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12:06:18 <Ian> Meeting: Update on Project to Enhance Community Groups
12:50:40 <Ian> Ian has changed the topic to: Community Council
14:11:11 <Ian> Scribe: Dom
14:11:12 <Ian> Chair: Ian
14:11:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/09/03-council-minutes.html Ian
14:13:40 <Ian> agenda+ Update on CG revamp project (Ian)
14:15:53 <Ian> Ian has changed the topic to: Community Council: 3 September slides https://www.w3.org/2025/Talks/cg-update-202509.pdf
14:16:03 <Ian> -> https://www.w3.org/2025/Talks/cg-update-202509.pdf Slides
14:41:43 <Ian> Ian has changed the topic to: Community Council: Meeting info https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/29a19815-57f8-488a-8e14-9b5809bf14de/
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15:01:56 <angel> present+ angel
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15:03:55 <bkardell> present+
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15:03:56 <koalie> present+ Coralie
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15:04:10 <George> present+
15:04:14 <DKA> present+ Dan_Appelquist
15:04:15 <dom> Present+
15:04:16 <lola> present+
15:04:17 <dom> Slideset: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1YlC11-6W5YZcQ4fVwIZ6FaVYyuxmRwcOMsHQlJzHB44/edit?slide=id.g37a8f1332db_0_0#slide=id.g37a8f1332db_0_0
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15:04:27 <dom> Agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/29a19815-57f8-488a-8e14-9b5809bf14de/
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15:05:30 <dom> [slide 2]
15:05:33 <cwilso> present+
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15:07:25 <Steven> present+
15:07:29 <pchampin> present+
15:07:51 <anssik> present+ Anssi_Kostiainen
15:07:56 <tzviya> present+
15:07:57 <dom> [slide 3]
15:07:58 <dom> [slide 4]
15:08:03 <dom> [slide 6]
15:08:32 <dom> [slide 7]
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15:11:27 <dom> [slide 8]
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15:14:57 <dom> [slide 9]
15:16:23 <dom> [slide 10]
15:17:41 <tantek> present+
15:18:04 <dom> [slide 11]
15:21:06 <dom> [slide 12]
15:21:06 <dom> [slide 14]
15:22:10 <dom> [slide 15]
15:27:13 <vivien> https://w3c.github.io/cg-monitor/spec-monitor.html
15:28:22 <Ian> How monitor info can be useful: which specs need more attention in terms of transition plans or archiving specs
15:28:36 <Ian> ...tool will help staff and groups manage their specs
15:28:41 <Ian> ...and communicate more clearly the status of work
15:30:29 <denis> https://github.com/deniak/cg-spec-metadata/blob/main/cg-monitor.json
15:30:59 <Ian> Denis: We anticipate using per-spec metadata that will be used to drive display of status information in bike shed and respec
15:32:07 <Ian> (Denis walks through sample vocabulary and some values)
15:34:16 <denis> https://github.com/speced/bikeshed/pull/3143
15:36:19 <dom> [slide 16]
15:37:09 <dom> [slide 19]
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15:37:24 <dom> [slide 20]
15:37:25 <DKA> q?
15:37:28 <DKA> q+
15:38:30 <dom> [slide 21]
15:39:34 <bkardell> q+
15:39:45 <dom> [recording stops]
15:39:58 <Ian> q?
15:40:00 <Ian> ack DKA
15:40:03 <tantek> vq?
15:40:12 <dom> DKA: this all sounds great, very exciting
15:40:13 <Ian> q+ Elf
15:40:32 <dom> ... making WG easier to join for contributor sounds particularly exciting
15:41:02 <dom> ... speaking as a CG chair, for non browser specs - will that apply to them
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15:41:18 <Ian> DKA: Any work on non-browser specs?
15:41:23 <tzviya> q+ tess
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15:41:43 <Ian> Dom: We showed demos that talk about browser APIs, but the goal is to cover non-browser APIs as well
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15:41:49 <hober> present+
15:41:50 <cpn> present+
15:41:53 <Ian> ...traction will be measured differently in different contexts
15:41:54 <Ian> present+
15:41:58 <hober> q?
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15:42:05 <hober> q+
15:42:07 <Ian> ...we'll work with groups on the right way to collect signals and define traction for that community
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15:42:24 <Ian> ...it's clear to both Ian and me that a big value of the program is to have a variety of innovation.
15:42:34 <elf-pavlik> q+
15:42:38 <Ian> ...we prototyped based on low-hanging fruit but should work for all groups
15:42:48 <Ian> ack bk
15:43:46 <dom> bkardell: I've often seen CGs confused or frustrated, thinking they're doing all the right things only to find out that this won't fly through wide review or get adoption in implementation
15:43:49 <tantek> +1 bkardell
15:44:13 <tzviya> +1 to horizontal discussion with CGs
15:44:14 <wendyreid> +1 bkardell
15:44:16 <dom> ... any thoughts of we could do that better? e.g. a monthly call for early insights; not formal wide reviews as we get in the formal process
15:44:37 <dom> Ian: great suggestion, maybe through a combination of training and socialization
15:44:58 <Steven> q+ to ask about activities
15:45:02 <dom> ... surfacing these questions earlier is one thing we had identified
15:45:02 <tantek> rather than "training", curious if there are "self-service" docs/guides for things like common success paths and failure modes for CGs
15:45:05 <Ian> q?
15:45:09 <Ian> ack Elf
15:45:17 <dom> ... maybe we can build agendas based on our monitoring tools
15:45:24 <koalie> q- elf-pavlik
15:45:37 <dom> Elf: chair of Solid CG; is there still something related to the modern tooling efforts and if so where?
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15:45:49 <fantasai> tantek, probably having both would be good ; some people are more comfortable in docs, and some people with in-person interaction.
15:45:53 <dom> ... one of the tools I would imagine would be focus on use cases and requirements
15:46:04 <dom> ... CGs can be focused more on problems or on more solutions
15:46:21 <dom> ... in the Social Web WG, we used the "Social Web Acid Test" to evaluate possible solutions
15:46:46 <dom> ... a CG-wide repo of use cases and requirements would allow to compare how different solutions meet different requirements, possibly across CGs
15:46:52 <Ian> q?
15:46:55 <Ian> ack tess
15:46:58 <dom> q- hober
15:47:06 <anssik> q?
15:47:10 <anssik> q+
15:47:39 <dom> tess: re lower barriers to transition, the second point was how to ease IPR commitments flow to other SDOs
15:47:49 <dom> ... that will be brought to PSIG for discussion
15:48:11 <dom> ... I would suggest also bringing the first point (continued participation) to PSIG
15:48:38 <elf-pavlik> reference https://w3c.github.io/modern-tooling/
15:48:47 <dom> ... the AB has had recent turnover - it may be useful to have another conversation with the AB in that context
15:48:59 <tantek> +1 tess
15:49:20 <dom> Ian: could we get the AB work as individual in the council?
15:49:42 <dom> Tess: maybe, worth discussing with the AB
15:50:31 <dom> Ian: re PSIG, the IPR considerations are very important - we expect to get organizational commitments from these continued contributors
15:50:34 <DKA> Yes potentially that sounds like a good idea for AB members to join the CG council. Let's be clear about it and call it the CG council in future communications.
15:50:55 <hdv> +1 DKA
15:51:19 <fantasai> +1 DKA
15:51:32 <dom> Ian: re due structures/business models, we've chatted with the Membership task force - we're conducting this as an experiment as input to more formal conversations
15:51:32 <Ian> q?
15:51:32 <dom> q?
15:51:37 <Ian> ack Steven
15:51:37 <Zakim> Steven, you wanted to ask about activities
15:52:01 <DKA> We're discussing how the AB can help to support incubation in tomorrow's AB call (as it's one of out key priorities for this year) so I'm sure we'll discuss tomorrow.
15:52:36 <dom> Steven: re transitioning to standardization, a regular question is what contact / group should we target
15:53:07 <BC> exit
15:53:20 <dom> Ian: the expectations is that Ian and I would serve as primary points of contacts to dispatch to the right next steps
15:53:46 <Ian> ack anss
15:54:45 <dom> Anssi: have you also considered lowering barriers from transitioning WG to CG? if it were well defined how to go back to incubation, it could benefit both directions
15:55:01 <bkardell> are there examples of things that went that way?
15:55:03 <koalie> scribe+
15:55:08 <Ian> Dom: You make a good point.
15:55:08 <koalie> Dom: we haven't considered it really
15:55:13 <bkardell> oh I guess xslt for example?
15:55:20 <elf-pavlik> I believe both Social WG and LDP WG after conclusion formed CGs
15:55:25 <Ian> q?
15:55:26 <tantek> q+ to encourage monthly iteration on this topic / group on "evolving CGs", based on the strong level of interest displayed by the number of participants
15:55:30 <Ian> zakim, close the queue
15:55:30 <Zakim> ok, Ian, the speaker queue is closed
15:55:30 <koalie> ... there is a lot of know how in the commnunity but not documentation about success or failure paths
15:55:33 <Steven> s/expectations is that Ian and I/expectations is that Dom and I
15:55:53 <koalie> ... maybe ensuring we check the right boxes and have also simple path back, that feels worth exploring
15:56:02 <koalie> Ian: Anssi, please raise this as an issue?
15:56:06 <koalie> anssik: will do
15:56:21 <koalie> ... the idea is to make it easy for WGs
15:56:29 <koalie> ... if you can explain it's a two-way street
15:56:34 <koalie> ... it may be helpful for people
15:56:48 <Ian> https://github.com/w3c/cg-council/issues
15:56:50 <koalie> Ian: It would be great to document use-cases you have in mind
15:56:57 <koalie> scribe-
15:57:01 <Ian> ack fantasai
15:57:01 <Zakim> fantasai, you wanted to comment on some concerns wrt using the IE program for this purpose
15:57:18 <dom> fantasai: +1 tess re taking licensing experiment to PSIG for review
15:57:20 <elf-pavlik> present+
15:57:24 <Daniel> present+
15:57:36 <wolfgang> present+
15:57:38 <cwilso> +1000; I've been telling Dom and Ian that PSIG is the next step here for a while
15:57:40 <dom> ... I am concerned that the way to integrate the company level commitment will work correctly with the patent policy
15:57:47 <Ian> (This is the WG patent policy)
15:57:47 <dom> ... I don't want to create a 3rd patent regime
15:57:51 <norm> present+
15:58:07 <tantek> +1 fantasai, PSIG for handling IP issues brought up in these discussions
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15:58:51 <dom> ... on the business side, re-using the invited expert program - what we really need is a concept for a WG member distinct from the traditional participation model
15:59:13 <dom> Ian: re-using IE program is a mean to experiment, isn't meant as the final implementation
15:59:26 <DKA> 62
15:59:36 <koalie> 71 at the max
15:59:38 <dom> Tantek: re regular meeting, there is enough interest to continue these conversations more regularly
16:00:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/09/03-council-minutes.html Ian
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