13:07:22 RRSAgent has joined #wot-profile 13:07:26 logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-irc 13:07:29 meeting: WoT Profile 13:08:45 Mizushima has joined #wot-profile 13:08:50 chair: Ben 13:09:26 present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Ben_Francis, David_Ezell, Ege_Korkan, Josh_Thomas, Kunihiko_Toumura, Michael_Koster, Tomoaki_Mizushima 13:09:35 rrsagent, make log public 13:09:39 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:09:40 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:10:19 agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Profile_WebConf#Profiles_-_2025-08-06 13:10:25 dezell has joined #wot-profile 13:10:28 scribenick: EgeKorkan 13:10:28 scribenick: EgeKorkan 13:10:34 topic: Agenda Review 13:10:38 bf: It can be quick 13:10:42 ... lets see 13:10:46 topic: Minutes Review 13:10:48 present+ David_Ezell 13:10:51 bf: you had time to review 13:11:05 i|you|-> https://www.w3.org/2025/07/30-wot-profile-minutes.html July-30| 13:11:08 ... any objections? 13:11:11 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:11:12 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:11:18 ... approved 13:11:31 topic: Schedule 13:11:56 bf: We decided to publish on 31st of July. That didn't work but we had the resolution at least 13:11:59 s/It can be/The call today can be/ 13:12:04 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:12:05 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:12:11 topic: PRs 13:12:16 bf: there were editorial PRs 13:12:22 ... I have merged them already 13:12:54 subtopic: PR 442 13:13:00 s/442/443 13:13:15 -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/pull/443 PR 443 - Change words to US English - closes #442 13:13:37 bf: I did the work via a spell checker 13:13:56 ... there is comment about an id change but it can break a link 13:14:51 q? 13:15:42 topic: Issues 13:15:51 subtopic: Issue 432 13:15:59 bf: we had a back and forth on this 13:16:04 ... some feedback from ML and LB 13:16:51 i|we had|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-profile/issues/432 Issue 432 - Convert specification to Working Group Note and add a note about the document status| 13:16:55 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:16:57 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:17:14 ... (shows the proposed text in the issue comment) 13:18:02 q? 13:18:14 q? 13:18:22 bf: any comments? 13:18:24 ek: looks good 13:18:26 q+ 13:18:49 This document was initially on the W3C Recommendation Track and published as a Working Draft on 18 January 2023. The WoT Working Group later decided not to continue to pursue the document to W3C Recommendation status and instead to publish it as a Group Note, as a useful point of reference for use with the WoT 1.x family of specifications. 13:18:49 A Group Note provides a stable reference for a document that is not intended to be a formal standard. This specification has been written based on extensive implementation experience, and testing through multiple plugfests, but has not undergone the full W3C-wide review that would be required for a W3C Recommendation. Implementers therefore implement this specification at their own risk. 13:18:50 Following the publication of this Note, the Working Group intends to switch their attention to a new recommendation track WoT Profiles 2.0 specification for use with the WoT 2.x family of specifications. 13:19:09 i|This document was|[[ 13:19:11 ]] 13:19:17 q? 13:19:44 q? 13:19:48 q- 13:19:56 bf: any other comments? 13:20:13 ... hearing none, I am adding this call's comments as a comment on github 13:20:33 kaz: the text itself looks good but as discussed during the main call today, we need to talk with PLH again 13:22:01 q+ 13:22:08 https://www.w3.org/policies/process/#switching-tracks 13:22:59 i|swit|-> https://www.w3.org/policies/process/#abandon-draft W3C Process - 6.3.13.1. Abandoning an Unfinished Recommendation 13:23:29 q? 13:23:39 s|https://www.w3.org/policies/process/#switching-tracks|-> https://www.w3.org/policies/process/#switching-tracks W3C Process - 6.6. Switching Tracks| 13:24:04 ek: technically, we can still change the document track from REC Track to Note Track 13:24:17 ... but we need to talk with the Council and it might take long 13:24:57 ... a possibility is we simply publish the document as WD, and we can think about a bit different mechanism for Profile itself (like Bindings Registry) when we work on Profile 2.0 13:25:32 q? 13:25:44 i|technically|scribenick: kaz| 13:25:56 q+ 13:26:19 ack e 13:26:51 bf: I agree with Ege about the scary text 13:27:10 i|agree|scribenick: Ege| 13:27:13 bf: I understand that switching tracks is about patent issues 13:27:28 ... W3C seems to want to protect itself 13:27:50 bf: how do we demonstrate "due consideration" 13:28:17 kaz: it means filling a legal team at W3C first. 13:28:29 q+ 13:28:50 ... we can just publish as WD and work on 2.0 13:28:52 ack k 13:29:48 s/we can/on the other hand, we can/ 13:29:58 s/and work/and then work/ 13:30:16 q? 13:30:55 q+ 13:31:11 bf: I think we don't want to get stuck in the legal stuff for 6 months 13:31:30 ek: I think discontinued draft still doesn't help, we need to switch tracks to publish a note 13:32:04 bf: We can keep publishing a WD, version it etc. 13:32:18 ... going to Ege's comment. Registry still makes sense 13:32:25 q? 13:33:40 ack e 13:33:41 ack k 13:33:47 q+ 13:34:20 ek: it would be a new document, not switching to a new track 13:34:58 ack k 13:35:00 q+ 13:36:11 q? 13:36:16 bf: we can shrink the spec to the mechanism 13:36:26 q+ 13:36:46 q? 13:36:50 ack k 13:37:13 kaz: yes we need clarify the difference between profile and the mechiansm. also difference between binding and profile 13:37:28 s/need/need to/ 13:39:13 s/difference between profile and the mechanism/relationship between the Profile mechanism and the Profile Registry/ 13:39:32 s/yes we/yes, and for that purpose (=Profile 2.0), we/ 13:39:37 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:39:38 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:39:46 q+ 13:40:21 q? 13:41:04 ek: there is no versioning in W3C. You can just create a new document 13:41:23 ... profile registry would not need anything from profile 1.0, 2.0 or something 13:41:55 q? 13:42:01 ack e 13:42:02 ack k 13:42:21 bf: should we go for a rec now 13:43:01 /me 13:43:22 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:43:23 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:43:57 i|I agree with Ege about|scribenick: EgeKorkan| 13:43:58 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:44:00 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:44:24 i|the text itself looks good|scribenick: kaz| 13:44:24 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:44:25 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:44:37 q+ 13:47:49 s/difference between profile and the mechiansm/relationship between the Profile mechanism and the Profile Registry/ 13:47:51 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:47:52 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:48:04 s|s/difference between profile and the mechanism/relationship between the Profile mechanism and the Profile Registry/|| 13:48:05 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:48:07 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 13:49:35 topic: Going for REC 13:49:50 bf: what do you think Ege about the current state of the document 13:49:51 q? 13:49:53 q? 13:50:13 ek: I think we need also data schemas etc. for OOTBI. For now these are just best practices for me 13:50:26 ... that means going the Matter route and you need certification etc. 13:50:39 ... in Siemens there are "profiles" but without this mechanism. Just guidelines 13:50:59 bf: these are not just best practices from my point of view 13:52:58 ... there are layers of interop indeed. Adding data schemas would add that indeed. With WebThings we did it with capability schemas 13:53:05 ... profiles give the guarantee of communication 13:53:24 ... so there won't be a pretty UI 13:54:54 de: for those walking in, like new people looking for implementation, they see a lot of things they don't know 13:55:59 q? 13:56:01 de: Profiles pave the way for these people to get easier to act on text 13:57:35 ... they see it and say "this is something I can do" 13:59:08 bf: We can continue as a group note today if W3C allows it but we need to check with them 14:00:26 ... we should check with W3C again 14:00:33 ... we can adjourn now 14:01:14 i/we can/kaz: as already discussed during the main call and this call, I'll talk with PLH again, and would clarify what we could do from the Process' viewpoint./ 14:01:18 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:01:20 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 14:01:40 s/Going for REC/Going for REC?/ 14:01:41 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:01:43 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz 14:01:50 i/as already/scribenick: kaz/ 14:02:00 i/we can/scribenick: EgeKorkan/ 14:02:02 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:02:04 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/08/06-wot-profile-minutes.html kaz