14:57:36 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #lws
14:57:40 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-irc
14:57:44 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #lws
14:58:00 <laurens> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/a19ab7dc-1753-433d-bac5-64e3ad8c0a43/20250127T100000/
14:58:01 <agendabot> clear agenda
14:58:01 <agendabot> agenda+ Introductions and announcements
14:58:01 <agendabot> agenda+ Pending -> action items https://github.com/w3c/lws-protocol/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3Aaction
14:58:01 <agendabot> agenda+ Use cases update
14:58:02 <agendabot> agenda+ Consensus on shared context -> issues https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues
14:58:46 <acoburn> zakim, start meeting
14:58:46 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:58:48 <laurens> topic: Linked Web Storage WG -- 2025-01-27
14:58:48 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), acoburn
14:58:52 <eBremer> eBremer has joined #lws
14:58:55 <acoburn> meeting: Linked Web Storage
14:58:59 <pchampin> present+
14:59:09 <acoburn> present+
14:59:24 <laurens> present+
15:00:10 <eBremer> present+
15:01:40 <AZ> present+
15:02:04 <kaefer3000> kaefer3000 has joined #lws
15:02:08 <bendm> bendm has joined #lws
15:02:30 <hadrian> hadrian has joined #lws
15:02:49 <csarven> present+
15:03:02 <acoburn> -> https://github.com/w3c/lws-protocol/wiki/Scribe-list Scribe list
15:03:38 <acoburn> chair: laurens
15:04:06 <eBremer> scribe+
15:04:26 <thelounge> thelounge has joined #lws
15:04:38 <thelounge> present+
15:04:39 <TallTed> present+
15:04:40 <hadrian> present+
15:04:42 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
15:04:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html TallTed
15:04:50 <bendm> present+
15:05:03 <AZ> laurens: any annoucement?
15:05:16 <ryey> ryey has joined #lws
15:05:23 <ryey> present+
15:05:24 <AZ> pchampin: W3C is organising a breakout day in March
15:05:45 <AZ> ... halfway between 2 TPACs
15:05:53 <AZ> ... we could organise a session of LWS
15:05:55 <TallTed> previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2025/01/20-lws-minutes.html
15:05:55 <TallTed> next meeting: https://www.w3.org/2025/02/03-lws-minutes.html
15:05:56 <pchampin> https://github.com/w3c/breakouts-day-2025/
15:06:25 <AZ> ... it is not an obligation
15:06:55 <AZ> scribe+
15:07:01 <pchampin> scribe: AZ
15:07:29 <eBremer> scribe-
15:07:43 <laurens> q?
15:07:59 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html TallTed
15:08:14 <balessan> balessan has joined #lws
15:08:14 <TallTed> Zakim, open next item
15:08:14 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Introductions and announcements -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:08:18 <AZ> laurens: there are 2 action items
15:08:26 <TallTed> Zakim, close item 1
15:08:26 <Zakim> agendum 1, Introductions and announcements, closed
15:08:27 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:08:27 <Zakim> 2. Pending -> action items https://github.com/w3c/lws-protocol/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3Aaction [from agendabot]
15:08:35 <AZ> ... assigned to Hadrian
15:08:38 <TallTed> zakim, open next item
15:08:38 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Pending -> action items https://github.com/w3c/lws-protocol/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3Aaction -- taken up [from agendabot]
15:08:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html TallTed
15:08:55 <AZ> hadrian: the labels are done
15:09:09 <uvdsl> uvdsl has joined #lws
15:09:49 <AZ> ... the one that needs discussion today is basic storage 117
15:10:09 <kaefer3000> see https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/117
15:10:10 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/117 -> Issue 117 Basic Storage Context (by hzbarcea) [needs-discussion]
15:11:05 <AZ> ... the "needs discussion" must be curated continuously until we have list of requirements
15:11:05 <csarven> q+
15:11:11 <uvdsl> present+
15:11:31 <laurens> Zakim, open next item
15:11:31 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, laurens
15:11:37 <laurens> q?
15:11:46 <AZ> hadrian: I went through issues and started getting requirements
15:12:07 <AZ> ... many UCs have a context assumed
15:13:07 <AZ> ... for every issue raised, things related to the context should not be discussed in the issue
15:13:16 <AZ> ... the discussion should be more focused
15:13:27 <AZ> ... I'm now working on a second batch
15:13:52 <AZ> ... there's something related to local storage
15:13:56 <kaefer3000> q+
15:14:29 <AZ> ... there are things about query engines, about processing
15:14:46 <laurens> q?
15:14:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html TallTed
15:14:57 <laurens> ack csarven
15:15:13 <AZ> csarven: I'd like to understand the Basic Storage Context
15:15:40 <AZ> ... some of them are new UCs and some of them are new, relative to issue 117
15:16:19 <AZ> ... not sure if these (which one?) are strong UCs as UCs
15:16:21 <csarven> Anyhting of significane should have a URI: https://www.w3.org/DesignIssues/Axioms.html#Universality2
15:16:55 <AZ> ... if you give everything of significance a URI
15:17:23 <AZ> ... this is more something of a requirement
15:17:38 <laurens> q?
15:17:40 <AZ> ... I'm a bit confused about what we do with basic storage
15:18:25 <AZ> ... can you elaborate more Hadrian?
15:18:45 <AZ> hadrian: you say that these UCs are more like requirements
15:18:56 <AZ> ... true, I'll gather requirements from these UCs
15:19:17 <AZ> ... I'll distill these UCs into finer grained ICs
15:19:23 <AZ> s/ICs/UCs
15:20:09 <AZ> ... I'll take all these things into one basic storage context (?)
15:20:18 <ericP> ericP has joined #lws
15:20:58 <AZ> csarven: if the intention is to have the context be related to requirements, don't use the UC template
15:21:08 <uvdsl> +1 to sarven's point
15:21:22 <AZ> hadrian: I understand your point
15:21:25 <laurens> q+
15:21:52 <laurens> q?
15:22:07 <AZ> ... at smoe point we talked about identity of storage end users (?)
15:22:18 <laurens> q?
15:22:21 <laurens> ack kaefer
15:22:42 <AZ> kaefer3000: don't call requirements UCs
15:23:08 <AZ> ... it's important that they are linked back to chich UC they come
15:23:30 <AZ> hadrian: we did not discuss yet how we capture requirements
15:24:28 <AZ> laurens: there is an action to be done, that is to have a template for requirements, or context
15:24:35 <pchampin> "proto-requirement"?
15:24:36 <ericP> +1
15:24:37 <AZ> hadrian: I support that
15:24:42 <laurens> ACTION: hadrian to define a requirements template for the lws-ucs repository
15:24:50 <gb> Created -> action #13 https://github.com/w3c/lws-protocol/issues/13
15:24:51 <ericP> present+ ericP
15:25:09 <AZ> hadrian: the requirements should be linked to the UCs
15:25:27 <AZ> ... should then the UC issue closed?
15:25:27 <laurens> q?
15:25:30 <laurens> ack laurens
15:25:36 <AZ> laurens: it's how I understand it yes
15:26:14 <laurens> q?
15:26:33 <AZ> hadrian: the problematic UCs should be phrased as requirements not user stories
15:27:12 <AZ> laurens: is there anything to add on this topic
15:27:31 <AZ> laurens: AOB?
15:27:46 <laurens> topic: Basic storage context (https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/117)
15:27:47 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/117 -> Issue 117 Basic Storage Context (by hzbarcea) [needs-discussion]
15:28:20 <ericP> q+
15:28:37 <AZ> hadrian: we can discuss the issue on basic storage context
15:28:57 <laurens> ack ericP
15:29:05 <AZ> ericP: need clarification
15:29:35 <AZ> ... do we split the UCs into ???
15:30:13 <AZ> laurens: iti s best to have this kind of discussion asynchronously
15:31:24 <laurens> https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/110
15:31:25 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/110 -> Issue 110 [UC] Ability to split or aggregate storages (by hzbarcea) [usecase] [review]
15:31:34 <AZ> ericP: the question was about whether to splitting pods
15:32:23 <AZ> laurens: if you haven't additional issues to discuss now, we can continue asynchronously
15:32:34 <AZ> laurens: maybe one issue of interest is 108
15:32:59 <AZ> https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/108
15:33:00 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/lws-ucs/issues/108 -> Issue 108 [UC] Uniquely identify storage globally (by hzbarcea) [usecase] [uc-identity] [review]
15:33:27 <AZ> laurens: I'm looking for solutiosn to this
15:33:53 <AZ> hadrian: you can have part of URL that is globally unique
15:34:31 <AZ> laurens: we don't need to discuss solutions yet but talk in terms of requirements
15:34:34 <laurens> q?
15:34:49 <csarven> q+
15:35:11 <AZ> laurens: will leave comments to github issues
15:35:13 <laurens> ack csarven
15:36:14 <laurens> q+
15:36:17 <AZ> csarven: if I look at issue 112 for instance, with linked data glasses, I don't se an issue to meet the use case
15:36:51 <AZ> ... but different people will see them in different ways
15:37:21 <AZ> hadrian: in this issue, this is about being able to move to a different storage provider
15:37:28 <laurens> q?
15:37:28 <uvdsl> q+
15:38:00 <AZ> laurens: what you said csarven is related to acceptance requirements
15:38:01 <laurens> ack laurens
15:38:07 <laurens> ack uvdsl
15:38:28 <AZ> uvdsl: could hadrian add explanation to the issues
15:38:55 <AZ> ... maybe just a few bullet points so we can understand better
15:39:06 <csarven> s/meet the use case/meet the use case. UC's Acceptance Criteria would help to determine what might be needed on an atomic level. So, e.g., moving from one provider to another and what that might entail.
15:39:15 <laurens> q?
15:39:43 <AZ> laurens: we can help in clarifying the issues
15:40:25 <AZ> hadrian: commenting on the issues help in clarifying the UC or issue
15:40:40 <AZ> ... so please respond to the Github issues
15:40:59 <laurens> topic: Identity & WebID
15:41:11 <AZ> hadrian: what do we do about WebID in this group?
15:41:28 <AZ> ... this is a key decision to be made
15:41:51 <AZ> laurens: this requires more elaborate discussion than we can have today
15:42:02 <AZ> ... but we can talk about it a bit
15:42:08 <AZ> ... it relates to the requirements
15:42:08 <pchampin> q+
15:42:20 <laurens> q?
15:42:25 <laurens> ack pchampin
15:42:30 <AZ> ... what's the group member's opinion about WebID?
15:42:52 <AZ> pchampin: previously DID specified the DID document
15:43:06 <AZ> ... that has an intersection with WebID
15:43:09 <balessan> +1
15:43:12 <laurens> https://www.w3.org/TR/controller-document/
15:43:23 <AZ> ... we need to explore this in liaison with DID WG
15:43:41 <AZ> ... some part of DID work was moved to VC WG
15:44:13 <csarven> q+
15:44:28 <AZ> ... I agree that this is something that will need further discussion and clearer discussion once requirements are in
15:44:32 <laurens> q?
15:44:36 <laurens> ack csarven
15:45:06 <AZ> csarven: we had a discussion in December about scope
15:45:18 <AZ> ... to know what's acceptable to take on or update
15:45:32 <AZ> ... say we need authorisation
15:45:37 <hadrian> +1 pchampain, i wasn't aware of it, very helpful, I agree with the path you suggest
15:45:41 <AZ> ... as a feature
15:46:08 <AZ> ... whether a solution must depend on a spec, we don't necessarily need to have a spec covering all of it
15:47:06 <AZ> ... e.g. WebID does not have to cover all aspects, all UCs
15:47:23 <laurens> q+
15:47:40 <acoburn> q+
15:47:57 <laurens> ack laurens
15:48:17 <AZ> ... we have too many UCs to address that cannot be covered entirely with existing spec
15:49:07 <laurens> ack acoburn
15:49:31 <AZ> acoburn: there is no way that we will have a single spec that covers all the UCs
15:49:42 <AZ> ... we have to prioritise the requirements
15:49:51 <AZ> ... then we can look for solutions
15:49:56 <laurens> +1
15:50:11 <laurens> q?
15:50:20 <AZ> ... at the moment, discussing the merits of solution A vs solution B is not very productive
15:50:53 <AZ> laurens: no other business, then we can ajourn
15:50:56 <acoburn> rrsagent, make minutes
15:50:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html acoburn
15:51:44 <pchampin> scribenick: AZ
15:51:49 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
15:51:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html pchampin
15:52:25 <acoburn> acoburn has left #lws
15:52:52 <pchampin> i!laurens: any annoucement!scribe+ AZ
15:52:55 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
15:52:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html pchampin
15:54:21 <pchampin> s/i!laurens: any annoucement!scribe+ AZ/
15:54:31 <pchampin> i/laurens: any annoucement/scribe+ AZ
15:54:35 <pchampin> RRSAgent, make minutes
15:54:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-minutes.html pchampin
15:56:05 <pchampin> RRSAgent, bye
15:56:05 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-actions.rdf :
15:56:05 <RRSAgent> ACTION: hadrian to define a requirements template for the lws-ucs repository [1]
15:56:05 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2025/01/27-lws-irc#T15-24-42