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14:44:50 <dbooth> Meeting: FHIR RDF
14:44:52 <dbooth> Chair: David Booth
14:54:47 <TallTed> TallTed has joined #hcls
15:03:54 <dbooth> Topic: R6 priorities
15:04:31 <dbooth> dbooth: Want to prioritize any R6 changes needed
15:05:17 <dbooth> tim: If we have approval for R6 changes, the implementation can be done after publication, but we'll want them in the spec (RDF page, examples, OWL, shex).
15:05:45 <dbooth> ... There's a few things I'd like to change, including Concept IRIs on CodeableConcepts.
15:05:52 <dbooth> ... Main thing is getting consensus on these changes.
15:06:08 <dbooth> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/issues/219
15:06:30 <dbooth> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/issues/224
15:07:08 <dbooth> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/issues/221
15:07:23 <dbooth> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/issues/223
15:07:55 <dbooth> tim: for #223, we create a new class for the element, like syntactic sugar.  And we also do it for other complex elements.
15:08:12 <dbooth> ... It makes the class hierarchy not match the type hierarchy.
15:10:13 <dbooth> ericp: There are a few that cannot be anonymous, becuase they are referenced elsewhere.
15:15:00 <dbooth> ACTION: EricP to review #223
15:17:18 <dbooth> tim: On #224, it's about how shex and OWL allow use of these underscore classes
15:19:15 <dbooth> tim: Recent issues: https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/issues/176#issuecomment-4227783324
15:20:17 <dbooth> ericp: This comes up in 3 places: modified elements, modified attributes, and ...
15:21:57 <dbooth> ACTION: Tim to reach out to jim for input on these OWL issues
15:22:37 <dbooth> Topic: Concept IRIs for CodeableConcepts
15:22:55 <dbooth> tim: Options for concept iris: https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/issues/219#issuecomment-4219323715
15:35:40 <dbooth> dbooth: option 3 arc is too broad
15:40:36 <dbooth> dbooth: straw poll
15:41:05 <dbooth> tim: option 1
15:41:12 <dbooth> ericp: Need examples of only Codings
15:41:34 <dbooth> ericJahn: Want to see examples
15:41:50 <dbooth> erich: ditto
15:41:55 <dbooth> ken: abstain
15:41:59 <dbooth> steve: abstain
15:43:14 <dbooth> dbooth: ok, needs more discussion
15:44:50 <dbooth> ericp: Need to see all the places that Coding is used directly.
15:45:07 <dbooth> ... Then see what we gain/lose
15:46:10 <dbooth> ACTION: Tim to see all the places that Coding is used directly
15:46:59 <dbooth> Topic: Extending the ontology
15:47:01 <dbooth> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/pull/222/commit
15:47:12 <dbooth> s/commit/commits/
15:47:29 <dbooth> https://github.com/eric-jahn/ucm-hcls-fhir-rdf/tree/gh-pages/docs/ucm
15:48:47 <dbooth> ken: Taking SULO principles of separating roles and entities
15:48:59 <dbooth> ... around concept of Agent and Agent roles
15:50:16 <dbooth> ... want guidance on: Unified Care Model (UCM) has foundational alignments with BFO, and structural alignments w SULO.  Beginning to document those.
15:50:52 <dbooth> ... But want to integrate also with other ontologie: FHIR ont, and linking concepts with that, and the HUD model.
15:51:05 <dbooth> ... Want input on that.
15:51:32 <dbooth> ... And want to add skos for closematch and exactmatch.
15:52:36 <dbooth> dbooth: want to see an example of how you envision doing it, to help think it through.
15:52:51 <dbooth> tim: You can directly make references using FHIR CodeableConcepts
15:53:17 <dbooth> ... That's helpful if it is within FHIR.
15:54:05 <dbooth> ken: Not ready to delve into datatyping and CodeableConcept yet.
15:54:17 <dbooth> ... But don't want to restrict that extension.
15:54:29 <dbooth> tim: We can represent these profiles as OWL classes to make more specific mappings: https://hl7.org/fhir/us/sdoh-clinicalcare/artifacts.html#profiles
15:55:08 <dbooth> ken: I sometimes get confused about the business problem you're trying to solve.
15:55:26 <dbooth> tim: We're talking about mapping FHIR to another system, within OWL and RDF.
15:55:38 <dbooth> ... But FHIR also has a way to do mappings within FHIR.
15:56:44 <dbooth> ericJahn: Should start making some example RDF using CodeableConcept within FHIR and outside of FHIR.
15:57:10 <dbooth> ... I think that will help everyone see if it is adaptable to real world scenarios.
15:57:30 <dbooth> ken: Granularity issue.  I'm currently focused on the concept, not the binding.
15:57:49 <dbooth> tim: The social determinants of health from Gravity project, has more specific FHIR concepts.
15:58:09 <dbooth> ... We can create OWL concepts that correspond to those profiles.  I think it would make it easier for you to map to them.
15:58:37 <dbooth> ken: Absolutely.  They've done a lot of good work on concepts.
15:59:13 <dbooth> ericJahn: We've never gone beyond: "what happens when there is no patient relation?"
15:59:23 <dbooth> ... That's when we need something other than Gravity.
15:59:38 <dbooth> ... Want UCM be able to do both.
16:00:57 <dbooth> ken: I can try relating a subject to a condition.
16:01:35 <dbooth> ericJahn: should do two random domains, then CodeableConcept approach
16:02:06 <dbooth> ACTION: Ken and EricJahn to make examples
16:02:20 <dbooth> ADJOURNED
16:10:04 <dbooth> Present: David Booth, EricP, Erich Bremer, Eric Jahn, Ken Lord, Steve Munini, Tim Prudhomme
16:10:10 <dbooth> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:10:11 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/04/16-hcls-minutes.html dbooth