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16:00:30 <TallTed> present+
16:00:32 <enrico> present+
16:00:35 <rubensworks> present+
16:00:40 <TallTed> meeting: RDF & SPARQL WG
16:00:45 <niklasl> present+
16:00:46 <j22> present+
16:00:47 <fsasaki> fsasaki has joined #rdf-star
16:00:53 <pchampin> present+
16:00:55 <gtw> present+
16:01:00 <fsasaki> present+
16:01:02 <TallTed> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/11e4d020-9c58-4fff-83c5-37c9e2502295/20260528T120000/
16:01:03 <agendabot> clear agenda
16:01:03 <agendabot> agenda+ Discrepancy between Turtle and SPARQL
16:01:03 <agendabot> agenda+ Create a note on triple-term owlification -> 1 https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/150
16:01:03 <agendabot> agenda+ RDF tests work -> 2 https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4
16:01:08 <fsasaki> scribe: fsasaki
16:01:12 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
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16:01:52 <TallTed> previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2026/05/21-rdf-star-minutes.html
16:01:52 <TallTed> next meeting: https://www.w3.org/2026/06/04-rdf-star-minutes.html
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16:02:13 <Souri> present+
16:02:45 <TallTed> chair: ora
16:02:51 <Tpt> present+
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16:03:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
16:03:09 <ora> present+
16:03:12 <ora> chair+
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16:03:22 <doerthe> present+
16:03:49 <tl> present+
16:04:26 <pchampin> q+
16:04:27 <pchampin> Topic: Discrepancy between Turtle and SPARQL
16:04:32 <fsasaki> ora: will discuss discrepancy between turtle and sparql syntax
16:04:33 <ora> ack pchampin
16:05:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
16:06:03 <ktk> present+
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16:07:28 <AZ> present+
16:07:37 <pfps> present+
16:10:23 <pchampin> q?
16:10:24 <niklasl> +1 to fix it
16:10:32 <j22> +1 as well
16:10:52 <fsasaki> ora: suggest to look into how to fix the issues that pchampin described
16:11:14 <fsasaki> (further discussions on what type of issues may appear)
16:11:32 <pchampin> q+
16:11:32 <AndyS> q+
16:11:42 <ora> ack AndyS
16:14:20 <ora> ack pchampin
16:14:24 <fsasaki> ora: should for sure be addressed, this is all about interop
16:14:41 <fsasaki> pchampion: meeting with thread modeling CG next week
16:14:51 <fsasaki> ... timely to discuss this matter
16:15:49 <ora> q+
16:15:50 <lisp> q+
16:16:06 <ora> ack ora
16:16:46 <pchampin> qq+
16:17:11 <pchampin> q-
16:17:16 <ora> ack lisp
16:17:55 <fsasaki> (discussions on how to move forward process wise)
16:19:32 <pfps> q+
16:19:36 <TallTed> q+
16:19:39 <ora> ack pfps
16:20:27 <ora> ack TallTed
16:20:27 <j22> q+
16:21:23 <ora> ack j
16:23:42 <ora> PROPOSAL: Resolve discrepancy between SPARQL and Turtle syntaxes
16:23:42 <TallTed> +1
16:23:46 <niklasl> +1
16:23:47 <gtw> +1
16:23:47 <j22> +1
16:23:47 <rubensworks> +1
16:23:48 <fsasaki> +1
16:23:49 <ktk> +1
16:23:49 <TallTed> +1
16:23:49 <pchampin> +1
16:23:49 <tl> +1
16:23:50 <AndyS> +1
16:23:50 <ora> +1
16:23:52 <doerthe> +1
16:23:53 <Souri> +1
16:23:54 <lisp> +1
16:23:55 <AZ> +1
16:24:01 <ora> RESOLVED: Resolve discrepancy between SPARQL and Turtle syntaxes
16:24:11 <Tpt> +1
16:24:23 <enrico> +1
16:24:31 <AndyS> q+
16:24:37 <ora> ack AndyS
16:24:57 <fsasaki> discussing the how of resolving the discrepancy
16:26:27 <pchampin> action: afs to make the change related to sparql and turtle syntax
16:26:28 <gb> Created -> action #193 https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/193
16:27:05 <niklasl> q+
16:27:16 <ora> ack niklasl
16:27:21 <pchampin> zakim, next agendum
16:27:21 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Discrepancy between Turtle and SPARQL -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:27:28 <pchampin> zakim, open agendum 2
16:27:28 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Create a note on triple-term owlification -> 1 https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/150 -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:27:39 <pchampin> s|agendum 1 -- Discrepancy between Turtle and SPARQL -- taken up [from agendabot]|
16:27:47 <fsasaki> niklasl: main issue I had: in which direction should the current doc go?
16:27:55 <niklasl> https://niklasl.github.io/rdf-struct-patterns/spec/
16:29:05 <fsasaki> niklasl: I think it should be a separate note
16:30:18 <fsasaki> niklasl: would like to get input of people who want to help to improve the quality of the doc
16:31:55 <ora> q+
16:31:58 <ora> ack ora
16:32:11 <fsasaki> ora: note vs. member submission is an interesting question
16:32:28 <fsasaki> ... member submission can be used to introduce s.t. for discussions
16:32:47 <pchampin> q+
16:32:50 <fsasaki> ... but not sure if there is a difference for an uniformed audience.
16:33:47 <ora> ack pchampin
16:33:52 <fsasaki> ... for me having this as a note would be fine
16:34:14 <fsasaki> pchampin: the WG needs to decide if we want to endorse this as a note
16:34:29 <fsasaki> ... not everybody understands the difference between note and REC
16:34:38 <fsasaki> ... another option may be a CG report
16:35:13 <fsasaki> ... e.g. in rdf dev CG
16:35:38 <TallTed> q+
16:35:53 <fsasaki> ora: we will decide next week how to move forward
16:36:00 <ora> ack TallTed
16:37:07 <fsasaki> ora: will discuss on mailing list
16:37:39 <pchampin> alternatively, niklasl, you could host a static HTML rendered offline by Respec
16:38:14 <niklasl> pchampin Ah, yes; good option.
16:38:20 <ora> zakim, next agendum
16:38:20 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Discrepancy between Turtle and SPARQL -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:38:27 <pchampin> zakim, open item 3
16:38:27 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- RDF tests work -> 2 https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4 -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:38:30 <ora> zakim, open agendum 3
16:38:30 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- RDF tests work -> 2 https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4 -- taken up [from agendabot]
16:38:50 <pchampin> s|agendum 1 -- Discrepancy between Turtle and SPARQL -- taken up [from agendabot]|
16:39:14 <pchampin> s|agendum 3 -- RDF tests work -> 2 https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4|
16:39:20 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
16:39:21 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-minutes.html pchampin
16:39:34 <AndyS> q+
16:39:46 <ora> ack AndyS
16:39:54 <AndyS> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-tests/pull/325
16:39:55 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-tests/pull/325 -> Pull Request 325 Align xml-canon to previous behavior (by afs)
16:40:20 <fsasaki> az: tests were changed from previous behaviour
16:40:38 <pchampin> s/az:/AndyS:
16:42:58 <rubensworks> q+
16:43:16 <ora> ack rubensworks
16:43:32 <fsasaki> rubenworks: tried to track down the reason for changes
16:43:39 <fsasaki> ... need to figure out why it was changed
16:44:32 <fsasaki> ora: so removing the one allows to become compliant with the rest of the test
16:44:58 <fsasaki> rubenworks: yes. if we revert the specific change we may need to modify other spec tests
16:45:54 <ora> s/rubenworks/rubensworks
16:46:56 <fsasaki> ora: if we put this back, the tests with annotation syntax become a problem?
16:47:03 <fsasaki> AndyS: yes
16:48:42 <fsasaki> ora: still not sure why there is a problem if we take the tests back
16:48:54 <fsasaki> .. what is the bad thing if we removed the one item?
16:49:10 <niklasl> q+
16:49:17 <ora> ack niklasl
16:49:41 <fsasaki> AndyS: Gregg Kellog made the change
16:49:53 <ora> s/Kellog/Kellogg
16:50:03 <rubensworks> q+
16:50:24 <fsasaki> niklasl: there may be arguments from certain use cases that would lead to issues
16:50:52 <AndyS> q+
16:50:57 <ora> ack rubensworks
16:51:08 <Tpt> q+
16:51:18 <fsasaki> rubensworks: have with reverting the change
16:51:30 <fsasaki> ... but it should come with a change in the rdf xml spec
16:51:41 <Tpt> q-
16:51:45 <ora> ack AndyS
16:52:19 <fsasaki> AndyS: one cannot write the same RDF XML literal in a different document and inherent different namespaces
16:53:09 <fsasaki> ... it ends up with what happens with n-triples in the tests
16:53:14 <pchampin> q+
16:53:17 <TallTed> s/inherent/inherit/
16:53:20 <AndyS> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-xml/issues/97
16:53:21 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-xml/issues/97 -> Issue 97 Clarification of rdf:XMLLiteral (by afs)
16:53:28 <fsasaki> AndyS: for rubensworks there is an issue
16:54:07 <ora> ack pchampin
16:55:37 <fsasaki> pchampin: may be that my parser is incorrect, it parses the current test
16:55:49 <fsasaki> ... raises the question of namespace inheritance
16:55:58 <enrico> q+
16:56:07 <ora> ack enrico
16:56:21 <fsasaki> enrico: got comments on RDF semantics doc
16:56:35 <fsasaki> ... pchampin improved the changes
16:56:41 <fsasaki> ... except for the first one
16:56:53 <pchampin> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star-wg/2026May/0033.html
16:56:53 <fsasaki> ... if everybody agrees I will merge the solution
16:57:24 <fsasaki> ora: objections?
16:57:25 <enrico> That’s the PR https://github.com/w3c/rdf-semantics/pull/195
16:57:25 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-semantics/pull/195 -> Pull Request 195 Implementation of Michael Schneider's review on RDF-Semantics (by franconi) [Errata] [ms:REC]
16:57:54 <fsasaki> no objections
16:58:05 <fsasaki> ora: enrico, please go ahead
16:58:06 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
16:58:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-minutes.html pchampin
17:01:20 <pchampin> RRSAgent, bye
17:01:20 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-actions.rdf :
17:01:20 <RRSAgent> ACTION: andy to make the change related to sparql and turtle syntax [1]
17:01:20 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-irc#T16-25-45
17:01:20 <RRSAgent> ACTION: AZ to make the change related to sparql and turtle syntax [2]
17:01:20 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-irc#T16-25-56
17:01:20 <RRSAgent> ACTION: afs to make the change related to sparql and turtle syntax [3]
17:01:20 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2026/05/28-rdf-star-irc#T16-26-27
17:01:23 <pchampin> zakim, bye
17:01:23 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been TallTed, enrico, rubensworks, niklasl, j, pchampin, gtw, fsasaki, Souri, Tpt, ora, doerthe, tl, ktk, AZ, pfps
17:01:23 <Zakim> Zakim has left #rdf-star