14:38:25 RRSAgent has joined #wcag2ict 14:38:30 logging to https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-irc 14:38:30 agenda cleared 14:38:30 RRSAgent, make logs Public 14:38:31 Meeting: WCAG2ICT Task Force Teleconference 14:38:38 chair: PhilDay 14:38:46 meeting: WCAG2ICT Task Force Teleconference 14:38:55 rrsagent, make minutes 14:38:57 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-minutes.html PhilDay 14:39:40 Zakim, please time speakers at 2 minutes 14:39:40 ok, PhilDay 14:39:50 agenda+ Announcements 14:39:50 agenda+ Question 2 - Adding Level AAA into the introduction section of WCAG2ICT Group Note 14:39:50 agenda+ Question 4 - 1.2.6 Sign Language (Prerecorded) 14:39:50 agenda+ Question 5 - (Part 1 of 2) 1.3.6 Identify Purpose 14:39:52 agenda+ Question 6 - (Part 2 of 2) 1.3.6 Identify Purpose 14:39:59 agenda? 14:40:17 regrets: Daniel Montalvo Charameli 14:40:23 present+ 14:40:35 rrsagent, make minutes 14:40:36 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-minutes.html PhilDay 14:41:09 agenda? 14:52:47 scribe+ PhilDay 14:59:48 LauraM has joined #WCAG2ICT 14:59:55 present+ 15:01:05 loicmn has joined #wcag2ict 15:01:23 present+ 15:02:50 bbailey has joined #wcag2ict 15:03:01 present+ 15:03:15 scribe+ LauraM 15:03:30 Agenda? 15:03:53 zakim, next item 15:03:53 agendum 1 -- Announcements -- taken up [from PhilDay] 15:04:07 New W3C Google doc space Daniel created at: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1ad-D32T0NTsc3EqbgJtPp1NBpLRmRtAi 15:04:10 PhilDay: We have moved the google docs to the W3C space 15:04:20 PhilDay: If you need access, email Daniel 15:04:32 o Link to level AAA status table on wiki: https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/wiki/Adding-Level-AAA-%E2%80%90-status-table 15:04:36 GreggVan has joined #wcag2ict 15:04:40 o Link to project board view: https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/13 15:05:12 PhilDay: There are many items left on the table 15:05:28 PhilDay: Look at the items and assign yourself to items and draft content 15:05:37 o Link to level AAA status table on wiki: https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/wiki/Adding-Level-AAA-%E2%80%90-status-table 15:06:24 zakim, next item 15:06:24 agendum 2 -- Question 2 - Adding Level AAA into the introduction section of WCAG2ICT Group Note -- taken up [from PhilDay] 15:06:30 • Link to the survey results: https://www.w3.org/wbs/55145/AAA-take-two/results/ 15:06:38 • Link to q2: https://www.w3.org/wbs/55145/AAA-take-two/results/#xq2 15:06:44 • Link to pull request 832: https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/pull/832 15:07:04 PhilDay: Bruce was doing edits last week, Maryjo and Bruce went through iterations. 15:07:24 PhilDay: Most thought that PR832 was ready to merge. 15:07:42 q+ 15:07:53 • Mary Jo reiterated his suggested changes in a suggestion - https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/pull/832/changes#r2800523225 15:07:57 ack bbailey 15:08:02 ack bbailey 15:08:30 BBailey: We should do this in two passes, one for minor edits and one that has the diff preview. 15:08:49 bbailey: diff preview of Bruce's latest content: https://services.w3.org/htmldiff?doc1=https://w3c.github.io/wcag2ict/&doc2=https://deploy-preview-832--wcag2ict.netlify.app#introduction 15:09:51 Gregg: Changing from "standards" to "regulations" is inaccurate. EN301 549 is a standard not a regulation. Could use standards and regulations. 15:11:24 q+ to say framing rules as testing techniques could help remediate some of the concerns 15:12:14 ack Daniel 15:12:14 Daniel, you wanted to say framing rules as testing techniques could help remediate some of the concerns 15:12:44 Suggested change 15:12:44 It is not recommended that WCAG 2 conformance be required as a general policy for all non-web documents and software because it is not possible to satisfy all success criteria for some non-web ICT. 15:12:44 WCAG2ICT is useful as guidance for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software. However, because it is not possible to satisfy all success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that unmodified WCAG 2 success criteria be applied for all non-web documents 15:12:44 and software. 15:13:06 Daniel's suggested edit: WCAG2ICT is useful as guidance for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software. However, because it is not possible to satisfy all success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that unmodified WCAG 2 success criteria be applied 15:13:06 for all non-web documents and software. 15:13:58 Bruce's previous version (put by Mary Jo as a suggestion): 15:13:58 WCAG2ICT is useful as guidance for policy for non-web documents and software and to inform conformance requirements for non-web documents and software. However, because it is not possible to satisfy all success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that unmodified WCAG 2 conformance be required for all non-web 15:13:58 documents and software. 15:14:42 Change from last week - we added a positive framing to the start. 15:15:09 GreggVan: Seems contradictory - useful as guidance for policy, in the first sentence, then 2nd sentence says you should not use it unmodified 15:15:59 PhilDay: What is the proposal. Last week we decided to add a positive framing. How do we flip this to be positive. 15:16:08 q+ 15:16:09 Gregg - useful as recommendations, but not applied as requirements 15:16:10 GreggVan: Useful as recommendations but not as requirements. 15:16:15 q? 15:16:44 GreggVan: They are important for people to do when they can and where they can 15:17:10 ack bbailey 15:17:27 Bbailey: The assignment was to add a sentence or two about AAA success criteria. 15:17:49 Bbailey: I realized that what I would say would not be different from what I would say about AA and A SCs. 15:18:25 Bbailey: Maybe we could put a sentence in about why they are in a different section. 15:19:37 Daniel's suggested change: 15:19:37 WCAG2ICT is useful as guidance for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software. However, because it is not possible to satisfy all success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that unmodified WCAG 2 success criteria be applied for all non-web documents 15:19:37 and software. 15:19:37 Gregg's edit to Daniel's 15:19:39 WCAG2ICT is useful as recommendations for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software. However, because it is not possible to satisfy all success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that unmodified WCAG 2 success criteria be applied as requirements for 15:19:39 all non-web documents and software. 15:19:42 q? 15:20:08 PhilDay: Let's go after the contentious section and then go back 15:20:43 PR: https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/pull/832 15:20:50 https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/pull/832#discussion_r2828386547 15:21:13 Bruce's softened version: 15:21:13 WCAG2ICT is useful as guidance for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software in addressing accessibility of non-web ICT. However, because it is not possible to satisfy some success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that all WCAG 2 success criteria 15:21:13 be applied without modication to some non-web documents and software. 15:21:31 GreggVan: Don't like this one because it says the same things as before 15:22:00 By swapping non web for web, it's a problem 15:22:38 Bruce + Gregg's changes 15:22:39 WCAG2ICT is useful as recommendations for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software in addressing accessibility of non-web ICT. However, because it is not possible to satisfy some success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that all WCAG 2 success 15:22:39 criteria be applied without modification as requirements to some non-web documents and software. 15:23:15 GreggVan: Everything in our document is a recommendation. 15:23:37 q? 15:24:15 GreggVan: Maybe we should adopt the other changes and then revisit this part 15:25:18 q? 15:25:22 q+ 15:25:40 ack bbailey 15:26:11 Bbailey: Let's change to Level AAA SC is useful as guidance. 15:26:29 WCAG2ICT Level AAA SC are useful as recommendations for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software in addressing accessibility of non-web ICT. However, because it is not possible to satisfy some success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that all 15:26:29 WCAG 2 success criteria be applied without modification as requirements to some non-web documents and software. 15:26:36 GreggVan: I think the current one, if you change to AAA, still has it's own problem. 15:26:55 Level AAA SC are useful as recommendations for policy makers and other regulators to assess how WCAG 2 can be applied to non-web documents and software in addressing accessibility of non-web ICT. However, because it is not possible to satisfy some success criteria for some non-web ICT, it is not recommended as a general policy that all WCAG 2 15:26:55 success criteria be applied without modification as requirements to some non-web documents and software. 15:27:27 Bbailey: Do we not want the word recommendation twice? 15:27:47 GreggVan: It's the use of the word "recommendation" is in the wrong place in the sentence. And the whole document is a recommendation. 15:27:53 It is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for entire sites because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content. 15:28:58 Sam has joined #wcag2ict 15:29:07 present + 15:29:28 why dont use optional 15:29:29 It is not recommended that WCAG Level AAA success criteria be required as a general policy for non-web ict because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content. 15:29:47 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content, Level AAA conformance may not be required as a general policy. 15:30:10 q+ 15:30:27 ack LauraM 15:30:52 LauraM: Reword the sentence, shorten, and change order to help. 15:31:08 q? 15:31:15 q+ 15:31:27 GreggVan: "May not" is not the right word. 15:32:24 ack Sam 15:32:44 q+ 15:33:26 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content, it is not recommended that Level AAA success criteria be required as a general policy. 15:33:28 Sam: Level AAA doesn't apply to some content. Bruce's statement is pretty good. Why do we keep referring back when we can state "don't do this as a requirement". 15:33:40 q? 15:33:43 ack GreggVan 15:33:43 ack GreggVan 15:33:51 It is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for entire sites because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content. 15:34:16 https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG22/#cc1 15:34:22 GreggVan: Bruce's comes close but we are talking about non web not sites, that's one problem with the sentence. 15:34:34 Note 2: It is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for entire sites because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content. 15:34:36 We are talking about non web ICT. 15:34:53 q? 15:35:29 q+ 15:35:52 q? 15:35:55 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for entire sites. 15:36:07 ack LauraM 15:36:34 q+ 15:36:52 Laura: Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content, it is not recommended that Level AAA success criteria be required as a general policy. (or with entire sites). 15:36:56 q? 15:37:01 ack GreggVan 15:37:24 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web ICT. 15:37:31 q+ 15:37:43 q? 15:37:52 q+ 15:38:09 q? 15:38:13 ack bbailey 15:38:16 q- 15:38:48 Sam: Bruce changed it to non web ICT 15:38:48 > Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web content, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web ict. 15:39:16 +1 15:39:21 +1 15:39:25 +1 15:40:11 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web documents and software, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for entire sites. 15:40:31 q? 15:40:32 q+ 15:40:40 ack LauraM 15:40:46 Yes, we use non-web content in WCAG2ICT:https://www.w3.org/TR/wcag2ict-22/#content-on-and-off-the-web 15:40:58 q? 15:41:19 GreggVan: ICT should be used in both places 15:41:52 Note 2: It is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for entire sites because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some content. 15:42:05 GreggVan: Non web content in the beginning of the sentence and non web ICT in the end infers there is a difference in the meaning 15:42:17 q+\ 15:42:21 bbailey: trying to keep consistent with note 2.. 15:42:21 q+ 15:42:27 ack Sam 15:42:33 q+ to say that in WCAG2ICT we have generalized "content" 15:42:42 Sam: Question for Gregg - if it used non web ICT in both places is that ok? 15:42:53 GreggVan: What does WCAG actually say? 15:43:00 https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG22/#cc1 15:43:09 q? 15:43:16 ack \, 15:43:21 ack loicmn 15:43:21 loicmn, you wanted to say that in WCAG2ICT we have generalized "content" 15:43:46 Loicmn: we do use content in WCAG2ICT as a generalized term so we can use content. We can also use non-web content. 15:43:52 https://www.w3.org/TR/wcag2ict-22/#content-on-and-off-the-web 15:44:08 q? 15:44:09 q= 15:44:16 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web ict, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software. 15:44:21 ack GreggVan 15:44:21 ack GreggVan 15:44:49 q+ 15:44:54 GreggVan: Since we are WCAG2ICT we should probably use something consistently such as "ICT" which gets it away from content. 15:45:06 q+ to suggest non-web documents and software as an alternative 15:45:13 +1 to Bruce suggestion 15:45:29 ack bbailey 15:45:32 ack \, 15:45:34 ack 15:45:36 acl \ 15:46:00 Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web ict, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software. 15:46:39 bbailey: Because we are modeling note 2, general and then broader, we should do something similar with our statement is more consistent with the note. 15:46:48 vote? 15:47:09 q? 15:47:30 POLL. Are you happy with bbailey's latest as posted by Laura above? 15:47:36 +1 15:47:36 q-\, 15:47:40 +1 15:47:44 +1 15:47:45 q- PhilDay 15:47:56 +1 15:47:56 +1 15:48:54 DRAFT RESOLUTION: For the introductory paragraph, incorporate the latest content: "Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web ict, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software." 15:49:06 +1 15:49:10 +1 15:49:22 +1 15:49:31 +1 15:49:38 +1 15:49:38 RESOLUTION: For the introductory paragraph, incorporate the latest content: "Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web ict, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software." 15:50:13 GreggVan: Editorial - suggest non-web documents and software in both places. 15:50:40 q+ 15:50:48 ack LauraM 15:51:28 q+ 15:51:34 I think we *do* mean two different things 15:51:40 q? 15:51:54 ack LauraM 15:51:56 q+ 15:52:31 LauraM: referenced 2 different ways in the original WCAG2 NOTE 2 - as they had broad and then specific. 15:52:35 ack bbailey 15:52:41 q+ 15:53:11 ack GreggVan 15:53:21 bbailey: We use both terms, non-web ICT includes hardware and other things but for applying, we meant non web documents and software. 15:53:30 q+ To say the original uses two terms - content, web sites - and we should use two. Suggest content, non-web documents and software. 15:53:35 GreggVan: Then we need to define them as two different things. 15:53:50 q? 15:53:59 q+ for someone to do editorial pass on "non-web ICT" 15:54:19 ack loicmn 15:54:19 loicmn, you wanted to say the original uses two terms - content, web sites - and we should use two. Suggest content, non-web documents and software. 15:54:37 Loicmn: ICT includes hardware. So we should go back to what we had originally 15:54:45 loicmn: suggest we go back to non-web content, and then non-web documents and software. 15:54:48 q+ 15:55:28 Revised version: Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web content, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software." 15:55:30 q+ 15:55:37 ack bbailey 15:55:37 bbailey, you wanted to discuss someone to do editorial pass on "non-web ICT" 15:55:58 bbailey happy with Loic's suggestion - if not check non-web ICT elsewhere 15:56:26 Bbailey: Should we create a new issue to make sure we are using non web ICT correctly? PhilDay to check on this. 15:56:26 q? 15:56:28 ack Sam 15:56:56 Sam: I thought the whole reason to keep it that way was to keep it like the original WCAG note. Did we resolve and reopen? 15:57:08 q? 15:57:13 ack GreggVan 15:57:44 GreggVan: bruce raised the point that non web ICT includes hardware as well. 15:57:51 Sam has joined #wcag2ict 15:58:09 WCAG provisions do not deal with hardware at all. They do not translate to everything. 15:58:24 DRAFT RESOLUTION: Modify paragraph in introductory section to use "Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web content, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software." 15:58:39 +1 15:58:40 GreggVan: Where we say non web ICT we should change to content. 15:59:01 +1 15:59:02 +1 to draft resolution 15:59:06 +1 15:59:27 +1 15:59:27 RESOLUTION: Modify paragraph in introductory section to use "Because it is not possible to satisfy all Level AAA success criteria for some non-web content, it is not recommended that Level AAA conformance be required as a general policy for non-web documents and software." 16:00:02 ACTION: Check draft's use of non-web ICT 16:00:15 zakim, draft minutes 16:00:15 I don't understand 'draft minutes', bbailey 16:00:27 RRSAgent, draft minutes 16:00:29 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-minutes.html bbailey 16:00:35 POLL: Are you happy to accept Bruce's other edits in https://services.w3.org/htmldiff?doc1=https://w3c.github.io/wcag2ict/&doc2=https://deploy-preview-832--wcag2ict.netlify.app#introduction 16:01:36 +1 to Bruce's changes 16:01:42 +1 to Bruce's changes 16:02:03 DRAFT RESOLUTION: Accept the remainder of Bruce's edits from PR 238 as discussed above 16:02:14 +1 16:02:17 +1 16:02:37 ACTION: Editorial check for use of "regulation" 16:02:54 ACTION: check where else we use non/web ICT and see if it includes hardware, and see if we can change to non-web content. Create issue 16:03:24 +1 16:03:30 RESOLUTION: Accept the remainder of Bruce's edits from PR 238 as discussed above 16:04:51 o rrsagent, make minutes 16:04:57 rrsagent, make minutes 16:04:58 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-minutes.html PhilDay 16:05:53 o Zakim, end meeting 16:05:57 Zakim, end meeting 16:05:58 As of this point the attendees have been PhilDay, LauraM, loicmn, bbailey 16:06:00 RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2 16:06:01 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-minutes.html Zakim 16:06:07 I am happy to have been of service, PhilDay; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye 16:06:08 Zakim has left #wcag2ict 16:06:10 rrsagent, bye 16:06:10 I see 3 open action items saved in https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-actions.rdf : 16:06:10 ACTION: Check draft's use of non-web ICT [1] 16:06:10 recorded in https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-irc#T16-00-02 16:06:10 ACTION: Editorial check for use of "regulation" [2] 16:06:10 recorded in https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-irc#T16-02-37 16:06:10 ACTION: check where else we use non/web ICT and see if it includes hardware, and see if we can change to non-web content. Create issue [3] 16:06:10 recorded in https://www.w3.org/2026/02/19-wcag2ict-irc#T16-02-54