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17:02:21 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Daniel
17:02:27 <Daniel> Meeting: PDF-AAM Meeting
17:02:56 <Zakk> present
17:03:00 <Zakk> present+
17:03:00 <Paul> present+
17:03:06 <Daniel> present+
17:03:23 <jcraig> present+
17:03:37 <Daniel> Topic: First import of PDF-AAM mappings https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/2466/
17:03:41 <Daniel> Chair: Daniel
17:03:43 <Daniel> scribe: Daniel
17:05:07 <Daniel> Zakk: Thanks for your commits Daniel
17:05:24 <Daniel> .. I mentioned a couple of lines we could look at
17:05:50 <Daniel> s/..s/...
17:05:52 <Zakk> lines: 264, 278, 361, and the table starting on 396
17:07:46 <Daniel> Subtopic: Line 400 -- label role
17:08:30 <Daniel> Zakk: We wanted to try this one out as there is not a clear correspondence
17:08:39 <Daniel> ... We may need to create a new pDF row
17:08:47 <Daniel> ... How could we provide guidance?
17:09:08 <Daniel> JamesC: In this case you would point to the HTML-AAM, you could just say "use the HTML mappings"
17:10:25 <Daniel> Daniel: -> https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/2466/#discussion_r2210982091 See my comment
17:11:37 <Daniel> Daniel: That's how this should look like
17:12:06 <Daniel> JamesC: You don't need to map a pdf- role. If you did, we should probably decide if we need to put it somewhere in the dpub-aria
17:12:26 <Daniel> ... HTML has one and I am not sure if it predates this
17:13:41 <Daniel> Duff: I was reading a GitHub discussion about this. But we should cover other use cases of the `lbl` element that don't have a good paralel on the HTML element
17:13:48 <Daniel> Paul: We have both of them taken into account
17:14:12 <Daniel> JamesC: In HTML you have `a` element with and without and `href`. That could be the approach
17:14:45 <jcraig> https://w3c.github.io/html-aam/#el-label
17:15:19 <Daniel> Zakk: I just need to change this
17:17:32 <Daniel> Zakk: What do we want to put on line 412?
17:17:48 <Daniel> s/412/412 for the non-HTML elements/
17:17:54 <Daniel> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:17:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/16-pdf-aam-minutes.html Daniel
17:18:28 <Daniel> JamesC: in this case it would be `<code>label</code> element`
17:18:55 <Daniel> ... For the others, use HTML-AAM mappings
17:19:55 <Daniel> JamesC: We need to pull out the notes probably
17:20:50 <Daniel> s/We need to pull out the notes probably/We sshould probably leave the note/
17:21:52 <Daniel> JamesC: If no link, we should probably remove the class
17:22:47 <Daniel> Duff: We have use WAI ARIA mappings. Should we use PDF mappings?
17:23:36 <Daniel> JamesC: "In the context of forms" is a bit tricky. We should be more explicit. I think in HTML it calls out the relationship
17:24:06 <Daniel> ... Is there something that the PDF author should take into account
17:24:28 <Daniel> Zakk: Label as a child of a form element?
17:24:37 <Daniel> Duff: You have to give the correct semantics for it
17:25:31 <Daniel> JamesC: Child of, group with, or maybe a tagging relationship. Maybe in this case the parenthetical can be replaced with "label which is associated with a form element"
17:26:01 <Daniel> Paul: that makes sense and plays well with the other ccontexts where lbl is used outside forms
17:26:21 <Daniel> Zakk: This is role label forms, and the other can be role label list
17:26:30 <Daniel> Paul: Label can be used for headings as well, not just lists
17:26:48 <Daniel> Zakk: Yes, I was just thinking from an organizational perspective, we can get as specific or as general as we like
17:27:13 <Daniel> JamesC: Anything that requires a different mapping needs to be called out separately: form elements, lists, headings, and maybe a catch all
17:27:37 <Daniel> Duff: There are three: forms, lists, and content. Content could be headings, footnotes, etc
17:27:47 <Daniel> Zakk: There is also the generic which maps to generic
17:28:27 <Daniel> JamesC: I think you want to add the parenthetical outside the `code` block: "label other than in the context of lists of forms"
17:28:50 <Daniel> Paul: We haven't broken out labels that match
17:29:09 <Daniel> Zakks: List numbering or the other various ones we are going to have to provide guidance for some of the unique labeling.
17:29:20 <Daniel> Paul: If they are going to be generic do we need to separate them out?
17:29:40 <Daniel> Zakk: No. We only need an additional mapping if the platform mapping is different
17:29:54 <Daniel> Paul: So I would say forms and out of forms for now
17:30:14 <Daniel> Duff: Don't we want to clarify that there is additional consideration for labels that may not map to generic?
17:30:23 <Daniel> JamesC: We could include it in a note
17:31:04 <Daniel> Zakk: Ideally is to have these eleven entries ready for the Editor's Draft
17:31:31 <Daniel> Duff: It's in scope and may create misunderstandings if not addressed appropriately
17:33:41 <Daniel> Daniel: I think priority for us is to have the import script working. We could clarify the situation on the status of this document so that it's clear upfront for everybody
17:34:17 <Daniel> Topic: Wrap up
17:34:33 <Daniel> Zakk: Let me know what we need to do to get this merged
17:35:47 <Daniel> Daniel: I'll re-review these last additions, then ask Valerie for review and if she's happy we can merge
17:35:51 <Daniel> rrsagent, make minutes
17:35:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/16-pdf-aam-minutes.html Daniel
17:37:41 <Daniel> s/<Zakk> present//
17:38:15 <Daniel> s\s/..s/...\\
17:38:17 <Daniel> rrsagent, make minutes
17:38:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/16-pdf-aam-minutes.html Daniel