See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 11 June 2009
<noah> Hi Sam, thank you for joining us.
<rubys1> glad to be here
NM welcomes Sam Ruby, reviews agenda
NM: next week's telcon is at risk; no regrets now, though
RESOLUTION: to approve http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2009/05/28-minutes
NM: clearly success of HTML specs in
development is a high priority for W3C...
... evolution of HTML interacts with our issues on language
versioning and error handling
... we've talked about RDFa some
TVR: what news since the AC meeting; any news of your work with Steven P?
SR: the work with Steven... we looked
at RDFa as a test case...
... Ian Hickson took the RDFa requirements and produced something
different
... I think the review of RDFa by the HTML WG has turned up
technical issues...
... RDFa was designed in the context of XHTML, but it's deployed in
text/html, and that raises issues...
... there are test cases and a spec being written
(test cases? I try to keep an eye out for those. maybe I'll q+ to ask for pointers.)
<ht_redmond> Browsers are not the only HTML-consuming application. . .
NM: suppose this new spec depended on head/@profile but the editor of the main HTML 5 spec didn't specify @profile...
SR: yes, that's somewhat likely... @profile works a certain way in browsers; that's not really an issue, operationally. The only operational issue is what validator should say
<Zakim> ht_redmond, you wanted to ask about extensibility/namespaces
<rubys1> I can hear Henry fine
HT: ~1.5years ago, we discussed ARIA attributes in HTML 5...
SR: yes, I recall...
HT: it didn't work out as I would
have liked, despite my spending a lot of energy... we seem to have
aria_* attributes [or aria-* ]
... "extensibility is pretty much done" is one of the main
arguments, especially from hsivonen. Where are we on that
discussion?
SR: I think hsivonen hasn't changed his position. I don't agree, but I don't see how to convince people such as hsivonen
<Zakim> jrees, you wanted to say I want to understand html5 attitude to extension... agree with assessment "it's going to happen, how to channel it"
[scribe missed what jar refers to re attributes]
SR: [earlier] people use new attributes all the time...
TVR: Chris Wilson seems to support
extensibilty; he's moved away from the IE browser team... is he
[doing something]?
... it seems to be that anyone who has a different opinion walks
away.
[scribe struggles to record the gist of TVR's comment and SR's response]
NM: what sorts of extensibility mechanisms do you think are in play?
SR: I think various extensions for things that people care about will happen, even without an overall mechanism. ARIA, fb: etc.
<Zakim> noah, you wanted to ask more about particular extensibility mechanisms
SR: I hope to see, if not help build, validators that have some helpful approach to extensibility
NM: there's a self-describing sense to the web with a few registries (URI schemes, media types) and URI-based hooks... it looks like that's being lost with this free-for-all of fb: and aria-*
SR: I think it's worth encouraging a few other vocabularies before building the extensibility bridge
NM: but doesn't that risk 3 or 4 mechanisms that we have to support?
TVR: yes, that does look like a risk
<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to add the palm pre stuff to the list
http://www.w3.org/QA/2009/02/palm_webos_approach_to_html_ex.html
<div x-mojo-element="ToggleButton"
<jrees> original question was how can tag be helpful. no answer?
<jrees> so does the html5 wg need to know anything?
TVR: I hear that unification efforts winding down and polarization remaining; this seems that there's little opportunity for the TAG to make a difference in the coming months
NM: we'd have to show people something they don't know. "we're the tag and we think X" doesn't help much
<Zakim> ht_redmond, you wanted to ask about the AC meeting question: managing the namespace, who's on top?
NM: thanks for coming, Sam; if there's anything we can do to catalyze things, please let us know
<noah> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2009/06/23-agenda
NM: one constraint I'm working with
is that TVR is only available to dial in in our afternoons
... major goals of the meeting are * work on client-side URL
patterns [?] and * versioning
<johnk__> +1, agenda looks ok to me too
ACTION-33 due next week
<trackbot> ACTION-33 revise naming challenges story in response to Dec 2008 F2F discussion due date now next week
NM: note people identified as shepherds for sessions
ACTION-273?
<trackbot> ACTION-273 -- Ashok Malhotra to carry forward framing issues around Archicture of APIs, with help from JK and LM -- due 2009-06-04 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/273
JK: AM and LM and I talked about this
and drafted something...
... trying to frame the issue...
action-255?
<trackbot> ACTION-255 -- John Kemp to contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others -- due 2009-05-13 -- PENDINGREVIEW
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/255
close ation-255
close action-255
<trackbot> ACTION-255 Contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others closed
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Jun/0013.html
<noah> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Jun/0028.html
<noah> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Jun/0013.html
<noah> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/whenToUseGet.html
NM: maybe the "when to use get" finding should be updated to deal with malicious actors?
ACTION-255: the tag considered updating the "when to use get" finding but didn't find a critical mass of interest
<trackbot> ACTION-255 Contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others notes added
close action-255
<trackbot> ACTION-255 Contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others closed
ACTION-257?
<trackbot> ACTION-257 -- Noah Mendelsohn to invite Mark Not or Lisa D to revisit progress in IETF/HTML liaison on content sniffing -- due 2009-05-28 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/257
ACTION-264 due july 11
<trackbot> ACTION-264 Draft agenda item for upcoming telcon discussion of geolocation and privacy due date now july 11
close ACTION-270
<trackbot> ACTION-270 Provide additional material for review at F2F for Issue 41 closed
action-270?
<trackbot> ACTION-270 -- Larry Masinter to provide additional material for review at F2F for Issue 41 -- due 2009-06-22 -- PENDINGREVIEW
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/270
ACTION-272 due 15 June
<trackbot> ACTION-272 Report back to the TAG on outcome of collaboration with LM on Versioning due date now 15 June
ACTION-273 due 15 June
<trackbot> ACTION-273 Carry forward framing issues around Archicture of APIs, with help from JK and LM due date now 15 June
RESOLUTION: to cancel the TAG telcon of 18 June