15:58:25 RRSAgent has joined #tt 15:58:29 logging to https://www.w3.org/2026/02/12-tt-irc 15:58:29 RRSAgent, make logs Public 15:58:30 Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference 15:58:34 scribe: nigel 15:58:36 Chair: Nigel 15:58:39 present: Nigel 15:58:49 Agenda: https://github.com/w3c/ttwg/issues/327 15:58:53 Topic: This meeting 15:59:15 Regrets: Andreas, Cyril 16:00:13 rrsagent, make minutes 16:00:15 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/12-tt-minutes.html nigel 16:01:20 Present+ Pierre, Cyril 16:02:09 cpn has joined #tt 16:05:27 Present+ Atsushi 16:07:33 present+ Chris 16:07:37 scribe+ cpn 16:07:43 Present- Cyril 16:08:13 regrets: Cyril, Andreas 16:08:29 Topic: IMSC 1.3 16:08:49 Subtopic: Japanese character set 16:09:38 github: https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/614 16:09:47 s/set/set w3c/imsc#614 16:10:04 Nigel: We have some feedback from ARIB 16:10:31 ... What's the status now? 16:10:50 Pierre: Atsushi has asked for text to be added that requires conformance with IVS 16:11:22 Atsushi: What ARIB is used is standard IVS and IVD specificied in ISO ?? spec 16:12:02 ... I asked to remove CJK Compatibility Ideographs, and add a note on using IVS for ideographic characters. This is background material for that 16:12:41 Pierre: My concern is IVD is huge, with lots of unrelated stuff. Can we just include a list of the 19 glyphs? 16:13:28 Atsushi: ARIB-STD-62 refers to IVD ... 16:14:05 Pierre: My objection from the beginning about referencing IVD is that it's unbounded, and we don't want people to have to support all of IVD just to support the Japanese character set 16:14:30 ... Can we copy the list? 16:15:16 Atsushi: I believe so. I'm not sure exactly where they are 16:15:45 https://www.arib.or.jp/kikaku/kikaku_hoso/tr-b39.html 16:15:57 Atsushi: I found the English version 16:16:12 ... Look at the second table 16:20:38 -> English translation of Fascicle 2 https://www.arib.or.jp/english/html/overview/doc/8-TR-B39v2_5-2p5-E1.pdf 16:21:00 Nigel: Found it, Table 7-8, page 3-63, Fascicle 2 16:21:14 Table 7-8 in section 7.4.4 includes the 19 IVS characters 16:21:21 Pierre: I'll add it to the PR 16:22:29 Nigel: In Section 8.4.1, it says the ideographic variation sequence is not operated. 16:22:47 Atsushi: This is not a standard, but an operational recommendation 16:23:37 ... In the discussion in Japan, they list commonly used variation selector characters. We mention Table 5.2 and 3 in the IMSC document 16:24:03 ... I believe this is just a set of characters that are actually used in current broadcast systems 16:25:26 Pierre Not sure how to interpret that sentence, Nigel. Atsushi, what does the original say? 16:25:38 Atsushi: I don't have access, I only have the text provided by Ohmata-san 16:26:25 Nigel: I think those sequences have proven useful, but not actually required 16:26:51 Pierre: I recommend drafting the PR and ask ARIB for feedback 16:28:26 Atsushi: The table in 7.4.4 are commonly used in broadcasting in Japan. It describes fallback operation, commonly used for IVS and IVD characters. 16:28:41 ... Not all fonts support IVD glyphs, as IVD includes several sets of variation sequences 16:29:07 ... But in any case, I'll ask Ohmata-san 16:29:28 Nigel: I'll also look at the re-ordering PR 16:30:01 SUMMARY: @palemieux to add the 19 IVS, @himorin to check details with contact 16:30:42 Subtopic: APA WG comment: semantic layers w3c/imc#524 16:30:48 github: https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/524 16:31:25 Nigel: I've been thinking about this. The goal of having better metadata to describe the semantics of the kinds of content in the document is a good one 16:31:53 ... We've tried to express that via DAPT metdata. We're missing any implementer feedback so far, e.g., player behaviour that makes use of them 16:32:25 ... So it's too soon for IMSC 1.3. I'm excited by this in principle, though. You could have some combination of DAPT and IMSC, and the player could choose which resource to present 16:32:43 ... That would be possible. But I don't see what change we could make in IMSC to reflect current practice 16:32:59 Pierre: I agree. Metadata without behaviour isn't really useful, and that's not settled. 16:34:42 Nigel: I can take an action item to write a comment that says that what you want to do is possible through upstream workflows. 16:35:11 ... They suggest doing it at runtime, which might mean selecting between resources, or modifying the behaviour of the resource being presented 16:35:43 ... But as long as you get the effect you want, it's ok 16:35:53 ... We'd be happy to take this on, but no change at the moment 16:36:26 ... I'm thinking about a breakout session to discuss authoring workflows that might produce IMSC, based on translation, transcription, dubbing scripts, using DAPT and IMSC 16:36:41 ... and understanding how the different information gathered on the way can be used 16:37:42 ... For example, sound effects in audio. Extract subsets and present as IMSC. Then how to express that, e.g., in the IMSC document or externally? 16:38:04 ... If you think this is a good idea for a breakout, I'll prepare it. Or other ideas for breakouts? 16:38:26 SUMMARY: @nigelmegitt to explain thoughts about workflow as discussed, and propose breakout session 16:39:26 github-bot, end topic 16:40:32 Topic: AOB 16:40:45 s/AOB/Meeting close 16:41:01 Nigel: Next meeting on 26th Feb 16:41:26 -> https://github.com/w3c/ttwg/issues/328 Agenda for next meeting 16:42:16 Nigel: Thanks everyone. [adjourns meeting] 16:42:53 i/Topic: IMSC 1.3/Nigel: It looks like we can go directly to IMSC on the agenda. 16:43:12 i/Topic: IMSC 1.3/.. Does anyone want to raise any other business for the agenda? 16:43:18 i/Topic: IMSC 1.3/No other business 16:43:22 rrsagent, make minutes 16:43:24 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/12-tt-minutes.html nigel 16:44:31 s/Pierre Not sure how/Pierre: Not sure how 16:44:41 s/Ohmata/Ohnata 16:44:50 s/Ohmata/Ohnata 16:45:56 rrsagent, make minutes 16:45:57 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/12-tt-minutes.html nigel 16:46:27 s/github-bot, end topic// 16:47:00 Previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2026/01/29-tt-minutes.html 16:47:19 rrsagent, make minutes 16:47:20 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/12-tt-minutes.html nigel 16:50:10 scribeOptions: -final -noEmbedDiagnostics 16:50:12 zakim, end meeting 16:50:12 As of this point the attendees have been Nigel, Pierre, Cyril, Atsushi, Chris 16:50:14 RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2 16:50:16 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2026/02/12-tt-minutes.html Zakim 16:50:22 I am happy to have been of service, nigel; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye 16:50:22 Zakim has left #tt 16:50:39 rrsagent, excuse us 16:50:39 I see no action items