15:57:32 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #json-ld
15:57:36 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-irc
15:57:36 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #json-ld
15:57:42 <TallTed> present+
15:58:55 <pchampin> present+
15:59:20 <pchampin> meeting: JSON-LD WG
15:59:20 <anatoly-scherbakov> present+
15:59:26 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
15:59:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
16:01:11 <bigbluehat> present+
16:01:13 <bigbluehat> chair+
16:01:30 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make logs public
16:05:51 <niklasl> niklasl has joined #json-ld
16:06:03 <pchampin> scribe+
16:06:13 <pchampin> agenda?
16:06:20 <bigbluehat> agendabot, find agenda
16:06:21 <agendabot> bigbluehat, OK. This may take a minute...
16:06:21 <agendabot> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/3082f1ac-c4d4-4b75-a3b9-7c0dfe877661/20260624T120000/
16:06:21 <agendabot> clear agenda
16:06:21 <agendabot> agenda+ Announcements and Introductions
16:06:22 <agendabot> agenda+ YAML-LD check-in (5-ish minutes)
16:06:24 <agendabot> agenda+ CBOR-LD check-in (5-ish minutes)
16:06:27 <agendabot> agenda+ JSON-LD Specs - PRs & Issues
16:06:29 <agendabot> agenda+ Open Discussion
16:06:30 <pchampin> zakim, open item 1
16:06:30 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Announcements and Introductions -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:06:47 <pchampin> q+
16:06:50 <bigbluehat> ack pchampin
16:07:52 <pchampin> pchampin: development on the Rust json-ld crate seems to be active again
16:08:31 <pchampin> ... I'm using it in Sophia, but it is an independant library
16:08:38 <niklasl> present+
16:09:02 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: I received a message about W3C inclusion fund accepting applications
16:09:34 <pchampin> niklasl: that's good news; I also heard about a Hackathon during TPAC; canivc.com will be part of it
16:09:39 <bigbluehat> Zakim, next item
16:09:39 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- YAML-LD check-in (5-ish minutes) -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:09:54 <pchampin> s/niklasl/bigbluehat
16:10:14 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: last week we discuss the relevance of visualizations in the spec
16:10:21 <pchampin> ... (sharing screen)
16:11:09 <pchampin> ... the visualization strictly contains what is available in the document; nodes with links are clickable
16:11:16 <pchampin> ... reviews are welcome
16:11:32 <bigbluehat> q?
16:11:39 <pchampin> q+
16:11:44 <bigbluehat> ack pchampin
16:12:47 <pchampin> bigbluehat: I'm wondering about including the IRI scheme in the properties
16:13:16 <pchampin> pchampin: to be clear: the goal is to represent the RDF graph, not the YAML structure, right?
16:13:16 <bigbluehat> Zakim, next item
16:13:16 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- CBOR-LD check-in (5-ish minutes) -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:13:16 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: correct
16:13:26 <bigbluehat> Zakim, close item 3
16:13:26 <Zakim> agendum 3, CBOR-LD check-in (5-ish minutes), closed
16:13:27 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:13:27 <Zakim> 4. JSON-LD Specs - PRs & Issues [from agendabot]
16:13:32 <bigbluehat> Zakim, open item 4
16:13:32 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- JSON-LD Specs - PRs & Issues -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:14:54 <pchampin> s|anatoly-scherbakov: correct|bigbluehat: skippin this, as Wes is not here
16:14:57 <pchampin> i|CBOR-LD check-in|anatoly-scherbakov: correct
16:15:04 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
16:15:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
16:15:43 <niklasl> q+
16:16:39 <anatoly-scherbakov> q+
16:17:11 <bigbluehat> subtopic: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/671
16:17:12 <gb> s|https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/671|-> Pull Request 671 Fix use native types flag with non-native values (by niklasl) [needs discussion] https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/671
16:17:13 <bigbluehat> ack niklasl
16:20:01 <pchampin> niklasl: this issue has been around forevever; I think that implementations do not follow the spec (they would encounter issues),
16:20:08 <pchampin> ... but instead implement the suggested change in this PR
16:20:22 <bigbluehat> ack anatoly-scherbakov
16:20:35 <pchampin> ... note that the HTML diff is easier to follow than the PR diff
16:20:37 <anatoly-scherbakov> q+
16:21:18 <pchampin> bigbluehat: I agree on the separate PR for the change on the "quote" thing
16:22:27 <pchampin> qq+
16:22:39 <bigbluehat> ack pchampin
16:22:39 <Zakim> pchampin, you wanted to react to anatoly-scherbakov
16:25:53 <pchampin> pchampin: the CI issue is due to an problem I created with common files,
16:26:09 <pchampin> ... which https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/693 (not yet merged) is supposed to fix
16:26:10 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/693 -> Pull Request 693 fix bug in Rakefile after removing common/ (by pchampin)
16:26:32 <pchampin> subtopic: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/693
16:28:27 <pchampin> pchampin: this PR is doing two things: fixing an issue created by the mutualization of common files
16:28:40 <anatoly-scherbakov> q+
16:28:42 <pchampin> ... but also commenting out the checking all the tests in the spec;
16:29:21 <pchampin> ... the reason for commenting it out is that the tools we have currently do not support JSON-LD 1.2, which the examples arex
16:29:26 <pchampin> s/arex/are
16:29:43 <pchampin> ... we can not rely on our tools being constantly up-to-date with the spec
16:29:52 <niklasl> q+
16:29:57 <pchampin> q+
16:30:10 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: IIUC, the problem is the Ruby implementation lacking a maintainer;
16:30:15 <bigbluehat> ack anatoly-scherbakov
16:30:17 <bigbluehat> ack niklasl
16:30:20 <pchampin> ... what would be the process to chose another implementation
16:30:47 <pchampin> TallTed: if we comment out, we should open an issue to keep track of this
16:31:06 <pchampin> niklasl: anatoly-scherbakov, good question, I'm conflicted.
16:31:16 <anatoly-scherbakov> q+
16:31:30 <pchampin> ... I would recommend my own tool, CONS: it is a one-man-show, no other contributors,
16:31:46 <pchampin> ... PROS: no dependency (no dependency rot, not induced security issue)
16:31:52 <bigbluehat> q?
16:31:56 <bigbluehat> ack pchampin
16:32:16 <bigbluehat> q+
16:33:13 <bigbluehat> ack anatoly-scherbakov
16:33:25 <pchampin> pchampin: anatoly-scherbakov, the problem is not so much chosing another impl, but relying on it being constantly up-to-date
16:33:33 <pchampin> ... for the dependency issue, dependabot is doing a good job
16:34:22 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: the absence of implementations should not impede the development of the spec;
16:34:44 <bigbluehat> ack bigbluehat
16:34:48 <pchampin> ... we could run the tests in a way that provides a dashboard, but does not block PRs to be merged
16:35:02 <pchampin> bigbluehat: yes, that would be useful; anatoly-scherbakov could you work on that?
16:35:19 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: yes, I could do that with PyLD, with which I'm more familiar
16:36:08 <pchampin> bigbluehat: I don't want to frame this as a change of tooling, though I'm not opposed to it
16:36:25 <pchampin> ... the main goal is to solve the race condition we have
16:36:57 <anatoly-scherbakov> +1
16:37:10 <niklasl> +1
16:37:11 <pchampin> ... let's not rush to solution; let's merge the PR to unlock other PRs, and discuss this further
16:37:12 <pchampin> +1
16:37:38 <anatoly-scherbakov> +1
16:37:48 <pchampin> ... a first action would be to tweak the GH action to be non-blocking, regardless of the implementation
16:37:57 <pchampin> ... then decide on switching to a different implementation
16:38:32 <niklasl> Apart from already having 671 in, TRLD is apparently bug-for-bug compatible with the spec even. ;D
16:38:32 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
16:38:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
16:39:36 <bigbluehat> subtopic: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/pull/481
16:39:37 <gb> s|https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/pull/481|-> https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/pull/481 "Pull Request 481 Editorial: remove comma in section 4.1.8 (issue #477) (by anatoly-scherbakov)"
16:39:40 <bigbluehat> bigbluehat: looks good to me.
16:46:01 <bigbluehat> subtopic: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/issues/558
16:46:01 <gb> s|https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/issues/558|-> Issue 558 Compaction cannot round-trip terms using `@container: @list` and `@type: @vocab` (by niklasl) [spec:enhancement] [spec:substantive] [ErratumRaised] [substantive:class 3] https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/issues/558
16:47:27 <pchampin> niklasl: I have a change for this in my implementation, I could make a PR on the spec out of it.
16:48:28 <pchampin> ... It is a shame that it is not behaving as expected, but from my organization's perspective this is not a priority.
16:48:48 <pchampin> ... It is merely a convenience.
16:50:10 <pchampin> ... We don't have a way to set `@container` to both `@set` and `@list`, where the outer array would be considered a set, and inner arrays would be considered lists
16:50:40 <pchampin> bigbluehat: agreed, very few people are going to trip over this
16:50:48 <anatoly-scherbakov> q+
16:50:54 <pchampin> ... thank you niklasl for your insight
16:51:43 <bigbluehat> subtopic: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/492
16:51:44 <gb> s|https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/492|-> Issue 492 Terms defined using list containers only preserve the latest-declared list value? (by trwnh) [needs discussion] https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/492
16:54:09 <bigbluehat> bigbluehat: related issue: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/428
16:54:09 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/428 -> Issue 428 List of lists? (by puckipedia)
16:55:27 <pchampin> bigbluehat: this relates to a discovery recently in the VCWG: selective disclosure does not play nice with JSON-LD
16:55:37 <pchampin> ... also a list-related issue, we seem to have a number of those
16:56:20 <pchampin> ... we have a week to think about that
16:56:24 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
16:56:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
16:57:10 <pchampin> subtopic: other PRs and issues
16:57:27 <pchampin> bigbluehat: I'm assuming that most of the pending errata are editorials and could be discussed in a separate meeting
16:58:35 <niklasl> q+
16:58:38 <pchampin> TallTed: the challenge is to be disciplined and not solve the issued "inline"
16:58:42 <bigbluehat> ack anatoly-scherbakov
16:58:59 <anatoly-scherbakov> https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-bp/pull/87
16:58:59 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-bp/pull/87 -> Pull Request 87 Promote vetted JSON-LD contexts (by anatoly-scherbakov)
16:59:05 <pchampin> anatoly-scherbakov: I wanted to raise a PR that I raised (above)
16:59:17 <pchampin> bigbluehat: we don't have time, but I'll add it to the discuss-call list
17:00:05 <pchampin> niklasl: I think we discussed a potential joint TPAC session with the RDF & SPARQL WG
17:00:39 <pchampin> bigbluehat: let's email the chairs and discuss the matter with them
17:00:39 <niklasl> Re. https://github.com/json-ld/json-ld-star/issues/49
17:00:40 <gb> https://github.com/json-ld/json-ld-star/issues/49 -> Issue 49 Adapting to Triple Terms and Reifiers (by gkellogg)
17:01:38 <pchampin> niklasl: I commented on the issue above, even though I know we should not spend too much time on 1.3 at the moment
17:02:35 <pchampin> bigbluehat: thanks everyone, next call in a week
17:02:38 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
17:02:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
17:03:41 <pchampin> s/anatoly-scherbakov: correct/
17:03:47 <pchampin> s/skippin this/skipping this
17:03:52 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
17:03:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
17:04:44 <pchampin> s/structure, right?/structure, right? [anatoly-scherbakov confirms]
17:04:46 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
17:04:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html pchampin
17:05:15 <pchampin> m2gbot, link issues with transcript
17:05:17 <m2gbot> comment created: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/671#issuecomment-4791767649
17:05:17 <m2gbot> comment created: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/pull/693#issuecomment-4791767777
17:05:19 <m2gbot> comment created: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/pull/481#issuecomment-4791767901
17:05:20 <m2gbot> comment created: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-api/issues/558#issuecomment-4791768023
17:05:21 <m2gbot> comment created: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/492#issuecomment-4791768139
17:05:21 <m2gbot> comment created: https://github.com/w3c/json-ld-syntax/issues/428#issuecomment-4791768218
21:00:23 <TallTed> Zakim, end meeting
21:00:23 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been TallTed, pchampin, anatoly-scherbakov, bigbluehat, niklasl
21:00:25 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
21:00:26 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/06/24-json-ld-minutes.html Zakim
21:00:32 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, TallTed; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
21:00:32 <Zakim> Zakim has left #json-ld
21:00:35 <TallTed> RRSAgent, bye
21:00:35 <RRSAgent> I see no action items