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15:00:47 <kaz> meeting: WoT-WG - TD-TF - Slot 1
15:00:51 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura
15:00:56 <kaz> regrets+ Sebastian
15:02:34 <kaz> present+ Ege_Korkan, Tomoaki_Mizushima, Michael_Koster
15:03:15 <kaz> q+
15:03:47 <kaz> q-
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15:04:15 <kaz> agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Thing_Description_WebConf#March_5-6%2C_2025
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15:04:56 <kaz> present+ Mahda_Noura
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15:07:57 <kaz> present+ Jan_Romann
15:09:23 <JKRhb> scribenick: JKRhb
15:09:39 <kaz> chair: Ege, Koster
15:09:42 <JKRhb> topic: Agenda Review
15:09:51 <JKRhb> ek: We are going to have a look at Jan's PRs
15:10:00 <JKRhb> ... wanted to review, but a tool wasn't working
15:10:10 <JKRhb> ... there is also a small PR on PROFINET
15:10:20 <JKRhb> ... and the discussion on the binding registry
15:10:26 <JKRhb> topic: Minutes Review
15:10:37 <JKRhb> ek: We only had one meeting last week
15:10:46 <JKRhb> ... you should have received the email already
15:10:57 <JKRhb> ... going to scroll slowly and see if there are going to be any remarks
15:11:03 <JKRhb> ... (scrolls through the document)
15:11:14 <EgeKorkan> q?
15:11:19 <JKRhb> ... okay, do we have any remarks?
15:11:27 <kaz> i|We only had|-> https://www.w3.org/2025/02/27-wot-td-minutes.html Feb-27|
15:11:27 <JKRhb> ... no seeing anything, then we can approve the minutes
15:11:32 <JKRhb> Minutes are approved
15:11:43 <JKRhb> topic: PRs
15:11:43 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
15:11:47 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:11:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:12:06 <JKRhb> subtopic: PR 2082
15:12:07 <EgeKorkan> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2082
15:12:17 <JKRhb> ek: This is a very, very simple PR
15:12:49 <JKRhb> ... (notices that there are a lot of unrelated whitespace changes)
15:13:00 <kaz> s|https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2082|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2082 PR 2082 - Profinet Binding Addition to the table|
15:13:05 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:13:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:13:12 <JKRhb> ... this is just adding the new PROFINET binding to the registry in the WoT TD specification
15:13:27 <JKRhb> ... in the diff, we can see that there is only one line added to a table
15:13:29 <kaz> present+ Daniel_Peintner
15:13:39 <JKRhb> ... therefore, it is mostly an editorial PR
15:13:47 <JKRhb> ... will check the whitespace changes
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15:13:58 <JKRhb> ... but I guess we can go ahead with this one in the meantime
15:14:08 <JKRhb> ... there is a similar PR in the binding repository
15:14:19 <JKRhb> ... where I only added it to the README so far
15:14:31 <JKRhb> ... since the document is not supposed to be kept
15:14:49 <JKRhb> ... so the PR in the registry repository also only adds one line
15:15:04 <cris> cris has joined #wot-td
15:15:06 <JKRhb> ... there is also one tiny unrelated change, but that was intentional
15:15:10 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/416 Binding PR 416 - Profinet Binding Addition to Readme
15:15:34 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:15:35 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:15:48 <JKRhb> ... I will merge the PR in the binding templates repository, but keep the other one open
15:16:02 <JKRhb> topic: PR 2080
15:16:06 <EgeKorkan> scribenick: EgeKorkan
15:16:26 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2080 PR 2080 - fix: align JSON Schema with JSON-LD @context format
15:16:29 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:16:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:16:37 <EgeKorkan> jr: I did not change much. I investigated the question regarding contains field
15:16:39 <EgeKorkan> ... I have tested some examples
15:17:07 <EgeKorkan> ... this PR is necessary to ensure correct behavior
15:17:11 <kaz> s/topic: PR 2080/subtopic: PR 2080/
15:17:12 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:17:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:17:34 <kaz> present+ Cristiano_Aguzzi
15:17:47 <dape> q+
15:17:56 <EgeKorkan> ... if you remove the XXX in the first field, it will not be valid
15:18:38 <EgeKorkan> ek: so old schema validates the wrong one as correct
15:20:32 <dape> ack dape
15:21:37 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:21:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:23:02 <EgeKorkan> q?
15:23:04 <JKRhb> q+
15:23:08 <cris> q+
15:23:42 <EgeKorkan> jr: for some reason, the number value should not be valid
15:25:26 <EgeKorkan> ... we can still merge since it is an improvement
15:25:35 <EgeKorkan> ek: I will do a PR in playground to run a test
15:25:45 <JKRhb> scribenick: JKRhb
15:26:03 <JKRhb> ca: I am okay with merging this PR
15:26:23 <JKRhb> ... but I am a bit concerned with the current behavior
15:27:20 <JKRhb> ... as there are cases that pass that should not
15:28:16 <JKRhb> ... so maybe we should remove the lines that are not related to the issue at hand
15:28:33 <JKRhb> ... dealing with the TD context URLs
15:29:02 <JKRhb> jr: We can remove these lines and open an issue for that to deal with that problem after merging this PR
15:29:19 <JKRhb> ek: (adds a comment to the PR summarizing the discussion)
15:30:13 <dape> q+
15:30:17 <JKRhb> ack J
15:30:25 <cris> ackc
15:30:27 <cris> ack c
15:30:36 <JKRhb> ... (tries to validate some TDs with different TD context URLs, noticing issues with the context validation)
15:31:06 <JKRhb> ... so I see we definitely have a problem here, we can follow up on that
15:32:10 <JKRhb> dp: So the changes the allOf and the contains seem to be required to apply the original fix
15:32:15 <dape> ack dape
15:32:22 <JKRhb> ek: Will deal with the issue after the call
15:32:54 <dape> q+
15:33:21 <JKRhb> ... generally need to apply contraints on contraints, it is difficult to model what we are specifying
15:33:28 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:33:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:33:35 <dape> ack dape
15:33:35 <JKRhb> subtopic: PR 2081
15:33:49 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2081 PR 2081 - Make contentType optional in ExpectedResponse and AdditionalExpectedResponse classes
15:33:51 <JKRhb> dp: I think last time you, Ege, raised the question whether content type should be optional in general
15:33:51 <EgeKorkan> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2081
15:34:09 <kaz> s|https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/2081||
15:34:10 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:34:12 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:34:26 <kaz> s/ackc//
15:34:52 <kaz> s/in general/in general or not/
15:34:54 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:34:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:36:15 <cris> q+
15:36:47 <JKRhb> ek: Should we be able to express that there is no content in a response in general? Since we are not able to express that lack at the moment
15:37:00 <JKRhb> ca: I am just wondering
15:37:16 <JKRhb> ... I am okay with this change, also briefly discussed that in the Scripting API call
15:37:34 <JKRhb> ... but we want to express in general that there is not output, for example in the case of an action
15:37:46 <JKRhb> ... e.g., a void return value in TypeScript
15:38:13 <JKRhb> ... I am okay moving forward with this, however, maybe we want to express no content being returned in a different way
15:38:32 <JKRhb> ... currently, there is no way to explicitly state that there is not going to be a content type
15:38:48 <JKRhb> ek: I think the current way is only to use a data schema or leave it
15:39:01 <JKRhb> ca: Could be a good way to handle this
15:39:26 <JKRhb> ek: But the solution should be clear then, so if there is no schema then content type should not be present
15:39:50 <JKRhb> ca: By the way, this is related to TD 2.0, right? We do not need to backport this, right?
15:39:59 <JKRhb> ek: Exactly
15:40:18 <JKRhb> ca: My point of view is that we need to review this, but we need to start somewhere, so go for it
15:40:35 <JKRhb> ek: (adds a summary comment to the PR)
15:40:48 <JKRhb> rrsagent, please draft the minutes
15:40:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html JKRhb
15:41:16 <JKRhb> ... what do others think? Any other remarks?
15:41:31 <JKRhb> ... Is everyone okay with removing content type from all levels?
15:41:48 <JKRhb> ... in general, data schema and content type need to be aligned
15:41:58 <JKRhb> ... although bindings can make them mandatory
15:42:09 <JKRhb> ... in specific cases
15:42:23 <EgeKorkan> q?
15:42:32 <cris> ack c
15:43:16 <kaz> q+
15:43:18 <JKRhb> ek: Let me know, Jan, if you need any assistance
15:43:39 <JKRhb> jr: Will try to update the PR until tomorrow, will ping you if I need feedback
15:44:04 <JKRhb> kaz: I am okay with the direction and the changes, but maybe we should test the feasibility in a mini kind of plugfest
15:44:22 <JKRhb> ... as there might be implications for existing implementations
15:44:43 <JKRhb> ek: Should probably bundle it with other changes, maybe 5-10 and then test them together
15:44:46 <kaz> s/implications/some impacts/
15:44:54 <JKRhb> subtopic: PR 414
15:45:17 <JKRhb> s/PR 414/Binding Templates PR 414/
15:45:20 <kaz> i/414/kaz: checking several changes at once is fine/
15:45:33 <kaz> i/checking/scribenick: kaz/
15:45:41 <JKRhb> ek: This PR deals with the aspect of implementation experience as a requirement for the registry
15:45:50 <kaz> i/This PR/scribenick: JKRhb/
15:46:05 <JKRhb> ca: I basically addressed the comments and a logical gap
15:46:25 <kaz> i|This PR|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/414 Binding PR 414 - Requiring implementation experience for bindings|
15:46:27 <JKRhb> ... I added a part regarding a test report to address your comment
15:46:32 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:46:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:46:39 <JKRhb> ek: That addresses it
15:46:39 <JKRhb> ... there is a typo
15:47:15 <JKRhb> ... (splits the current assertion into two sentences)
15:47:22 <JKRhb> ca: I think it is a good starting point
15:47:49 <JKRhb> ... maybe the text needs to be put into better shape, but it is a good basis for getting feedback from other groups as well
15:48:14 <JKRhb> ek: There was another assertion that we wanted to change, regarding processing
15:48:30 <JKRhb> ca: Wasn't sure whether we wanted to rework this requirement later
15:48:40 <JKRhb> ... but we can also change it now, as you wish
15:49:09 <JKRhb> ek: I think this should also deal with the aspect of explaining the work in a non-technical way
15:49:29 <JKRhb> ... (adds a suggestion to line in question within the PR)
15:49:36 <JKRhb> s/line/the line
15:49:42 <JKRhb> rrsagent, please draft the minutes
15:49:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html JKRhb
15:50:25 <JKRhb> ... that is more or less what the idea was
15:50:35 <JKRhb> ... so if it that is okay, then I would commit both of them
15:50:44 <JKRhb> ... then we can have a look at the new changes
15:50:56 <JKRhb> ... will also resolve the comments I had
15:51:56 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:51:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:52:04 <JKRhb> ... let's see whether the conflict is something simple
15:52:08 <JKRhb> ... seems like git is failing a bit
15:52:20 <JKRhb> ca: Probably some whitespacing that got it confues
15:52:29 <JKRhb> s/confues/confused
15:52:35 <JKRhb> ... also the discussion was removed
15:52:53 <JKRhb> ek: (resolves the merge conflict)
15:53:08 <JKRhb> ... alright, so now the discuss label has been removed, which is nice
15:53:41 <JKRhb> ... we now also have the requirement of testing experience, needing a consumer and a procuder, and that there needs to be a testing report
15:53:59 <JKRhb> ... that the submitter will make the transition but that it can also be made by the custodian
15:54:10 <JKRhb> ... if there is no additional feedback on this PR, then we can merge it
15:54:19 <EgeKorkan> q?
15:54:21 <JKRhb> ... I will squash and merge this PR
15:54:27 <kaz> q-
15:54:39 <JKRhb> ... no one is on the queue, then we can merge
15:54:44 <JKRhb> PR is merged
15:54:57 <JKRhb> subtopic: Binding Templates PR 419
15:55:17 <JKRhb> ek: This PR deals with adding named anchors to the registry requirements document
15:55:47 <JKRhb> ... adding almost human-readable IDs/words to be able to reference sections
15:56:03 <JKRhb> ... works with the traditional markdown way of referencing section
15:56:22 <JKRhb> ... also works with the rendered version, where the labels will be underlined
15:56:45 <JKRhb> ... it is also easy to add new links
15:57:12 <JKRhb> ... clicking on a link will bring you to the respective place in the document
15:57:31 <JKRhb> dp: It's great improvement, although of course there will be no check for dead links
15:57:57 <kaz> i|This PR deals with ad|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/419 Binding PR 419 - Unique Item Names|
15:57:58 <JKRhb> ek: There is a merge conflict, I will resolve it, then we can merge the PR
15:57:59 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:58:01 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:58:12 <JKRhb> topic: AOB
15:58:22 <JKRhb> ek: With that, we are almost out of time
15:58:30 <JKRhb> ... any other business?
15:58:50 <JKRhb> ca: Just wanted to mention that there are two issues that have been opened from the Scripting API call
15:58:59 <JKRhb> ek: I've seen them
15:59:10 <JKRhb> ... issue 2085 has also been bugging me as well
15:59:22 <JKRhb> ca: Maybe we can define a user story for that
15:59:42 <JKRhb> ek: Everything about consistency does not necessarily need a user story
15:59:59 <JKRhb> ... but it can't hurt, good to document the decision we will make it
16:00:03 <JKRhb> s/it/here/
16:00:05 <kaz> i|Just wanted|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/issues/2085 TD Issue 2085 - Add a schema for unobserve/observe property|
16:00:06 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:00:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
16:00:23 <JKRhb> [adjourned]
16:00:27 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:00:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/03/05-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
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