12:57:35 RRSAgent has joined #hcls 12:57:40 logging to https://www.w3.org/2026/05/29-hcls-irc 12:57:40 rrsagent, make logs public 12:57:51 Meeting: FHIR RDF -- Unified Care Model 12:57:54 Chair: David Booth 13:03:55 Present: David Booth, Ken Lord, Brian Handspicker, Brian Hefferen, Natacha Fernandez 13:04:05 Topic: Unified Care Model 13:06:01 ken: Working on OWL Unified Care Model (UCM), to be used across care domains. 13:06:43 ... Trying to create individual layers of the model, to allow them to be dev independently of others. 13:07:22 ... I'm focused on the core model, defining mostly classes, not yet properties. 13:07:45 (Ken shares screen showing class diagram) 13:08:25 ken: Entity class is what SULO calls PhysicalEntity. There are subclasses of that: Person, Device, Organization 13:09:05 ... Want the identity of the entities to be separate from the roles they play, because the roles vary across time. 13:09:54 natacha: following a modular design approach 13:10:05 s/approach/approach?/ 13:10:07 ken: Yes 13:11:14 ... And there are properties between these Entities, such as a person is associated with an Org. 13:11:49 ... Can also have SocialCareEntities, such as Community Group, Care Team, Household. 13:12:02 ... A person has membership in a social group. 13:12:59 ... Also need criteria for each group. 13:14:01 Present+ Eric_Jahn 13:14:31 Hefferen: Logic is there. 13:16:32 dbooth: Is it the same group if the membership changes? The answer will affect whether a SocialGroup is a physical entity or a conceptual entity. 13:17:05 ken: Good Q. Please raise that as an issue. 13:17:28 natacha: Pt level groups vs org level group. Is this from the perspective of org providing care? 13:17:49 ... There should also be a PatientGroups subclass. 13:18:38 ken: Could have PatientCohort groups. But also other grouping concepts, such as "Herd" of people for vaccination purposes. 13:18:55 ... The model needs to support those. 13:19:29 hefferen: The pt is still a role, though they are participating at a different level. 13:20:10 ken: That should also be recorded as an issue that we'll need to be sure the model addresses. 13:21:44 ... Any entity could be a subject (role) of an activity. 13:21:55 natacha: Could have support groups? 13:22:10 ken: Yes, the VA does trememdous work on support groups. 13:23:49 Jahn: https://github.com/eric-jahn/ucm-hcls-fhir-rdf/tree/gh-pages/docs/ucm 13:24:04 handspicker: Be careful about fixating too much on the role of "patient" as the focal point of relationships. From a social services perspective a person may be acting in the role of client. From an human services educational perspective the person may be acting in the role of a student. Etc. 13:24:45 ken: Could also have tribal affiliation, and/or medicare, etc. 13:26:14 ken: Need to separate eligibility and enrollment. 13:26:33 hefferen: And terminology in the industry is inconsistent. 13:26:53 ken: Payment gets involved in eligibility and enrollment, on social side. 13:27:15 ... Whereas in healthcare, insurance takes care of all of that, outside of the clinical domain. 13:28:20 handspicker: Re membership, is it a person that is a member of a group, or a person-in-a-role who is a member of a group? 13:29:08 ... Might want person-role as a standin for person, or practitioner-role as standin for practitioner. 13:30:07 ken: Need capability, when defining a group, to define a range for that group. Need that ability, but haven't gotten into it yet. 13:30:24 ... Tribal role may be required to be in a group. 13:31:19 hefferen: Same individual can be viewed differently depending on the role playing. 13:32:02 handspicker: Might also think how this plays out in an ed context, person in student role. That helps us think things through. 13:33:25 handspicker: So is the "person" a member of a group or is it the "person in roleOf" that is the member of a specific type of group... e.g. person in roleOf Medicaid beneficiary that is the member of a Medicaid payee group? 13:34:29 ... With regard to "group" and whether the group is the same if members change, consider the "Ship of Theseus" thought experiment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus 13:36:08 dbooth: I normally think of membership as a relation between an entity and a group. Might want to consider the pros/cons of modeling membership as a class vs as a property. 13:38:16 ken: Want to be sure we separate issues, and make it easy for subject matter experts (SMEs) to find what they need. 13:38:41 Topic: New W3C Community Group 13:39:10 jahn: Propose that we create a new W3C CG, with its own charter, its own chair, repo, etc. 13:40:03 ... Ian Jacobs suggested we create a new CG. 13:42:05 dbooth: Sounds reasonable. Upside is more focus. The only downside I see is you might need to do more to get review and input from the FHIR RDF ontology folks. 13:42:30 jahn: I don't want to lose that aspect. Want that influence. 13:42:50 ken: I think it's essential that UCM is compatible w FHIR. 13:43:17 ... Hoping Tim Prudhomme can help do that. 13:43:31 Present+ Tim_Prudhomme 13:43:55 natacha: I'm in support also. 13:44:04 dbooth: It would ease the admin burden also. 13:44:48 handspicker: WRT drinking out of the hose: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruces%27_Philosophers_Song 13:46:07 tim: Sounds good to me. The repo that FHIR RDF uses, but the outcome is what's in the FHIR spec. 13:47:12 ... One nice thing about FHIR is that you can easily validate any FHIR data you have. Easy to know that you are conformant. 13:47:49 jahn: There's a form for creating the CG. 13:49:50 AGREED: Create a new CG for Unified Care Model 13:50:32 ACTION: Eric Jahn to fill out the W3C form to create a UCM CG 13:51:28 jahn: Please comment in the design principles doc. 13:52:21 My W3C user name is dbooth. 13:53:34 jahn: https://w3.org/community/groups/propose_cg/ 13:53:43 ... https://github.com/eric-jahn/ucm-hcls-fhir-rdf/blob/gh-pages/docs/ucm/ucm-design-principles.docx 14:01:50 ADJOURNED 14:01:54 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:01:56 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/05/29-hcls-minutes.html dbooth