13:51:39 RRSAgent has joined #wpwg 13:51:43 logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/09/25-wpwg-irc 13:51:43 Meeting: Web Payments Working Group 13:51:46 Chair: Ian 13:51:48 Scribe: Ian 13:52:07 Agenda: https://github.com/w3c/webpayments/wiki/Agenda-20250925 13:52:42 agenda+ Extending SPC with line items for 13:52:52 agenda+ Avoiding double-step up related to BBKs 13:52:58 agenda+ TPAC check-in 13:53:05 agenda+ Upcoming meetings 13:58:02 present+ Ian_Jacobs 13:59:42 vasilii has joined #wpwg 14:00:36 present+ David_Benoit 14:00:43 present+ Rogerio_Matsui 14:00:53 present+ Ashawany_Rayu 14:01:04 present+ Daniel_Wyckoff 14:01:10 present+ Vasilii_Trofimchuk 14:01:14 present+ Steve_Cole 14:01:18 present+ Arman_Aygen 14:02:32 present+ Taskashi_Minamii 14:02:44 present+ Fahad_Saleem 14:02:44 present+ Nakjo_Shishkov 14:02:48 jpm-block has joined #wpwg 14:02:49 present+ Juan-Pablo_Marzetti 14:02:53 present+ Ehsan_Toreini 14:03:00 present+ Dan_Pelegero 14:03:23 present+ Henna_Kapur 14:03:31 Takashi has joined #wpwg 14:03:46 present+ 14:03:50 DP has joined #wpwg 14:03:52 present+ Albert_Schibani 14:04:39 zakim, take up item 1 14:04:40 agendum 1 -- Extending SPC with line items for -- taken up [from Ian] 14:04:42 https://github.com/w3c/secure-payment-confirmation/issues/313 14:05:48 Vasilii: The problem statement - when you want to check out (including agentic AI checkout) where there is limited buyer/seller interaction, there may be concern about the buyer paying for something they didn't accept. This opens up risk for chargebacks. 14:06:09 Ehsan has joined #wpwg 14:06:18 ...I wanted to explore whether there is an opportunity to aid sellers by putting additional information into the display and what is signed. 14:06:18 ...namely the line items 14:06:21 present+ Gustavo_Kok 14:06:26 present+ Nick_Telford-Reed 14:07:24 ack Gus 14:08:38 Gustavo: I'd like to tie into this conversation AP2 and how they are thinking about tackling this topic. They are not combining the info with the payment; they are separating them. 14:08:50 ...so the user's prompt happens first (with a signature), then payment happens separately 14:08:57 ...and so the user intent achieves the goal. 14:09:10 ...I think something like that makes more sense to me than trying to embed too much into SPC> 14:09:26 Vasilii: Fair point. This AP2 came after I raised the issue. :) 14:09:41 ...but it makes a good point about having the groups work together. 14:10:38 Henna: To answer the point about these groups coming together...my understanding is that AP2 was mostly done on the google side and they put it out as an idea. On the FIDO Alliance Payments WG side, we'll start talking about a component of that proposal, related to signing the intent. 14:10:47 ...that discussion will start very soon. 14:11:04 ...I think the signed intent is still very much linked to a payment object; it's not completely separate. 14:11:37 present+ Fahad_Saleem 14:11:57 Fahad: There are several intent types mentioned by Google (including a raw intent for what the user wants to purchase) 14:12:04 ...that ends up in a VC 14:12:32 ...the next step is when the agent is executing it against a merchant, the merchant can check the mandate and issue it's own "cart mandate" with cart items 14:12:45 ...all of that happens before the payment method has been selected. 14:13:04 ...at the end there is a payment mandate with payment credential. 14:13:23 +q to quickly talk about regulatory requirements under psd2 14:13:29 ...we think that the VC that will be discussed at FIDO will have the payment bound together, but there may be scenarios where a mandate is not bound to a payment credential 14:13:36 ...I think this will come down to payment details. 14:13:51 ack nick 14:13:51 nicktr, you wanted to quickly talk about regulatory requirements under psd2 14:14:29 nicktr: I think it's interesting ... but I have a regulatory point (and a UX point). The challenge I think that the payment step in agentic payments (in regulated markets) is that you'll need to come back up to user space for the actual payment. 14:15:16 ...you can't rely on card on file for agentic payment. The user needs to sign across the amount, currency, and merchant 14:15:29 present+ Sue_Koomen 14:15:36 present+ Tomasso 14:15:40 present- Tomasso 14:15:44 present+ TommasoD 14:16:10 Gustavo: We've been talking with Google about this, and their intent was to kick off a conversation. 14:16:33 ...one question is where to host conversations. 14:16:44 ...there's something on GitHub for collecting feedback. 14:17:03 ...I'm hoping that the conversation goes into an entity where the space can be well-described. 14:18:05 ...there's also going to be need for flexibility about how much friction will be necessary in a particular context. 14:18:18 Nick: Right, success will go to who can best understand inferred intent. 14:19:06 Gustavo: There are use cases where the agenda does the search but in the end the user agrees to a cart. But the frictionless flow will be the most challenging. 14:19:45 Ian: I'm trying to get someone to TPAC 14:20:06 Gustavo: I can help make a connection. 14:21:39 Ian: What should we do with the pull request at this point? 14:21:48 Vasilii: I welcome feedback on the pull request. 14:22:05 ....I think the main idea was conferring with the user during the last mile. 14:22:27 ...I think the problem will still be there. I think there will be some experiences in the browser. 14:23:27 zakim, close item 2 14:23:27 agendum 2, Avoiding double-step up related to BBKs, closed 14:23:28 I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 14:23:28 1. Extending SPC with line items for [from Ian] 14:23:36 zakim, take up item 2 14:23:36 agendum 2 -- Avoiding double-step up related to BBKs -- taken up [from Ian] 14:25:05 https://github.com/w3c/secure-payment-confirmation/issues/287#issuecomment-3246173874 14:25:21 Albert has joined #wpwg 14:25:29 Roger has joined #wpwg 14:27:35 q? 14:29:15 Tom has joined #wpwg 14:29:55 please, repost for late(new) joines :-) 14:30:07 https://github.com/w3c/secure-payment-confirmation/issues/287#issuecomment-3246173874 14:30:16 Thank you sir 14:32:30 scribenick: nicktr 14:33:21 dan: I think the second option (multiple BBKs) is more likely to find favour with the ACS vendors 14:34:31 zakim, close item 2 14:34:31 agendum 2, Avoiding double-step up related to BBKs, closed 14:34:34 I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 14:34:34 1. Extending SPC with line items for [from Ian] 14:34:37 zakim, close item 1 14:34:37 agendum 1, Extending SPC with line items for, closed 14:34:38 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 14:34:38 3. TPAC check-in [from Ian] 14:34:39 zakim, take up item 3 14:34:39 agendum 3 -- TPAC check-in -- taken up [from Ian] 14:40:37 (We review the draft WPSIG agenda and candidate WPWG agenda) 14:40:49 Ian: Any other topics to cover 14:40:57 Vasilii: Any updates on 3DS? 14:42:10 Arman: I'll double check with the 3DS team and get back to you 14:43:14 Ian: One question I was asked recently - what is the state of ACS support of 3DS 2.3.1? 14:43:45 Arman: I can look for the number of products that have gone through testing. 14:43:58 Dan: See https://www.emvco.com/approved-products/?type=3-d_secure 14:44:15 Ian: https://www.emvco.com/approved-products/?type=3-d_secure 14:44:39 https://www.emvco.com/approved-products/?tax%5Bapproved-products_categories%5D%5B102%5D%5B110%2C111%2C112%2C113%5D=112&type=3-d_secure 14:45:09 present+ Praveena 14:46:22 See -> https://github.com/w3c/ai-web-impact/blob/main/agent-report.md 14:47:25 zakim, close item 3 14:47:25 agendum 3, TPAC check-in, closed 14:47:26 I see 1 item remaining on the agenda: 14:47:26 4. Upcoming meetings [from Ian] 14:47:28 zakim, take up item 4 14:47:28 agendum 4 -- Upcoming meetings -- taken up [from Ian] 14:47:38 Ash has joined #WPWG 14:48:07 9 and 23 October 14:48:29 RRSAGENT, make minutes 14:48:31 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/09/25-wpwg-minutes.html Ian 14:48:33 RRSAGENT, set logs public 15:02:52 RRSAGENT, make minutes 15:02:53 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/09/25-wpwg-minutes.html Ian 15:03:05 RRSAGENT, set logs public 16:15:50 TallTed has joined #wpwg