14:11:24 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot-td
14:11:28 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-irc
14:11:28 <Mahda> Mahda has joined #wot-td
14:11:31 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #wot-td
14:11:37 <Mahda> present+ Mahda_Noura
14:11:44 <dape> chair: Ege_Korkan
14:11:48 <dape> Meeting: WoT Thing Description
14:11:54 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:11:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
14:11:59 <dape> rrsagent, make log public
14:12:03 <MIzushima> present+ Tomoaki_Mizushima
14:12:17 <dape> present+ Daniel_Peintner
14:12:23 <MIzushima> present+ Ege_Korkan
14:12:30 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:12:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
14:12:43 <MIzushima> present+ Kunihiko_Toumura
14:12:55 <dape> present+ Klaus_Hartke
14:13:24 <MIzushima> present+ Klaus_Hartke
14:13:26 <dape> scribe: dape
14:14:00 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:14:01 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
14:16:25 <MIzushima> present+ Luca_Barbato
14:17:47 <dape> TOPIC: Minutes
14:18:03 <dape> -> https://www.w3.org/2025/10/08-wot-td-minutes.html
14:18:45 <dape> EK: Minutes from Wednesday are approved
14:19:02 <dape> TOPIC: Quick Schedule
14:19:19 <dape> SUBTOPIC: URI vs IRI
14:19:27 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/issues/2156
14:20:12 <dape> EK: Issue come out of an OPC-UA discussion
14:20:23 <Ege> https://github.com/eclipse-thingweb/node-wot/tree/master/packages/binding-opcua#getting-started
14:21:06 <dape> ... the URI schema for OPC-UA contains s= meaning a string
14:21:21 <dape> ... protocol allows any string which is UTF8 encoded
14:21:38 <dape> ... technically possible
14:22:13 <dape> ... can contain German Umlaut or Japanese characters
14:22:24 <dape> ... we noticed discrepancy
14:22:36 <dape> ... we reference RFC3986
14:22:45 <dape> ... anyURI is IRI
14:23:02 <dape> ... both are in normative tables and we have some conflict
14:23:33 <dape> KH: in href we say IRU and not URI
14:23:37 <dape> EK: Correct
14:24:01 <dape> ... I think W3C review asked us to use IRI
14:24:19 <dape> ... but correct, there is a discrepancy
14:24:28 <luca_barbato> luca_barbato has joined #wot-td
14:24:33 <luca_barbato> q+
14:24:39 <dape> ... IRI parsing not common in code basis
14:25:18 <dape> ... I found https://www.w3.org/International/wiki/IRIStatus
14:25:45 <dape> EK: We can restrict it per protocol to URIs
14:26:19 <dape> LB: Would it be enough to point IRI RFC
14:26:39 <dape> .... saying non ASCII characters are allowed
14:26:49 <dape> ... most parsing libraries do work with unicode
14:27:06 <dape> ... main problem is weird escaping
14:27:21 <dape> ... DNS had problems with IRI
14:28:35 <dape> ... we could restrict strings to UTF8
14:29:03 <dape> EK: IRI handling in specific parts only?
14:29:28 <dape> LB: yes, but sounds more profile worthy
14:29:53 <dape> ... we should review the RFCs
14:30:07 <dape> ... and pick the one that fits our target
14:30:38 <dape> ... TD should give freedom
14:30:45 <dape> ... profile can restrict
14:31:04 <Ege> q?
14:31:06 <Ege> ack l
14:31:25 <dape> KH: We want address resources on the Web
14:31:32 <dape> ... we should use Web standards
14:31:44 <dape> ... we can choose URL, IRI etc
14:31:51 <dape> ... no matter of taste
14:32:02 <dape> ... it is about protocol
14:32:18 <dape> ... protocol driver (HTTP, CoAP) needs to know
14:32:35 <dape> ... so far URI standard is used
14:32:58 <egekorkan> egekorkan has joined #wot-td
14:33:16 <dape> ... value in href field (or base field) use URI
14:33:26 <luca_barbato> Related specifications: https://url.spec.whatwg.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc3987
14:33:38 <dape> ... w.r.t. to OPC-UA I need to see the ABNF grammar
14:34:13 <dape> EK: Document is open to members
14:34:20 <dape> ... not sure if it contains ABNF
14:34:31 <dape> KH: There should be something
14:35:00 <dape> ... saying URI or IRI
14:35:34 <dape> ... you cannot say URI standard and put unicode characters in query string
14:36:06 <luca_barbato> q+
14:36:28 <dape> LB: We can make it extra flexible
14:36:42 <dape> ... field is UTF8 string and offload it to protocol
14:36:50 <dape> KH: This cannot work
14:37:00 <dape> ... because of base
14:37:38 <dape> EK: True
14:38:10 <dape> ... unless we indicate in a different way the protocol
14:38:26 <dape> KH: We could get rid of base and href ...
14:38:40 <dape> ... and come upo with a combined string per protocol
14:38:51 <dape> ... but it creates major problems
14:39:17 <dape> MN: hypermedia concept claim does no longer make sense also
14:39:37 <dape> LB: Easiest thing is to pick the right definittion of href
14:40:17 <dape> ... additional field for anything we cannot support
14:40:30 <dape> KH: I would go with URI
14:40:57 <dape> ... no huge problem, I think we need a pragmatic solution
14:41:14 <dape> ... for base is correct
14:41:29 <dape> ... for href it should be used URI also (currently not the case)
14:41:56 <dape> LB: Uniform to URI
14:42:09 <dape> KH: Yes, it should be always been URI
14:43:45 <dape> ... there are options to support unicode in URI
14:43:59 <dape> ... we need to better understand the OPC-UA requirements
14:44:06 <dape> q+
14:44:11 <dape> ack dape
14:44:28 <dape> ack luca_barbato
14:44:30 <dape> q+
14:44:44 <dape> EK: IRI to URI is in RFC?
14:45:07 <dape> KH: Yes, there is a conversion algorithm
14:45:56 <dape> ... UTF8 bytes to percentage encoding
14:48:21 <dape> DP: the OPCUA binding requires percentage encoding
14:48:29 <dape> EK: Not sure
14:49:07 <dape> KH: We need to check we (or OPCUA) violate the standard
14:49:47 <dape> EK: Let's look at the OPC spec
14:50:05 <dape> KH: Next week Wed I cannot join, I can join Thursday
14:50:08 <dape> EK: Thanks!
14:50:37 <egekorkan> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2154
14:50:49 <dape> TOPIC: Common definitions
14:51:03 <dape> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2154
14:51:37 <dape> EK: I started the exercise to extend the  examples
14:51:42 <egekorkan> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/blob/ege-common-definitions-examples/proposals/common-definitions/tooling/tds.js
14:52:21 <dape> EK: examples at line 454
14:52:41 <dape> ... recommendedTDs
14:53:21 <dape> ... e.g., change from default contentType JSON to cbor etc
14:53:41 <dape> ... or Modbus with all parameters
14:53:53 <dape> ... multi IP addresses
14:54:09 <dape> ... local vs public security
14:54:47 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:54:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
14:55:19 <dape> EK: Do you see more useful examples?
14:55:28 <dape> ... to test this new method
14:55:40 <dape> ... will show it tomorrow in more details
14:55:57 <dape> ... please provide feedback in PR
14:56:23 <dape> ... in PR I summarized also some of my findings
14:56:57 <dape> TOPIC: Bindings
14:56:59 <egekorkan> github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/446
14:57:11 <egekorkan> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/446
14:57:19 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:57:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
14:57:42 <dape> EK: realized some mistakes
14:57:53 <dape> ... no proper rendering for Modbus
14:58:18 <dape> ... the same stupid error appeared more often
14:58:36 <dape> ... I also updated the authors
14:59:03 <dape> ... same change everywhere expect Modbus with more changes
14:59:21 <egekorkan> q?
14:59:27 <dape> ... I will wait a bit for feedback
14:59:32 <dape> ack dape
15:00:02 <dape> KH: Wonder why S has been removed in general
15:00:25 <dape> EK: We started off with S and changed later on
15:00:48 <dape> ... due to W3C feedback
15:00:52 <dape> KH: I see
15:01:17 <dape> EK: IANA uses plural and W3C seems to use singular
15:02:06 <dape> s/EK: IANA/KH: IANA
15:02:14 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:02:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
15:02:45 <dape> [adjourned]
15:02:46 <dape> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:02:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/10/15-wot-td-minutes.html dape
15:26:20 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
17:15:48 <Zakim> Zakim has left #wot-td
18:11:42 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
18:28:56 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
18:45:24 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
20:01:46 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
20:29:09 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
21:01:35 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
21:13:57 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
21:16:50 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
21:34:48 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
22:22:38 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
22:43:40 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
22:59:48 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td
23:33:40 <Ege> Ege has joined #wot-td