14:01:13 RRSAgent has joined #wot-ngsi-ld 14:01:17 logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-irc 14:01:22 meeting: WoT and NGSI-LD 14:01:42 present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Frederic_LE, Martin_Bauer, Michael_Koster, Michael_McCool 14:02:10 rrsagent, make log public 14:02:18 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:02:19 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:02:36 agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WoT-NGSI-LD#March_10%2C_2025 14:02:55 martin has joined #wot-ngsi-ld 14:02:56 chair: McCool 14:03:28 mjk has joined #wot-ngsi-ld 14:05:15 scribenick: mjk 14:05:45 topic: Minutes review 14:05:53 -> https://www.w3.org/2025/03/03-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html Mar-3 14:07:18 present+ Dave_Raggett 14:07:21 mm: working on use cases 14:07:35 martin: also working on use cases 14:07:38 q+ 14:08:06 q- 14:08:45 mm: any objection to publish? 14:08:54 ... no objection, approved 14:09:06 topic: Review use case PRs 14:09:35 ... PR #14 Defining onboarding use case 14:10:10 mm: this PR review can be used to agree on a template 14:10:33 i||#14|subtopic: McCool's Use Case| 14:10:50 https://github.com/w3c/wot-ngsi-ld/pull/14 14:10:58 i||#14|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-ngsi-ld/pull/14 PR 14 - Define Onboarding Use Case example| 14:11:11 present+ Franck_LE_GALL 14:11:20 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:11:21 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:11:55 i|PR #14|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-ngsi-ld/pull/14 PR 14 - Define Onboarding Use Case example| 14:12:03 i|PR #14|subtopic: McCool's Use Case| 14:12:06 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:12:08 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:12:14 mm: (review the use case md document in the examples directory) 14:12:55 -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-ngsi-ld/blob/b680316fe2dc801d41ecc2928a44b3b6a00009b4/examples/onboarding.md rendered MD 14:12:59 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:13:01 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:13:59 ... the format includes a user story: as a (stakeholder) I need (a feature) so that I can (do something of value) , in other words who-what-why 14:15:00 ... also includes a section for design features and a section for applications 14:16:14 s/features/alternatives 14:18:55 mm: (refactoring the document headings) 14:19:46 ... how does it look now? 14:19:51 martin: looks OK 14:20:58 -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-ngsi-ld/blob/d0452640b140d95fb758f19144f3cf74f253449e/examples/onboarding.md updated MD 14:21:04 mm: (explain the use case) 14:21:28 mm: how can we import TDs and use them? 14:21:50 ... the primary use case is to describe devices and services 14:22:47 ... TDs are linked data; it's important to re-export TDs (northbound API) 14:23:29 ... We will use TDs to onboard devices 14:23:47 ... there are 3 options here 14:24:25 ... one is direct graph extension, what is the root of the extended graph? 14:25:04 ... another option is to translate TDs into a more suitable format for the graph 14:26:17 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:26:18 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:26:24 ... yet another option is through RDF annotation of the TD for connecting the TD to the graph as properties of nodes - similar to option one 14:27:23 mm: ... an example use case is getting real time data from a temperature sensor in a lake 14:27:47 ... are there any changes or additions we should make? 14:28:20 martin: the template is fine, the detailed assumptions need further review and discussion 14:28:46 ... we need to look at options 1 and 3 for potential mismatch 14:29:10 q+ 14:29:12 mm: there are some details we need to prepare detailed examples 14:30:38 martin: the question is how NGSI-LD and TD relate, where NGSI-LD is a description of the thing (the lake) and the temperature (a property) and the TD could be used as a method for obtaining the value of the property 14:31:24 ... we can't just add arbitrary RDF to the graph, so TDs are not a good fit like option one 14:31:48 ... Option 3 needs some working out 14:33:42 ... maybe there is a conceptual problem with the use case 14:34:15 martin: what is a thing and what is a Thing Description? 14:34:47 mm: physical things and software services can be Things in WoT 14:35:04 martin: how do we then map that into the NGSI-LD world 14:35:21 mm: there can be non-device entities in NGSI-LD 14:35:47 martin: maybe entities don't represent network devices 14:36:15 mm: at the high level example, I want to locate a temperature value onto a map 14:37:04 ... NGSI-LD and WoT do different things, and we want to bring them together, the question is how do they connect 14:37:24 q? 14:37:30 subtopic: PR #15 14:39:01 kaz: the discussion is a good direction, for further discussion we should determine what kind of devices and entities we are looking at, some specific entities and devices 14:39:23 i|the disc|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-ngsi-ld/issues/15 Issue 15 - Use Case: Thing Description for Thing using NGSI-LD API| 14:39:36 s/PR # 15/Marti's Use Case/ 14:39:39 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:39:40 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:39:46 s/PR/Issue 14:40:11 s/PR #15/Marti's Use Case/ 14:40:17 s/Marti's/Martin's/ 14:40:18 martin: this use case is about the northbound API 14:40:20 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:40:21 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:40:43 s/Issue #15/Martin's Use Case/ 14:40:44 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:40:46 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:40:53 ... what would a TD look like to describe how to access the thing? 14:41:35 mm: if you already have an affordance to an entity, the TD would describe how to use the affordance 14:42:37 martin: need to construct an example TD, how do I map the NGSI-LD operations in the TD? 14:43:07 ... how to use the HTTP binding with JSON-LD content 14:43:36 ... We map Properties to NGSI-LD Attributes 14:43:47 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:43:48 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:44:10 ... there is an issue in that the API currently returns an entire set of Attributes 14:44:33 ... We always send full JSON-LD documents in responses 14:44:56 ... There may be a Patch interface possible 14:46:04 mm: another option (2 above) would define a whole new API to mitigate the conceptual differences 14:46:26 .. a layer to translate concepts 14:46:42 s../... 14:47:31 mm: we should do a detailed design 14:47:59 martin: not clear how links and relationships are used 14:48:35 ... we don't have actions per se, use updates of Attributes 14:49:07 ... looking into Service Execution, which is more easily mapped to TD Actions 14:49:14 q+ 14:49:44 q- 14:49:47 ... looking at how to make Service Execution more like TD Actions 14:50:18 ... for Events, we have Subscriptions which may map to TD Events 14:50:41 q+ 14:51:05 mm: Events and Actions are not described in detail in TD 14:51:37 ... but we do have Profiles that can be used to refine the mechanisms 14:52:10 TallTed has joined #wot-ngsi-ld 14:53:09 kaz: suggest that we clarify what specifically is being mapped from NGSI-LD to TD 14:53:35 mm: we are running out of time, so everyone add comments to the issue 14:54:00 ... also add more use cases now that we have more of a template 14:54:11 s/specifically/specifically, Entities, Things, Services, Applications, etc., 14:54:14 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:54:16 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz 14:54:44 mm: The use cases should correspond to northbound and southbound API patterns 14:54:52 mm: AOB? 14:55:04 i/AOB?/topic: AOB/ 14:55:14 ... reminding that we are meeting every week except for some cancellations 14:55:37 q? 14:55:42 q- 14:55:44 ... the time offset jumps back at the end of the month 14:56:01 mm: Any other business? 14:56:23 ... Adjourned 14:56:37 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:56:38 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/10-wot-ngsi-ld-minutes.html kaz