WCAG Weekly Telecon

7 Jul 2005


See also: IRC log


Alex_Li, Michael_Cooper, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, Gregg, Roberto_Scano, Chris, Christophe_Strobbe, Bengt_Farre?, Ben?, Ben, Mike, LucaMascaro, David_MacDonald, rellero, Andi, Sebastiano
Gregg_Vanderheiden, Matt_May, Tim_Boland, Roberto_Castaldo, Takayuki_Watanabe
ben_, ben, becky




<ben_> mapping document: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2005/06/30-sc-techniques-mapping.html

<rscano> ok :)

TTF Update

<ben_> scribe: ben_

<scribe> scribe: ben

mc: Wednesday calls to focus more on testing in coming weeks, would like to spend more time on Thursday calls on techniques as well as we go forward.

scripting tests are a current priority/concern

WCAG Weekly Telecon

discussing: is it possible to be comprehensive with script techniques testing?

description of some of the issues around scripting techniques: 06http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2005JulSep/0015.html01

Harvest techniques and/or tests beginning with Guideline 2.1

sc to techniques mapping: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2005/06/30-sc-techniques-mapping.html

2.1 L1 SC1

2.1 L1 SC1

bg: onclick as mechanism to get focus
... can talk about tabindex, though UA issues

<rscano> with this issue, an event with onkeypress without onclick is valid, but an event with onclick without onkeypress is not valid... so no device independence...

bg: anchors on image buttons

2.1 L3 SC1

mc: technique recommending redundant links for server-side image maps

bg: use of <map> to allow keyboard navigation

<rscano> what about GIS web applications?

yh: keyboard access to controls used in mapping programs

topic 2.2 L1 SC1

2.2 L1 SC1

yh: general technique to show time remaining04
... server-side tech to remember settings related to timeouts

bg: creating a time out with a way to turn it off
... creating a way to extend or modify time w/ script

2.2 L2 SC1

dm: need to cover animated gifs

bg: scripting technique to implement blinking via script w/ a way to turn it off

yh: css technique that lets you switch between using animated vs. static images

2.2 L2 SC2

bg: script tech for first SC also applies

mc: animated gif as well

yh: pausing multimedia (author issue or user agent issue?)

<rscano> depends

dm: use of script to make text shake, there should be a script technique to make it stop shaking.

<rscano> depends from the object proprieties and how the browser embed it

<rscano> Luca?

al: techniques around ticker-tape scrolling?

<LucaMascaro> I suggest to use a SMIL file to general technique

<rscano> other object that can move are: java ticker, object (flash animations, multimedia objects), markup (SVG, ...), CSS...

<LucaMascaro> I am a problem with microphone

<rscano> blink attribute

2.2 L3 SC1

yh: general technique on how to design content without requiring timing

<rscano> online test can be an example

mc: address online testing

2.2 L3 SC2

yh: meta-refresh technique

bg: general scripting technique for turning things off

mc: javascript alerts?

bg: issues around allowing users to turn off alerts
... might be a technique to allow people to prevent alerts

2.2 L3 SC3

yh: server-side techniques around keeping data while awaiting re-authentication

<rscano> this is a server-side issue that we cannot charge on the web content developer

yh: store intermediate results on multi-part surveys

(stored on the server)

bg: checking to find out if timeout is about to occur and allowing users to submit before timeout occurs

2.3 L1 SC1

yh: use robots.txt to exclude violating content from search engines
... general techniques for how to provide a good warning and using entry pages

<rscano> ora a door-page

mc: issues around controlling path users use to get to a page

<rscano> there are no PICS Label that can do this?

mc: scripting technique that can check preferences before serving problem content

mb: splash page that warns of issue before playing

yh: use a checkbox on a page that presents a warning before presenting content

al: just don't do it

<David> That's should be a general techniue

bc: general technique for how to evaluate for problematic content

2.3 L3 SC1

mc: foreground/background issues w/ HTML/CSS on this?

mb: general technique - some way to determine whether or not they are violating this

guide doc/general techniques need to address what the problem space around these criterion are

2.4 L1 SC1

yh: <link> and <a> in HTML
... also header elements
... lists and groups of links

bg: can reference DHTML Roadmap work here

mc: HTML/Script technqiue for javascript URL (sometimes navigational feature, sometimes not) -- if you're using this as a navigational feature, don't.

yh: onclick event handlers that take you to another page

mc: autosubmit combo boxes

2.4 L2 SC1

yh: should also be one on table of contents
... server-side tech about using search engines
... general techniques about linking to related content
... how to assign effective metadata
... allowing users to search as well as browse

bg: script tech from a list apart - use link element to create drop-down menus

yh: providing links to most popular content

2.4 L2 SC2

bg: CSS to allow keyboard users to view skip links

yh: perhaps revise HTML 9.7 to be more general? (currently applies only to link groups)

mc: ideally, using <div> would help

yh: using headers helps

mc: using tables can also be helpful

yh: technique to hide repeated content?

2.4 L2 SC3

yh: general technique for writing a good title
... general technique about titles being unique?

topic 2.4 L2 SC4

yh: use spacer gif in link text so that it is not visible

<Yvette> yh: where alt for spacer gif gives additional clarification

2.4 L3 SC1

yh: negative technique around illogical HTML source order corrected by CSS

mc: for imagemaps, area element should exist in source code in reasonable order

dm: focus order for javascript menus

yh: HTML forms, if multiple submit buttons, be sure the first one is the one you want to be default (may fit better under 2.1)

2.4 L3 SC2

dm: breadcrumb navigation (server-side)

could also be HTML

yh: using icons and color to differentiate sections of a site

breadcrumb technique above may fit better under general

mc: techniques around use of <link> element

yh: negative technique around breaking the back button?
... using different colors on visited vs. unvisited links

<David> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2005/06/30-sc-techniques-mapping.html

<rscano> and different styles, not only colour ;-)

<David> http://www.eramp.com/david/general/

<Becky> scribe: becky

2.5 L1 SC1

dm: see #1 in url posted above

mc: client side validation and scripting alert
... client side validation and add error text via the DOM

dm: validation of credit card formats

yh: gen. tech for writing understandable 401 or 404 pages

mb: provide tech. to provide a guess when desired page is not found "smart 404"

<David> http://www.realisis.ca/darcy

<David> here is myfavorite 404

<rscano> note that not all the server admin let to customize these pages

bc: techs for when move a url to redirect to correct page

2.5 L2 SC2

mc: some of above listed techs might fall better under hear

yh: google "did you mean" example
... provide a list of words that are similar; type 3 letters and provide a list of choices that begin with those letters
... use soundex codes

<LucaMascaro> Google suggest? http://www.google.com/webhp?complete=1&hl=en

yh: show similar search results/matches

<Yvette> yh: especially if exact matches are not found

dm: in page link from error message to field with the error

<LucaMascaro> a featured link in amazon?

cs: query enhancements

GL 2.5 L2 SC3

<rscano> bye

yh: gen tech. about dividing processes into steps and allowing forward and backward nav.

dm: return a new form with only the incorrect fields available

bg: alert/pup-up with "Are you sure?" and ok, cancel

dm: programmatically provide supplemental information - tooltips with addn. info or help

bc: is a bugzilla feature

yh: server side tech that allows users to log back in, see past transactions and cancel

GL 2.5 L3 SC1

dm: confirmation window opens to show user action has completed

yh: provide spell checking

mc: help bubbles

yh: tooltips using title

dm: do not use same words or letter combinations to begin each item of the list

yh: providing help link on every page
... (annoying) assistant in the corner of the page

GL 3.1 L1 SC1

cs: html text directionality

mc: use of meta tag with content-language
... not sure that is supported/valid

cs: text dirction: http://www.w3.org/International/geo/html-tech/tech-lang.html#ri20040728.121940236

<Becky> mc: not sure that is supported/valid

mc: not sure that meta tag with content-language is supported

yh: tech about how to use templates - put language in just once in the template. this could also be used in many other areas

GL 3.1 L2 SC1

cs: text directionality also applies here

<David> gotta go...cheers...

yh: what to do if specify more than one language in header?

mc: needs more discussion

GL 3.1 L3 SC1

(note) we are working from mapping doc url at beginning of discussion - it may not map exactly with current draft)

mc: link rel="glossary"

bg: provide definitions via bubble help

yh: gen tech to provide hyperlinks to relavent online dictionarys

GL 3.1 L3 SC2

bg: provide a way to highlight important words in the content via button press and scripting/css

yh: definition lists

mc: via internal linking

GL 3.1 L3 SC3

yh: same techns that we already have for finding definitions

mc: expanded form presented first time it is used and acronym is presented in parends after - then use acronym in subsequent references

yh: provide search engine to look up - can be used for several of these SC

GL 3.1 L3 SC4

yh: tech how to mark up section titles

bg: gen tech of how to write descriptive titles

GL 3.1 L3 SC 5

<ben_> lots of general techniques for this one - http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-WCAG20-GENERAL-20050630/meaning-supplements.html

mb: provide recommendations on how to provide the alternatives

yh: font load the document - make first paragraph the summary
... css tech about how to make sure people notice the text summary by using diff. presentation style
... style sheet switcher or script tech. to switch between diff. version of a doc.

<sebastiano> I've to go, cheers

yh: make sure spoken version of text content is not started automatically in the background or only at the user's request

got thru harvesting techniques through GL 3.1

rsagent, generate minutes

<LucaMascaro> bye

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.126 (CVS log)
$Date: 2005/07/07 22:01:30 $

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

[Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.126  of Date: 2005/05/16 16:49:48  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/saying you can't use server-side image maps/recommending redundant links for server-side image maps/
Found Scribe: ben_
Inferring ScribeNick: ben_
Found Scribe: ben
Found Scribe: becky
Inferring ScribeNick: Becky
Scribes: ben_, ben, becky
ScribeNicks: ben_, Becky
Default Present: Alex_Li, Michael_Cooper, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, Gregg, Roberto_Scano, Chris, Christophe_Strobbe, Bengt_Farre?, Ben?, Ben, Mike, LucaMascaro, David_MacDonald, rellero, Andi, Sebastiano
Present: Alex_Li Michael_Cooper Yvette_Hoitink Becky_Gibson Gregg Roberto_Scano Chris Christophe_Strobbe Bengt_Farre? Ben? Ben Mike LucaMascaro David_MacDonald rellero Andi Sebastiano
Regrets: Gregg_Vanderheiden Matt_May Tim_Boland Roberto_Castaldo Takayuki_Watanabe
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2005JulSep/0005.html
Got date from IRC log name: 7 Jul 2005
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2005/07/07-wai-wcag-minutes.html
People with action items: 

WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines.
You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.

[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]