IRC log of tagmem on 2002-03-04
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 15:00:41 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #tagmem
- 15:00:48 [TimBL]
- RRSAgent, help
- 15:00:49 [DanC]
- RRSAgent, pointer?
- 15:00:49 [DanC]
- See http://www.w3.org/2002/03/04-tagmem-irc#T15-00-49
- 15:03:31 [DanC]
- * Paul's notes from Technical Plenary TAG session Paul Cotton (Thu,
Feb 28 2002)
- 15:03:31 [DanC]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2002Feb/0077.html
- 15:11:53 [DanC]
- Zakim, this will be tag
- 15:11:54 [Zakim]
- ok, DanC
- 15:22:22 [DanC]
- "In addition, a report on the discussions at the workshop will be
made public after the meeting." -- http://www.w3.org/XML/2001/07/XMLPM.html
- 15:27:14 [Stuart]
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- 15:28:37 [TimBL]
- Zakim, this is TAG
- 15:28:38 [Zakim]
- sorry, TimBL, I do not see a conference named 'TAG'
- 15:28:41 [DanCon]
- DanCon has joined #tagmem
- 15:28:58 [TimBL]
- ooops
- 15:29:08 [DanCon]
- oops;
- 15:29:11 [DanCon]
- see you in the telcon.
- 15:29:28 [Zakim]
- TAG_Weekly()10:30AM has now started
- 15:29:32 [Zakim]
- +TimBL
- 15:29:36 [TimBL]
- Zakim, this is TAG
- 15:29:37 [Zakim]
- ok, TimBL
- 15:29:40 [Zakim]
- +??P5
- 15:30:10 [TimBL]
- Zakim, ??P5 is Stuart
- 15:30:11 [Zakim]
- +Stuart; got it
- 15:30:17 [TimBL]
- Zakim, who is here?
- 15:30:18 [Zakim]
- I see TimBL, Stuart
- 15:30:39 [Zakim]
- +DanC
- 15:31:00 [Zakim]
- +ChrisL
- 15:31:55 [DanCon]
- frap; my ssh tunnel is acting up
- 15:32:12 [Zakim]
- +??P6
- 15:32:15 [Zakim]
- +??P8
- 15:32:33 [Roy]
- Roy has joined #tagmem
- 15:32:43 [DanCon]
- Zakim, who's here?
- 15:32:44 [Zakim]
- I see TimBL, Stuart, DanC, ChrisL, ??P6, ??P8
- 15:32:54 [TimBL]
- Zakim, ??P6 is PaulC
- 15:32:55 [Zakim]
- +PaulC; got it
- 15:33:05 [Roy]
- I need the phone number
- 15:33:20 [DanCon]
- tel:+1.617.761.6200
- 15:33:22 [Stuart]
- +1 617 761 6200 I think
- 15:33:28 [Stuart]
- then 0824#
- 15:33:40 [Zakim]
- + +1.604.873.aaaa
- 15:33:41 [TimBL]
- Zakim, ??P8 is Norm
- 15:33:42 [Zakim]
- +Norm; got it
- 15:33:57 [TimBL]
- Zakim, 604 is TimBray
- 15:33:58 [Zakim]
- sorry, TimBL, I do not recognize a party named '604'
- 15:34:05 [DanCon]
- Zakim, +1.604.873.aaaa is TimBray
- 15:34:06 [Zakim]
- +TimBray; got it
- 15:34:06 [Zakim]
- +??P10
- 15:34:11 [TimBL]
- Zakim, +1.604 is TimBray
- 15:34:12 [Zakim]
- sorry, TimBL, I do not recognize a party named '+1.604'
- 15:34:24 [DanCon]
- Zakim, ??P10 is RoyF
- 15:34:25 [Zakim]
- +RoyF; got it
- 15:34:30 [DanCon]
- Zakim, who's here?
- 15:34:30 [TimBL]
- Zakim, who isn't here?
- 15:34:31 [Zakim]
- I see TimBL, Stuart, DanC, ChrisL, PaulC, Norm, TimBray, RoyF
- 15:34:31 [Zakim]
- I don't understand your question, TimBL.
- 15:34:47 [DanCon]
- regrets from IanJ
- 15:34:59 [DanCon]
- ========== Convene
- 15:35:02 [DanCon]
- Zakim, who's here?
- 15:35:03 [Zakim]
- I see TimBL, Stuart, DanC, ChrisL, PaulC, Norm, TimBray, RoyF
- 15:35:23 [TimBL]
- http://www.w3.org/2002/03/04-tag.html
- 15:35:26 [DanCon]
- agenda etc: http://www.w3.org/2002/03/04-tag
- 15:35:36 [DanCon]
- Last modified: $Date: 2002/03/05 23:10:05 $
- 15:36:40 [DanCon]
- [some confusion about the agenda...]
- 15:36:57 [DanCon]
- agenda+ admin, review of minutes
- 15:37:08 [DanCon]
- agenda+ * Technical Plenary - short report - issues arising?
- 15:37:18 [DanCon]
- agenda+ 1. Creative writing: dividing up the TOC
- 15:37:32 [DanCon]
- agenda+ * XML namespace issues. Mixed namespaces. Issue 13.
- 15:38:34 [DanCon]
- -------- Action review
- 15:38:54 [DanCon]
- -- XML PM workshop stuff...
- 15:40:18 [DanCon]
- http://www.w3.org/XML/2001/07/xmlpm-minutes.html
- 15:41:02 [DanCon]
- ACTION DanC: check with workshop chair, make them available
to the public, per CFP
- 15:41:13 [DanCon]
- DONE: Summarize XMl PM workshop
- 15:41:39 [DanCon]
- PaulC: dan, when you're done making them public, lemme know so I can
re-send to www-tag, OK?
- 15:41:42 [DanCon]
- DanCon: OK
- 15:41:52 [DanCon]
- DONE: Kick off discusiion of mixed namespace interpretation on
www-tag
- 15:41:57 [DanCon]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2002Feb/0190.html
- 15:42:11 [DanCon]
- --
- 15:42:17 [DanCon]
- going back to the top of the list...
- 15:42:29 [DanCon]
- "Summarize different approaches currently used for mapping URIs to
media types."
- 15:42:34 [DanCon]
- not quite clear who's doing what...
- 15:43:03 [DanCon]
- ACTION RoyF CONTINUES.
- 15:43:33 [DanCon]
- from 12Feb, Paul requested to withdraw "Summarize TAG findings on
using URIs: (a) use URIs when naming in context of Web (2) should be
able to follow URI to explanatory material (3) software is not required
to follow a URI when processing it"
- 15:44:15 [Zakim]
- +DOrchard
- 15:45:10 [DanCon]
- action comes from 15:52:56 http://www.w3.org/2002/02/12-tagmem-irc
- 15:45:16 [DanCon]
- ACTION PaulC CONTINUES.
- 15:45:51 [DanCon]
- ACTION TimBL CONTINUES:
- 15:45:53 [DanCon]
- "Add a section on datatypes to the TAG arch doc toc."
- 15:45:57 [DanCon]
- from 12Feb.
- 15:46:26 [DanCon]
- re TBL 12 Feb "In 28 Jan findings, propose alternative wording to
section on namespace-based dispatching"
- 15:46:32 [DanCon]
- ACTION TimBL CONTINUES.
- 15:47:49 [DanCon]
- ACTION TimBL CONTINUES: "In 28 Jan findings, change "Should" to
"Must" where appropriate."
- 15:48:04 [DanCon]
- ACTION IJ CONTINUES: "Integrate findings into TAG arch doc toc."
- 15:48:25 [Stuart]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2002Feb/att-0102/01-uriMediaType-9.html
- 15:48:25 [DanCon]
- DONE: SW "Write up that the TAG approves of IETF draft from Don
Eastlake with "http:" instead of "content-type:"."
- 15:49:16 [DanCon]
- Roy: [something...]
- 15:49:29 [DanCon]
- DONE: TBray: "Write a proposal to suggest that URNs not be used for
namespace URIs."
- 15:50:05 [DanCon]
- re "Ask Philipp Hoschka to take a new HTTP requirement on idempotent
POST-like method to IETF liaison teleconference. Include the XForms WG
in the loop." TBL from 18Feb.
- 15:51:26 [DanCon]
- Roy: I'm not sure what this is about...
- 15:53:27 [DanCon]
- reviewing the log, it seems related to "whenToUseGet-7
- 15:53:28 [DanCon]
- "
- 15:53:36 [DanCon]
- ACTION TBL WITHDRAWN.
- 15:54:08 [DanCon]
- it came from 22:25:37 http://www.w3.org/2002/02/12-tagmem-irc
- 15:54:26 [DanCon]
- DONE: TBray: "Rewrite point 14 of Architectural Theses on Namespaces
and Namespace Documents per discussion at 18 feb teleconference."
- 15:55:01 [DanCon]
- ACTION PaulC/Ian: draft summary of TAG work to date. DONE.
- 15:56:51 [DanCon]
- "Here is my draft report using my outline. ... " -- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2002Mar/0002.html
- 15:58:06 [DanCon]
- TBL/DanC: style is kinda formal; be more chatty?
- 15:58:21 [DanCon]
- Roy/Bray/others: it's fine; not much meat to it yet anyway.
- 15:59:29 [DanCon]
- PROPOSED: forward summary to www-tag, w3c-ac-members,
chairs@w3.org.
- 16:00:00 [DanCon]
- PaulC: I've heard requests for a separate tag announce list, FYI.
- 16:00:28 [DanCon]
- RESOLVED: forward summary to www-tag, w3c-ac-members,
chairs@w3.org.
- 16:00:39 [DanCon]
- ACTION DanC: send it out.
- 16:00:50 [DanCon]
- agenda?
- 16:01:06 [DanCon]
- ======== 2. * Technical Plenary - short report - issues arising?
- 16:01:17 [DanCon]
- PaulC: "more technical stuff" is the major feedback we got.
- 16:02:09 [DanCon]
- PaulC: I think it would be interesting for the TAG to lead discussion
of technical issue. have folks discuss them.
- 16:02:16 [DanCon]
- SW: yeah...
- 16:02:31 [DanCon]
- PaulC: no particular "please look at this issue" feedback.
- 16:03:10 [DanCon]
- DaveO: "document authoring" folks at a lunch table suggested that
'ease of authoring' is broken...
- 16:03:22 [DanCon]
- ChrisL: they seem to be asking for one big W3C namespace
- 16:04:36 [DanCon]
- PaulC: to summarize, again: the TAG session went so well that they
asked us to run the whole thing next time.
- 16:04:57 [DanCon]
- PaulC: thanks, Norm and Dan, for the nifty presentations.
- 16:06:08 [TimBL]
- ---------------------
- 16:06:10 [TimBL]
- http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/toc.html
- 16:06:33 [DanCon]
- TimBL: note it's color-coded... issues in red, ...
- 16:07:42 [DanCon]
- Bray: wasn't somebody gonna stick all the issues in there?
- 16:07:59 [DanCon]
- TBL: I did that; it was up to date at some point
- 16:08:49 [DanCon]
- RoyF: is this an index of what we're doing? or an architectural
description of the web?
- 16:08:52 [DanCon]
- TBL: both
- 16:11:58 [DanCon]
- TBray: who's maitaining this? I asked for anchors, version numbers,
etc. ... how about xmlspec DTD?
- 16:12:16 [DanCon]
- TBL: I'm maintaining it; I'm using Amaya, and I just hit save.
- 16:17:11 [DanCon]
- [lots of discussion, about what is not exactly clear]
- 16:19:50 [DanCon]
- Roy: ah... now I get it... the section heading for the 3rd bit misled
me.
- 16:20:00 [DanCon]
- "Representational State Transfer"
- 16:21:37 [DanCon]
- TBray: how about this version/last version; keeping old version
available.
- 16:22:17 [DanCon]
- TBL: I expect the blue ("working documents") bits to expand.
- 16:24:46 [DanCon]
- RoyF: so I'd like to help with the writing, but I don't see the
process.
- 16:24:53 [DanCon]
- TimBL: that's what this agenda item is about...
- 16:25:15 [TimBL]
- Zakim, q?
- 16:25:16 [Zakim]
- I see no one on the speaker queue
- 16:25:52 [DanCon]
- Bray: do we expect to point the community at this page?
- 16:25:58 [DanCon]
- DanCon: we've done that much already, no?
- 16:26:10 [DanCon]
- Bray: then I'm not comfortable; it's got stuff that we've never
discussed, typos, etc.
- 16:27:12 [DanCon]
- TimBL: this is very much a draft...
- 16:27:44 [DanCon]
- Bray: then please put a disclaimer at the top
- 16:30:03 [DanCon]
- [discussion of just what sort of disclaimer is
appropriate/sufficient]
- 16:31:28 [DanCon]
- TimBL: I'd like to assign somebody the intro, and somebody a one-page
version of each section.
- 16:31:37 [DanCon]
- [and something about slides?]
- 16:33:24 [DanCon]
- RoyF: "CHAPTER 4: Designing the Web Architecture: Problems and
Insights" belongs more in the TAG intro than in the 3rd section of our
docs.
- 16:35:42 [DanCon]
- [...]
- 16:35:58 [DanCon]
- DanCon: are folks backing out from using/wanting CVS?
- 16:36:43 [DanCon]
- Roy: my request for CVS is pending. but I still intend to use it.
- 16:37:14 [DanCon]
- TimBray: does section 4 [messages] need to be there?
- 16:37:44 [DanCon]
- TimBL: sorta like asking "does web services need to be there"? i.e.
where would you put stuff about messages and such?
- 16:38:14 [DanCon]
- q+
- 16:39:33 [DanCon]
- ?: but are they bringing us issues?
- 16:40:01 [DanCon]
- PaulC: how about having the web services architecture group to write
that stuff?
- 16:42:04 [DanCon]
- DanCon: there are issues, e.g. from RDF Core, that don't come up
until you uncover the illusion that the web never changes.
- 16:44:02 [DanCon]
- DanCon: I hope to learn about web services architecture by discussing
it here.
- 16:44:36 [DanCon]
- DaveO: so which group should develop the web services
architecture?
- 16:45:02 [DanCon]
- DanCon: I hope we'll come to agreement about what it is.
- 16:45:37 [DanCon]
- DaveO/PaulC: the Web Services architecture group is discussion "what
is a web service?" at length right now.
- 16:46:50 [Stuart]
- \me and counting... tick :-)
- 16:47:03 [DanCon]
- DaveO: I'd like this group to give the web services arch group a
framework in which to define web service.
- 16:50:18 [TimBL]
- daveO: it would be useful for them to have a glossary from us
- 16:50:34 [TimBL]
- tim: it would be useful for us to work on the glosary sonn, as we
go.
- 16:51:42 [DanCon]
- PaulC: so if we give a good grounding in the basics, other groups,
e.g. Web Services Arch, should fall in/out naturally.
- 16:51:56 [DanCon]
- [several]: sounds good.
- 16:52:53 [DanCon]
- TBL: so... back to the idea of one page on each section...
- 16:53:58 [DanCon]
- Bray/DanC/Orchard: yes, filling in the content is likely to provide
useful feedback on the TOC.
- 16:54:03 [DanCon]
- ... it's iterative.
- 16:54:04 [TimBL]
- DaveO: table of dependencies betwen specifications would be useful
asn I wouldlike to work on it.
- 16:55:06 [DanCon]
- TimBL asks DaveO to chat offline about dependencies etc....
- 16:55:19 [DanCon]
- Norm: I've been doing depenency stuff too; I'd like to be
involved.
- 16:56:45 [DanCon]
- TimBL: I'd like to attack sections in pairs, rather than having each
person stay in their field of expertise.
- 16:57:48 [DanCon]
- Norm: I'm interested in "what is a URI"
- 16:57:54 [DanCon]
- Chris: message section.
- 16:58:20 [DanCon]
- Stuart: "what is a URI" -- me too.
- 16:58:31 [DanCon]
- PaulC: message section.
- 16:58:36 [DanCon]
- ... with chris.
- 16:58:57 [DanCon]
- DanCon: I'm interested in the intro.
- 16:59:02 [DanCon]
- Bray: me too: intro.
- 16:59:32 [Zakim]
- -TimBray
- 17:00:41 [Stuart]
- On dependencies I spoke to some folks from the RDF-IG and they were
interested in 'scraping' a dependency graph out of the documents
themselves.
- 17:01:15 [TimBL]
- Applicationl State Transfer @@ retitle (Roy, DaveO)
- 17:01:45 [Zakim]
- -RoyF
- 17:01:48 [Zakim]
- -PaulC
- 17:01:49 [DanC]
- DanC has joined #tagmem
- 17:01:49 [Zakim]
- -DOrchard
- 17:01:53 [Zakim]
- -ChrisL
- 17:02:31 [Zakim]
- -TimBL
- 17:02:44 [Zakim]
- -DanC
- 17:02:45 [Zakim]
- -Stuart
- 17:02:46 [Zakim]
- -Norm
- 17:02:47 [Zakim]
- TAG_Weekly()10:30AM has ended
- 17:02:50 [DanC]
- so, tim, does the group expect more than just a pointer to the IRC
log?
- 17:11:32 [DanCon]
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