried to find time to resolve some of the concerns that were voiced relating to the definition of 'internationalization'. (The definition of 'localization' did not raise much controversy.)

<r12a> It seems rather logical and quite important for our Activity to have a consensus on a definition for two terms that we see all over its published material.

<r12a> The short definitions we used so far at the ITS-WG are close to the more elaborated drafts worked out by the GEO-WG. So it was suggested to start from the GEO's definitions. I have looked these over and changed a few things from the original wording, and Richard has made some other modifications based on comments made last October.

<r12a> So, see below a proposed wording for "internationalization". Note that ITS may not need the last two paragraphs.

<r12a> I'll send the draft definition for "localization" in a separate email thread to allow separate comments.

<r12a> Cheers,

<r12a> -yves

<r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/tutorials/ruby/en/all.html

felix: If this would be on the reading list, would we be able to discuss at f2f
... I will prepare the discuss if Richard can critique my draft

F2F Agenda

<YvesS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0041.html

<scribe> ACTION: (for Felix) prepare Ruby info for F2F [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action12]

<YvesS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0041.html

<scribe> ACTION: (for Yves) prepare indicator of translatability [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action13]

<scribe> ACTION: (for all) prepare possible questions related to XSD (see reading list from Felix) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action14]

<fsasaki> cl: is there anything we should look at in advance?

<fsasaki> yves: if you have ideas, please put them in writing

<GoutamSaha> dear yves & felix, I believe that our two xml documents that I have sent you all over last two weeks are must for translability. You may think over it.

yves: please share anything that may help to prepare for the meeting (e.g. thoughts related to the implementation of constraints)

<GoutamSaha> Hi Felix & Yves, these two documents will be of immense help towards meaningful translability

felix: WD should go out to the public soon after the F2F

yves: we need editors for the additional documents; any volunteers?

felix: I might be able to co-edit (with an additional editor) the implementation document, but I need a co-editor. please think about becoming an co-editor and check with your employer if you can get time for that.

<scribe> ACTION: (for all) to think about becoming an co-editor of the recomendation which describes the implementation of ITS [added from Felix manually to http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#actionitseditor]

Req: Limited impact

<fsasaki> felix: we need an additional editor, please think about it

<YvesS> http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0505LimitImpact

yves: felix, where should be put "The requirement in the Schema versus in the XML document"?

felix: not having it in the req. doc (just in the guidelines) would be fine
... comment on namespace: read up on this in the tutorial on xml schema

<scribe> ACTION: (for all) read up on namespaces [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action15]

yves: is the req "limited impact" ready for WD?

felix: it's ready
... CL should take "definition of 'data category'" as action item

<GoutamSaha> Hi Colleagues, we need to concentrate on how to narrow down the large domain of namespace. We are facing problem on handling such a large domain namespace.

yves: We had a definition in our list of definitions. It vanished.

<YvesS> http://esw.w3.org/topic/its0504ReqKeyDefinitions?action=diff&rev2=6&rev1=5

<scribe> ACTION: ITEM to (for Yves) reestablish def for "data category" [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action16]

Hotel for F2F

<YvesS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2005JulSep/0026.html

diane: How do we travel from Antibes to Sophia?

yves: bus or rental car
... I suggest to book Aldo
... The St. Charles would be a possible backup (since it is close to Aldo)

<scribe> ACTION: (for all) book hotel [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action17]

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: (for all) to think about becoming an co-editor of the recomendation which describes the implementation of ITS [added from Felix manually to http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#actionitseditor]
[NEW] ACTION: (for all) book hotel [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action17]
[NEW] ACTION: (for all) prepare possible questions related to XSD (see reading list from Felix) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action14]
[NEW] ACTION: (for all) read up on namespaces [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action15]
[NEW] ACTION: (for Felix) prepare Ruby info for F2F [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action12]
[NEW] ACTION: (for Yves) prepare indicator of translatability [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action13]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to (for Yves) reestablish def for "data category" [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action16]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.11 YS to take the requirements sections he owns in the WD back to the wiki. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action11]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.3. CL to put a note about content style. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.4. Felix to create a reading list about the different mechanisms for mapping solutions. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.6. YS to adapt changes from WD into the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.7. YS to adapt changes in the "Unique Identifier" requirement. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action07]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.8. YS to drop paragraph from Indicator of Translatability requirement. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action08]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to 1.9. YS to gather definitions for I18N/L10N from the various groups. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action09]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEM to for all browse readling list and suggest subset which should be read [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action05]
[NEW] ACTION: ITEMS to 1.2. FS to contact person for ATOM [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action01]
 
[PENDING] ACTION: ITEM to RI to contact person from W3C about feedback from non-wg members [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action02]
 
[DONE] ACTION: ITEM to 1.10. YS to get information about hotels in Antibes, together with FS to find one hotel. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/08/24-i18n-minutes.html#action10]
 
[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.127 (CVS log)
$Date: 2005/08/25 02:51:45 $