13:00:48 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #pmwg
13:00:52 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/02/13-pmwg-irc
13:00:52 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
13:00:53 <Zakim> Meeting: Publishing Maintenance Working Group
13:01:01 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: Meeting Details 2025-02-13: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pm-wg/2025Feb/0006.html
13:01:02 <ivan> Chair: shinya
13:01:02 <ivan> Meeting: Publishing Maintenance Working Group Telco
13:01:02 <ivan> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pm-wg/2025Feb/0006.html
13:24:48 <ivan> regrets+ wendy
13:25:10 <ivan> regrets+ george
13:48:06 <shiestyle> shiestyle has joined #pmwg
13:56:24 <ivan> present+
13:56:49 <ivan> m2gbot, help
13:56:49 <m2gbot> ivan, I am an IRC bot to link github issues and PRs to the minutes of the meetings where they were discussed.
13:56:49 <m2gbot> ... I am an instance of minutes_to_gh version 0.8.1.
13:56:50 <m2gbot> ... To know more, see https://github.com/pchampin/minutes_to_gh
13:57:32 <dhall5> dhall5 has joined #pmwg
13:58:17 <tzviya> present+
13:59:00 <ivan> present+ dhall5
13:59:08 <ivan> present+ dale
13:59:20 <shiestyle> present+
13:59:20 <ivan> present+ shinya
13:59:28 <ivan> present+ rickj
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13:59:47 <MasakazuKitahara> present+
13:59:49 <ivan> present+ mattg
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14:00:31 <rickj> present+
14:01:20 <ivan> present+ charles
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14:01:28 <ivan> present+ brady
14:01:32 <toshiakikoike> present+
14:01:35 <ivan> present+ avneesh
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14:02:11 <duga> present+
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14:03:04 <dhall5> present+
14:03:04 <tzviya> zakim, pick a victim
14:03:04 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose duga
14:03:08 <ivan> present+ hadrien
14:03:21 <duga> scribe+
14:03:36 <shiestyle> Topic: Overview of the plan for the next few weeks
14:03:45 <ivan> q+
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14:03:54 <Hadrien> present+
14:04:05 <ivan> present+ ikkwong
14:04:07 <AvneeshSingh> present+
14:04:13 <duga> shiestyle: The ew charter is in
14:04:32 <duga> ivan: And we as the leads did some planning the other day
14:04:54 <duga> ... we know the big things in the charter we need to do (annotations and webtoons)
14:05:02 <duga> ... we will discuss those are the f2f
14:05:26 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:05:27 <duga> ... so for the calls until then we will discuss the smaller items in the charter
14:06:27 <duga> ... For instance, we had some long discussions about WebAssembly and whether we could add it to the spec before, we put some of that off
14:06:50 <duga> ... so those discussions will keep us busy for now
14:07:06 <duga> ... We also did some work on the spec structure to prepare
14:08:06 <duga> ... There will be a new release of 3.3 in March [scribe note: I missed what the changes are, sounds editorial]
14:08:26 <duga> ... Then we will set up a new 3.4 area of the repo, that will be for new work
14:08:49 <duga> ... Also chairs call has changed to Wednesday to match the new group meeting
14:09:00 <mgarrish> present+
14:09:20 <Dale> present+
14:09:21 <duga> shiestyle: One more thing - the membership was renewed
14:09:30 <duga> ... So everyone needs to rejoin
14:09:47 <shiestyle> q?
14:10:32 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/groups/wg/pm/join
14:10:35 <CharlesL> present+
14:11:20 <ivan> present+ susan
14:11:27 <AvneeshSingh> Does it mean I need to remove everyone in DAISY and join everyone again?
14:11:54 <duga> q+
14:12:10 <ivan> q+
14:12:17 <shiestyle> ack duga
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14:12:43 <SueNeu> present+
14:12:50 <dhall5> q+
14:13:01 <duga> AvneeshSingh: We already seems to be members
14:13:17 <duga> ivan: Yes, DAISY is, but all the individual people need to rejoin
14:13:32 <duga> duga: I didn't have a join button
14:13:47 <duga> ivan: Expected, the process is different for IE
14:13:54 <shiestyle> q?
14:13:59 <duga> ... Everything this is working as expected
14:14:00 <ivan> ack ivan
14:14:00 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:14:11 <shiestyle> ack dhall
14:14:20 <shiestyle> q?
14:14:25 <duga> dhall5: My AC rep is pinged, I am also dragging in a coworker
14:14:36 <shiestyle> Topic: WebAssembly discussion
14:15:15 <duga> mgarrish: The question was do we allow webassembly?
14:15:41 <duga> ... it isn't explicitly referenced from the script tag
14:16:13 <ivan> q+
14:16:16 <duga> ... we had a discussion around it, I think all we need to do is add a comment that it is ok
14:16:38 <duga> ... We could add it to the script tag, or just exempt that tag entirely
14:16:59 <duga> ... Main question is do we want add something to reading systems?
14:17:25 <duga> ... It will work if they support the API, so not sure what we would need to add
14:17:29 <duga> q+
14:17:35 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:18:08 <duga> ivan: I think there are no problems, but there was a question around security
14:18:15 <Hadrien> q+
14:18:45 <duga> ... My feeling is it is scripting, and so no, but maybe we should point at the security section
14:19:05 <duga> mgarrish: I am not sure what else there is outside of JS
14:19:23 <shiestyle> ack duga
14:19:24 <duga> ... we should ask our security person
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14:19:38 <gpellegrino> present+
14:20:58 <duga> duga: Do we want to explicitly call out webassembly, or just make it vague?
14:22:21 <shiestyle> ack Hadrien
14:22:22 <duga> mgarrish: I think we can leave it vague, and use webasssembly as an example
14:22:45 <duga> Hadrien: When it comes to webassembly it opens some doors
14:22:56 <duga> ... but our scripting has always been spotty
14:23:04 <duga> ... so this pushes the issue further
14:23:52 <shiestyle> q+
14:23:59 <duga> ... the more things like this we add, the more of a balance there is with reading systems. Just something to keep in mind
14:23:59 <ivan> s/WebAssembly discussion/https:\/\/github.com\/w3c\/epub-specs\/issues\/2649/
14:24:19 <duga> shiestyle: Can the reading system distinguish between JS and webassembly?
14:24:49 <duga> mgarrish: Short of inspecting the file, no, but doesn't need to
14:24:58 <duga> q+
14:25:03 <shiestyle> ack me
14:25:04 <ivan> ack shiestyle
14:25:05 <duga> ... we would have to flag it
14:25:15 <shiestyle> ack duga
14:26:52 <shiestyle> q?
14:26:59 <ivan> q+
14:27:04 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:27:05 <duga> duga: No, there isn't really a way of detecting it, but it doesn't really matter
14:27:16 <duga> ivan: What is the next step
14:27:57 <duga> mgarrish: I think we just need to change the exemption text a little
14:28:07 <duga> ... real question is the script tag itself
14:28:30 <duga> shiestyle: I will ask Voyager for their opinion
14:29:06 <duga> shiestyle + toshiakikoike: Discussion in Japanese
14:30:34 <duga> MasakazuKitahara: adds to discussion in Japanese
14:31:11 <ivan> q+
14:31:15 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:31:22 <duga> shiestyle: The feeling is there is a risk, and they are not seeing any need for it in Japan
14:31:31 <duga> ivan: I am curious what the risk is
14:31:49 <duga> ... The only thing is adding some speed, so it is not clear what the risk is
14:31:50 <mgarrish> q+
14:32:40 <duga> shiestyle: Well, the security risk. We already have JS, so maybe there is a little more risk?
14:32:54 <duga> ivan: Yes, but we can't block JS, it is already allowed
14:33:08 <duga> ... so my feeling the only thing this brings is performance
14:33:09 <shiestyle> ack mgarish
14:33:26 <shiestyle> ack mgarrish
14:33:42 <duga> mgarrish: We aren't forcing support, so it is fine to block from a RS perspective.
14:33:53 <duga> ... It would be very hard to ban this
14:34:05 <duga> ... it is already going through via an exemption
14:34:25 <duga> q+
14:34:31 <shiestyle> ack duga
14:34:58 <SueNeu> SueNeu has joined #pmwg
14:35:10 <SueNeu> present+
14:35:35 <duga> shiestyle: relaying conversation in Japanese
14:35:59 <duga> toshiakikoike: continues in Japanese
14:37:04 <duga> shiestyle: toshiakikoike says JS is allowed, so webassembly can be allowed, so they understand
14:37:17 <shiestyle> q?
14:37:54 <duga> ... so they understand, this is just their feeling
14:38:12 <shiestyle> Topic: Accessibility work to be done in this charter
14:38:18 <duga> duga: And I also would add this is already supported per the spec
14:38:30 <duga> shiestyle: Moving on
14:38:47 <duga> ... we have to discuss what the a11y work will be
14:38:52 <AvneeshSingh> q+
14:39:10 <shiestyle> ack AvneeshSingh
14:39:22 <duga> AvneeshSingh: The broad things are in the charter, there are also new things we are finding as we do the work in the TF
14:39:35 <duga> ... those things need to be discussed in the wg
14:39:48 <duga> ... and there are some clarifications we will need to provide
14:40:10 <duga> ... The question we have is whay wcag 2.0 - why not 2.1 or 2.2?
14:40:28 <duga> ... We also need to discuss escapeability in Media overlays
14:40:46 <duga> ... We will also need to consider the new work in annotations
14:41:14 <duga> ... EAA is coming soon, so we may have feedback there
14:41:26 <shiestyle> q+
14:41:28 <duga> ... So this is the broad direction
14:41:32 <shiestyle> ack me
14:42:08 <CharlesL> q+
14:42:20 <duga> shiestyle: The coformance version of wcag is a big change
14:42:46 <shiestyle> ack CharlesL
14:42:55 <ivan> q+
14:43:01 <duga> AvneeshSingh: We will probably need to update for changes, not clear if it will be 1.1, or 1.1.2 or 1.2
14:43:14 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:43:17 <duga> CharlesL: There is also webtoons and fixed layout that may impact a11y
14:43:30 <duga> ivan: I was wondering about that as well.
14:43:50 <mgarrish> q+
14:43:51 <duga> ... We have the note on FL a11y, I was wondering if there was something from there that could be used
14:44:30 <duga> CharlesL: Yes, we are working towards using that information, and we are currently working on techniques for using that
14:44:48 <duga> ... There could be implications as we go through each item
14:44:54 <ivan> q+
14:45:19 <duga> ... and as a side note, Amazon publishing has just sent someone to that task force
14:46:01 <shiestyle> ack mgarrish
14:46:05 <Hadrien> q+
14:46:14 <duga> ... There may by issues with wcag aa, may just be single a
14:46:36 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:46:39 <duga> mgarrish: There is also some property that will cause a change to the main spec
14:46:46 <ivan> q+
14:46:48 <shiestyle> ack Hadrien
14:47:15 <duga> Hadrien: Thorium web is coming
14:47:39 <duga> ... One item we have is a "readability mode" which will be for fixed layout as well
14:48:03 <duga> ... we extract the structure and text, and provide that as another view
14:48:17 <duga> ... with full control (text size, etc)
14:48:33 <duga> ... This could be of interest to lots of people.
14:48:49 <shiestyle> ack ivan
14:48:54 <duga> ... We view the feature as experimental, but it may be a good basis for a11y designs
14:49:22 <duga> ivan: Admin comment - a11y was done by a TF with separate meeting times
14:49:31 <duga> ... is that how it will work going forward?
14:50:00 <duga> AvneeshSingh: CG work needs to continue, we can't move that to all to WG
14:50:33 <duga> ... The meetings are a good way to keep things going
14:50:57 <duga> ... We will try to meet twice a month, and see how it is working out
14:51:05 <ivan> Topic: admin
14:51:30 <duga> shiestyle: For the next call, we will cancel it, so the time is available if any TF wants to meet
14:51:41 <duga> ... does any TF want to meet?
14:52:01 <duga> AvneeshSingh: We don't need the time
14:52:04 <duga> q+
14:52:08 <shiestyle> ack duga
14:52:54 <duga> duga: Do we even have taskforces yet?
14:53:04 <duga> ivan: Not really, there is still work to do
14:54:12 <duga> ivan: we need names of people, etc. So we need that from say shiestyle and Hadrien
14:54:26 <duga> Hadrien: We have some ideas, do you want an early list
14:54:39 <duga> ivan: Give me a first list ASAP
14:54:40 <shiestyle> Topic: AOB
14:56:34 <duga> duga: How many people will attend f2f in person?
14:56:44 <duga> ivan: Lots and lots!
14:57:01 <duga> shiestyle: Next week is canceled
14:57:13 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:57:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/02/13-pmwg-minutes.html ivan
14:58:58 <ivan> s|https:\/\/github.com\/w3c\/epub-specs\/issues\/2649|https://github.com/w3c/epub-specs/issues/2649|
14:59:07 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:59:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/02/13-pmwg-minutes.html ivan
14:59:43 <ivan> s/Topic:admin/Topic: Task Force admin/
15:00:10 <ivan> m2gbot, help
15:00:10 <m2gbot> ivan, I am an IRC bot to link github issues and PRs to the minutes of the meetings where they were discussed.
15:00:10 <m2gbot> ... I am an instance of minutes_to_gh version 0.8.1.
15:00:11 <m2gbot> ... To know more, see https://github.com/pchampin/minutes_to_gh
15:00:37 <ivan> m2gbot, link with transcript
15:00:37 <m2gbot> sorry ivan, I don't understand "link with transcript"
15:00:51 <ivan> m2gbot, link issues with transcript
15:00:51 <m2gbot> Something wrong happened: Failed loading JSON from https://raw.githubusercontent.com/w3c/groups/refs/heads/main/wg/pmwg/repositories.json
15:04:24 <CharlesL> CharlesL has left #pmwg
15:18:12 <ivan> rrsagent, bye
15:18:12 <RRSAgent> I see no action items