12:56:52 RRSAgent has joined #smart-cities 12:56:56 logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-irc 12:57:10 meeting: Web-based Digital Twins for Smart Cities IG 12:57:34 present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_Koster 12:58:33 agenda: https://github.com/w3c/smart-cities/blob/main/README.md#7-jul-2025 13:00:16 rrsagent, make log public 13:00:21 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:00:23 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 13:00:46 chair: Koster 13:01:17 present+ Kunihiko_Toumura 13:02:10 Mizushima has joined #smart-cities 13:03:29 present+ Mark_Fox 13:03:37 present+ Tomoaki_Mizushima 13:03:56 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:03:58 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 13:05:06 mjk3 has joined #smart-cities 13:05:34 q? 13:06:38 Mark has joined #smart-cities 13:06:51 scribenick: kaz 13:07:32 topic: Guests 13:07:40 kaz: we have Mark today as well :) 13:07:44 topic: Minutes 13:07:54 -> https://www.w3.org/2025/05/26-smart-cities-minutes.html May-26 13:08:02 mjk: (goes through the minutes) 13:08:40 ... any changes? 13:08:44 (none) 13:09:06 approved 13:09:13 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:09:14 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 13:09:26 topic: PRs 13:09:36 subtopic: PR 8 13:09:46 -> https://github.com/w3c/smart-cities/pull/8 PR 8 - Update technology-categories.md #8 13:09:53 s/ #8// 13:10:06 mjk: (goes through the changes) 13:10:08 q+ 13:10:53 q- 13:10:59 kaz: based on the discussion in May 13:11:07 ... have put two major categories 13:11:27 ... digital twin framework and vocabulary 13:11:38 ... then put the existing contents under those categories 13:11:46 mjk: nothing controversial :) 13:12:20 kaz: right 13:12:25 ... let's merge this PR 13:12:37 ... and then continue our discussion on the existing resources 13:12:40 mjk: ok 13:12:43 ... any objections? 13:12:44 (none) 13:12:46 merged 13:12:53 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:12:54 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 13:13:20 topic: Discussion on the resources 13:13:22 q? 13:13:24 q+ 13:15:06 kaz: Mark mentioned in May that he was working with his students on survey around vocabularies 13:15:50 ... would see which part can be published and which part can be put here on the resources.md and categories.md 13:16:21 mark: so far, what I see is a set of categories is more smart city oriented 13:16:32 q? 13:16:48 ... major services for smart cities are also worked by ISO/IEC 13:16:49 q- 13:17:03 ... transportation, water and public safety, etc. 13:17:20 ... it depends on what you want 13:17:36 ... organizations, companies, etc. 13:17:59 ... vocabularies and ontologies of those contexts for various services 13:18:15 ... e.g., transportation ontology a few years ago 13:18:36 ... water sanitization as well 13:18:44 ... land zoning 13:18:55 ... building 13:19:08 ... section of services for smart cities in general 13:19:16 q+ 13:19:34 kaz: tx a lot for your thoughtful comments! 13:20:02 mjk: like BRICK and Real Estate Core 13:20:23 q? 13:20:35 ... how should we proceed? 13:22:07 kaz: yeah 13:22:18 ... the resources.md is getting messy 13:22:47 ... so would suggest we add those major services and ontologies for smart cities to the technology-categories.md instead 13:23:49 mjk: how to deal with the existing contents? 13:24:10 mark: entity/relationship data is OK to be under vocabularies 13:24:32 ... but would be better to have another category like sensor data for "Time series and measurements" 13:24:42 q- 13:24:57 ... I can show some diagram about the structure 13:25:01 mjk: tx! 13:25:29 ... good to clarify the basic layers also 13:26:00 mark: (shows the ontology stack diagram) 13:26:20 s/)/ 2025-04-07.graffle)/ 13:26:40 ... service level, city level and foundation level 13:27:36 ... foundation level has activity, agreement, agent, city units, change, general properties, location, mereology, organization structure, provenance, recurring event, resource and time 13:28:45 ... city level has building, bylaw, city, contact, contract, household, indicator, infrastructure, land use, person, organization, resident, sensors, service 13:30:04 ... service level has transport network, road network, rail network, micromobility networ, pedestrian network, travel corridor, public transport system, transport alert; public health vent, desease, person, medical resource, resource logistics, @@@ 13:30:18 mjk: are they already standardized? 13:30:26 mark: some of them are already standards 13:30:36 ... and some of them are getting standards 13:30:58 ... (then shows examples) 13:32:23 -> http://ontology.eil.utoronto.ca/5087/2/index.html ISO/IEC 5087-2 Information technology - City data model — Part 2: City level concepts 13:33:00 s/BRICK/Brick/ 13:33:34 mjk: wondering who is using what 13:33:51 mark: good question 13:34:21 mjk: looks a lot of work is done 13:34:33 ... there are RDF-Star and NGSI-LD also 13:34:45 q+ 13:35:12 ... should look into information model also 13:35:58 ... what to be done to create an interoperable framework for smart cities? 13:36:20 ... obviously shouldn't start with creating something from scratch 13:36:35 mark: it's difficult to answer 13:36:49 ...there is not a single place for everything 13:36:57 q? 13:37:02 q- 13:37:17 ... always motivated by people's interest 13:37:52 ... some work done for city and we could look into several papers 13:38:15 ... give me a sec... 13:40:04 ... (shows ISO/IEC 5087-2) 13:40:13 ... the Appendix has resources 13:41:49 kaz: thanks! really useful 13:41:58 ... but do we need to pay for this document? 13:42:09 mark: need to pay for this document itself 13:42:17 ... but don't need to pay for our implementation :) 13:47:18 q+ 13:48:36 kaz: it seems the ISO/IEC site is not publicly available... 13:48:45 ... can we refer to your GitHub repo instead? 13:49:05 -> https://enterpriseintegrationlab.github.io/icity/Household/doc/index-en.html Household Ontology on GitHub 13:49:35 mark: yes, the primary resource is managed on the ISO/IEC site but you can refer to the GitHub also 13:49:42 ... that is our work area 13:49:45 q- 13:50:37 ... the diagram I showed describes the basic architecture of the ontologies 13:51:09 ... but it depends on what you need 13:51:36 mjk: yeah, makes sense 13:51:57 ... what to be implemented and information model to be clarified 13:52:06 ... actual service you need 13:52:23 ... starts getting more specific 13:52:35 q+ 13:53:56 mark: to me, the key adjetive here is "Web-based" 13:54:39 ... also important to have the phrase "Digital Twins" in front of "Smart Cities" 13:55:34 ... wondering what "Web-based" here really means 13:56:56 kaz: we added "Web-based" mainly because we wanted to start with Web standards 13:57:15 ... what to be extended for Web standards is the key question here 13:57:43 mjk: yeah, for example, Web of Things is a Web standard for digital twins 13:57:54 ... we're still scoping as an Interest Group 13:58:11 q+ 13:58:53 q- 13:59:37 kaz: @@@ 14:00:01 mark: think you need to understand multi agents for the Web as well 14:00:35 mjk: right 14:00:36 kaz: indeed 14:01:09 ... actually, that's why we're organizing yet another W3C workshop on smart agents :) 14:01:28 mjk: let's wrap up the discussion 14:02:22 ... need to think about what "Web-based" means for Smart Cities and Digital Twins 14:03:15 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:03:17 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:03:28 topic: Next meeting 14:03:48 kaz: will organize another Doodle poll to accommodate Mark and Torbjorn 14:03:52 mjk: ok 14:04:03 ... the meeting adjourned for today 14:04:06 [adjourned] 14:04:10 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:04:11 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:05:03 present+ Torbjorn_Lahrin 14:05:05 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:05:06 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:06:14 i/@@@/we're getting out of time, but thank you very much for your input, Mark! your advice is always really helpful./ 14:06:16 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:06:17 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:06:45 s/we're getting out of time, but thank you very much for your input, Mark! your advice is always really helpful.// 14:06:55 s/kaz: @@@/kaz: we're getting out of time, but thank you very much for your input, Mark! your advice is always really helpful./ 14:06:57 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:06:59 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:07:34 s/adjetive/adjective/ 14:07:36 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:07:37 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:07:59 s/, @@@/, etc./ 14:08:00 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:08:02 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:21:35 s/ 2025-04-07.graffle// 14:21:36 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:21:37 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 14:21:50 s/ 2025-04-07.graffle// 14:21:52 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:21:53 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/07/07-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz 17:00:59 Zakim has left #smart-cities