14:42:46 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #pmwg-a11y
14:42:51 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2026/04/02-pmwg-a11y-irc
14:43:21 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, this will be pmwg-a11y
14:43:21 <Zakim> ok, AvneeshSingh_
14:43:47 <AvneeshSingh_> present+
14:43:58 <AvneeshSingh_> chair: AvneeshSingh
14:44:34 <AvneeshSingh_> agenda+ Continue refinement of FXL accessibility documents.
14:44:50 <AvneeshSingh_> agenda+ Issue 2968: WCAG 3.2.3 Consistent Navigation in reflowable EPUB?
14:45:12 <AvneeshSingh_> agenda+ Any other business
14:45:22 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
14:45:22 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Implementation of DPUB aria roles in screen readers -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
14:46:29 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
14:46:29 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Extended Descriptions explainer. next steps. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
14:47:32 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
14:47:32 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Accessibility horizontal review. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
14:47:53 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, remove agendum 1
14:47:54 <Zakim> agendum 1, Continue refinement of FXL accessibility documents., dropped
14:48:15 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, remove agendum 1
14:48:15 <Zakim> agendum 1, Continue refinement of FXL accessibility documents., dropped
14:48:36 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, remove agendum 2
14:48:36 <Zakim> agendum 2, Implementation of DPUB aria roles in screen readers, dropped
14:48:51 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, remove agendum 3
14:48:52 <Zakim> agendum 3, Extended Descriptions explainer. next steps., dropped
14:49:01 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, remove agendum 4
14:49:01 <Zakim> agendum 4, Accessibility horizontal review., dropped
15:00:56 <JonasL> JonasL has joined #pmwg-a11y
15:02:37 <gpellegrino> present+
15:04:22 <JonasL> present+
15:04:24 <CharlesL> CharlesL has joined #pmwg-a11y
15:04:30 <CharlesL> present+
15:04:53 <GeorgeK> GeorgeK has joined #pmwg-a11y
15:04:59 <gautierchomel_> gautierchomel_ has joined #pmwg-a11y
15:05:33 <GeorgeK> present+
15:06:15 <gpellegrino> scribe+
15:06:43 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
15:06:43 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- Any other business. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:06:55 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
15:06:55 <Zakim> agendum 5 was just opened, AvneeshSingh_
15:07:13 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, remove agendum 5
15:07:13 <Zakim> agendum 5, Any other business., dropped
15:07:13 <CircularKen> CircularKen has joined #pmwg-a11y
15:07:19 <CircularKen> present+
15:07:27 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
15:07:27 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- Continue refinement of FXL accessibility documents. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh_]
15:07:54 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh_: Continuing the refinement for FXL document
15:07:58 <AvneeshSingh_> PR: https://github.com/w3c/epub-specs/pull/2948
15:08:00 <CharlesL> scribe+
15:08:18 <CharlesL> gpellegrino: Wendy made this PR
15:08:29 <gpellegrino> https://github.com/w3c/epub-specs/pull/2948
15:08:32 <CharlesL> ... PR touches FXL a11y document and techniques
15:08:40 <CharlesL> ... related to 2 issues
15:08:53 <CharlesL> ... moving disc. metadata to the technique.
15:09:02 <CharlesL> ... other missing a11y hazards in examples
15:09:09 <CharlesL> ... from myself & charles.
15:09:23 <CharlesL> ... Wendy made changes, I found 2 issues to be fixed.
15:09:53 <CharlesL> ... tech. doc. using manifest fallbacks is currently under discovery metadata and it is not right section about fallbacks.
15:10:05 <CharlesL> ... second point metadata WCAG 2.1 and should be 2.2
15:10:17 <AvneeshSingh_> q?
15:10:25 <CharlesL> ... then we can merge once fixed
15:11:01 <CharlesL> ... I wasn't one of the original reviewers.
15:11:22 <gpellegrino> CharlesL: I agree with the comments
15:11:36 <JonasL> q+
15:11:41 <gpellegrino> ... not sure about the fallbacks, but ok with the WCAG 2.2 update
15:11:51 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:12:27 <gpellegrino> JonasL: I have a comment about a metadata examples: there is an example about accessibility metadata for children books with media overlays
15:13:11 <gpellegrino> ... it tells "auditory" as access mode, which is not in line with the new best practices defined by metadata authoring guide
15:13:31 <gpellegrino> ... same thing with the access mode sufficient
15:14:01 <GeorgeK> q+
15:14:21 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:14:49 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh_: do we want to dig into details now, or just merge and then check small things to fix?
15:15:53 <gpellegrino> GeorgeK: I understand the issues with "auditory" for access mode and access mode sufficient, I think it depends how much media overlays cover all the text of the book
15:15:58 <CircularKen> q+
15:16:32 <gpellegrino> JonasL: yes, I agree, but in the Matt's proposal for metadata authoring guide I've seen a different suggestion
15:17:11 <gpellegrino> ... but I agree we should not dig too much in details right now
15:17:18 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:18:10 <gpellegrino> CircularKen: for children's book you'd expect to have a lot of images, so the media overlays cover both image descriptions and text
15:18:52 <gpellegrino> CharlesL: I think we need Matt to discuss these things
15:20:01 <gpellegrino> ... in the PR there is another comment from Susan about linking to EPUB 3.4
15:20:42 <gpellegrino> ... I think we can merge the document, and create separate issues about Gregorio's comments
15:21:02 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino: fine with me
15:21:09 <wendyreid> present+
15:21:53 <gpellegrino> wendyreid: I agree with the comments
15:22:15 <gpellegrino> ... but maybe is simpler to merge, and then make a separate issue and PR
15:23:02 <gpellegrino> ... I would leave references to EPUB 3.3 for the moment
15:23:17 <gpellegrino> ... since the idea is to publish this document soon
15:23:35 <AvneeshSingh_> q?
15:23:46 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, next agendum
15:23:46 <Zakim> agendum 7 -- Issue 2968: WCAG 3.2.3 Consistent Navigation in reflowable EPUB? -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh_]
15:23:50 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh_: good, with a new document, we may have things to discuss
15:24:10 <AvneeshSingh_> https://github.com/w3c/epub-specs/issues/2968
15:24:31 <CharlesL> gpellegrino: some SC are hard to match with context of EPUB.
15:25:28 <CharlesL> in a11y 1.1 and 1.2 we have some clarifications on WCAG within EPUB, not Web pages, content is conforment to WCAG.
15:26:56 <wendyreid> q+
15:27:02 <CharlesL> ... 3.2.3 about consistent nav. tells nav mech. repeated on multiple page appear in the same order, unless there is a change initiated by the user. this is Skip controls, skip menu, sub menues happens in web running headers footers page numbering
15:27:35 <CharlesL> ... tricky to understand for reflowable EPUB. if there is no special nav other than the TOC, this SC will pass without having to check,
15:28:48 <AvneeshSingh_> q?
15:28:50 <CharlesL> ... its worth some discussion, maybe write some text to ask for feedback AG group. publishers may struggle with this SC.
15:29:02 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:29:22 <gpellegrino> wendyreid: I think this is a SC where the reading system has an important role
15:29:49 <gpellegrino> ... the EPUB creator has to make its part
15:30:12 <CharlesL> q+
15:30:15 <gpellegrino> ... mainly TOC and spine, and if they're well done
15:30:53 <GeorgeK> q+
15:30:58 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:31:00 <gpellegrino> ... then it's responsability of the reading system to assure that the SC is met
15:31:15 <gpellegrino> CharlesL: yes, also page list is another way to achieve it
15:31:27 <gpellegrino> ... same with list of tables and figures
15:31:54 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:31:58 <gpellegrino> q+
15:32:29 <gpellegrino> GeorgeK: I agree that spine and nav doc fullfill the requirements
15:32:54 <gpellegrino> ... I don't want to push publishers to add something that is not present in the book (like indexes)
15:33:37 <AvneeshSingh_> q?
15:33:40 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh_: I think a little bit of clarification can help
15:33:53 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:34:16 <CharlesL> gpellegrino: looking at the current document with reference to multiple ways.
15:34:33 <CharlesL> ... something in the techniques about this
15:34:58 <CharlesL> ... no mention for this specific crieteria.
15:35:17 <CharlesL> ... 1.3.2 (Reading Order) especially for FXL.
15:35:47 <CharlesL> ... 2.4.5 multiple ways, but nothing for 3.2.3 SC, maybe adding a paragraph would be useful.
15:36:42 <CharlesL> ... Makoto may flag something in WCAG some are completely outside (Accessible Authentication) not related to EPUBs.
15:36:47 <CharlesL> q+
15:37:34 <AvneeshSingh_> ack next
15:38:33 <gpellegrino> CharlesL: I think Matt has already made some work for SMART
15:39:21 <gpellegrino> ... so we can check what he made there, to make a list of SC that do not apply
15:40:14 <gpellegrino> ... I can make this list
15:40:36 <AvneeshSingh_> q?
15:41:44 <CharlesL> I have updated the Issue Name: WCAG Success Criteria's That Don't Apply to EPUB #2968
15:42:18 <wendyreid> The PR is merged as well :)
15:42:55 <AvneeshSingh_> rrsagent, make logs public
15:43:12 <AvneeshSingh_> rrsagent, make minutes
15:43:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/04/02-pmwg-a11y-minutes.html AvneeshSingh_
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15:46:12 <AvneeshSingh_> zakim, leave
15:46:12 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been AvneeshSingh, gpellegrino, AvneeshSingh_, JonasL, CharlesL, GeorgeK, CircularKen, wendyreid
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