19:07:42 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aria-apg
19:07:46 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/11/25-aria-apg-irc
19:07:46 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
19:07:47 <Zakim> Meeting: ARIA Authoring Practices Task Force
19:08:45 <Daniel> scribe+
19:08:55 <CurtBellew> present +
19:08:59 <CurtBellew> present+
19:11:03 <Daniel> Topic: Publication schedule
19:11:22 <Daniel> Matt: I moved our milestone for 17 Dec
19:11:30 <Daniel> ... There are four PRs currently
19:11:42 <Daniel> ... One is done
19:11:56 <Daniel> ... The next we'll be talking about just now
19:12:24 <Daniel> ... Then there's a big one we've been pushing off for some time in color contrast guidance
19:12:42 <Daniel> ... Still aspirational for us to get this ready by the 17th
19:13:20 <Daniel> ... There is another really important change, related to the support tables from aria-at. We changed the repo structure and that broke the sindication. I'll be adding a PR for that
19:15:09 <Daniel> Daniel: Remi may not be able on the 17. We may need to just pull this forward with only the things that are done and leave the rest for later
19:15:19 <Daniel> Matt: I'd like to get the aria-at tables fixed
19:15:46 <Daniel> Daniel: I'll send you an email with our availability
19:16:23 <Matt_King> TOPIC: Issue 3193: listbox example with aria-actions
19:16:57 <Matt_King> github: https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/3372
19:18:01 <Daniel> Matt: In the last minute we summarized the most important changes. That was the week before TPAC
19:18:09 <Daniel> ... Do you have any questions?
19:18:52 <Daniel> CurtBellew: I did commit afterwards. Let me check
19:19:15 <Daniel> Matt: Last commit I see is from 20 Oct, that's what I am seeing on the PR
19:20:31 <Daniel> rrsagent, draft minutes
19:20:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/11/25-aria-apg-minutes.html Daniel
19:21:26 <Daniel> CurtBellew: I pushed something 6 Nov
19:22:11 <Daniel> Matt: I am noticing changes in behavior
19:22:35 <Daniel> CurtBellew: I did add an aria-live, and added the word "favorite" as part of the label
19:23:06 <Daniel> Matt: Awesome changes
19:23:55 <Daniel> Matt: We may want to say "deleted" for consistency with label
19:24:02 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Yes
19:25:08 <Daniel> Matt: We should determine if this is ready, from a code perspective I think it is.
19:25:31 <Daniel> Matt: When you tab into this list, do the actions appear as you focus each item?
19:25:34 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Yes
19:25:41 <Daniel> Matt: Does hover track your movement?
19:25:48 <Daniel> CurtBellew: As you move up and down you see those appear
19:26:13 <Daniel> s/appear/appear in their current state/
19:26:53 <Daniel> Matt: If you are on the bottom one, does move down go away?
19:27:27 <Daniel> CurtBellew: If you move something up, for example the second to the first, that gets reflected
19:27:51 <Daniel> ... Weird scenario is when I use my keyboard and then use the mouse, I could get two sets of actions at the same time
19:28:01 <Daniel> Matt: I am not sure if we can do something about it
19:28:13 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Focus and hover at the same time may be a way for us to get around this
19:28:36 <Daniel> Matt: If you move the hover down to the one that is currently focus, does that go away?
19:28:39 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Yes.
19:28:58 <Daniel> ... Buttons are huge on the deploy version, they're much smaller on my local copy. We may need to do something to adjust it
19:29:30 <Daniel> Matt: There must be something in the stylesheets that we use
19:30:01 <Daniel> Matt: We should get this addressed before others do visual review
19:30:21 <Daniel> Matt: Each of us have a couple of actions, then we may move this to "ready for review"
19:30:32 <Daniel> Matt: Vispero was asking about this
19:30:58 <Daniel> ... Bryan, have you experiment what we are doing?
19:31:06 <Daniel> Bryan: not yet
19:31:41 <Daniel> Daniel: Is that already in the 2026 release?
19:31:45 <Daniel> Matt: Yes.
19:32:03 <Daniel> Matt: JAWS keystroke is Insert Windows a
19:34:03 <Daniel> Matt: Focus got lost when I pressed the key
19:34:41 <Daniel> Matt: We should probably work around some of the problems we are seeing here. Sounds like the browsers need to be doing something
19:34:51 <Daniel> ... It seems JAWS is clicking the "favorite" button
19:35:09 <Daniel> CurtBellew: It's not changing focus, just setting the activedescendant
19:35:33 <Daniel> Matt: When you move focus from the listbox item with the arrow keys, is activelement moving or ativedescendant pointing to the button?
19:35:42 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Activedescendant
19:35:58 <Daniel> Matt: So if you click the favorite button, aren't you changing activedescendant?
19:36:03 <Daniel> CurtBellew: That's not
19:36:30 <Daniel> Matt: I think that's what we want. You want activedescendant to stay the same when you click
19:37:08 <Daniel> ... Clicking a button probably should not change activedescendant
19:37:58 <Daniel> Matt: For some reason JAWS is not recognizing that focus is still in the list box
19:38:11 <Daniel> ... That might be a JAWS issue. The Chrome bug is still the naming though
19:38:29 <Daniel> ... It's not an aria-actions requirement to use activedescendant
19:38:58 <Daniel> Matt: If you didn't use activedescendant and you click the button, that would be a problem
19:39:11 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Yes, normal thing would be to put focus there and then click
19:39:34 <Daniel> Matt: Why not the roabing focus?
19:39:56 <Daniel> CurtBellew: It shouldn't make a difference, just though this approach would be easier
19:40:54 <Daniel> s/roabing/roving/g
19:41:07 <Daniel> Matt: The actions are inside of the options, they are descendant
19:41:26 <Daniel> CurtBellew: This has clickable inside clickae, which I think is what aria-actions wanted to represent
19:42:17 <Daniel> Daniel: Interested in how keyboard support would play with other screen readers
19:42:33 <Daniel> Matt: Keyboard support should work
19:44:13 <Daniel> Matt: Seems like we are close to landing this
19:44:19 <Daniel> CurtBellew: Thanks, happy to work on this
19:44:41 <Daniel> rrsagent, draft minutes
19:44:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/11/25-aria-apg-minutes.html Daniel
19:45:19 <Daniel> Matt: Curt you'll work on the CSS and I am going to make sure documentation is ready for thorough review
19:46:30 <Daniel> rrsagent, end meeting
19:46:30 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'end meeting', Daniel.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
19:48:06 <Daniel> rrsagent, make minutes
19:48:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/11/25-aria-apg-minutes.html Daniel
19:49:11 <Daniel> zakim, end meeting
19:49:11 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been CurtBellew
19:49:13 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2
19:49:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/11/25-aria-apg-minutes.html Zakim
19:49:20 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, Daniel; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
19:49:21 <Zakim> Zakim has left #aria-apg