14:01:04 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #matf
14:01:08 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-irc
14:01:08 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:01:09 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), JJ
14:01:13 <Illai> Illai has joined #matf
14:01:13 <JJ> Zakim, this is MATF 13 November 2024
14:01:13 <Zakim> got it, JJ
14:01:19 <JJ> Meeting: MATF 13 November 2024
14:01:22 <Aash> Aash has joined #matf
14:01:24 <JJ> present+
14:01:40 <Illai> present+
14:01:55 <Joe_Humbert> present+
14:02:50 <JJ> agenda+ Guidance naming
14:02:54 <JJ> agenda+ 3.3.2 Labels or Instructions
14:03:00 <JJ> agenda+ 1.3.4 Orientation
14:03:00 <GleidsonRamos> GleidsonRamos has joined #matf
14:03:05 <JJ> agenda+ 1.4.13 Content on Hover or Focus
14:03:10 <JJ> agenda+ 2.1.4 Character Key Shortcuts
14:03:14 <JJ> agenda+ 2.4.4 Link Purpose (In Context)
14:03:18 <JJ> agenda+ 2.4.6 Headings and Labels
14:03:21 <Karla> Karla has joined #matf
14:03:40 <Tim> Tim has joined #matf
14:04:04 <Aash> present+
14:04:05 <Karla> present+
14:08:53 <JJ> https://github.com/w3c/matf/wiki
14:08:58 <JJ> https://github.com/w3c/matf/wiki/IRC-Cheatsheet
14:09:51 <JJ> JJ has joined #matf
14:10:00 <JJ> q+ Your question to ask
14:10:07 <JJ> q+ to Ask about Intro
14:10:18 <JJ> ack JJ
14:10:18 <Zakim> JJ, you wanted to Ask about Intro
14:10:59 <Tim> present+
14:11:16 <JJ> Zakim, nominate a scribe
14:11:16 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Illai
14:12:10 <JJ> scribe+ Aash
14:12:10 <JJ> scribe: Aash
14:12:15 <JJ> move to next agendum
14:12:15 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Guidance naming -- taken up [from JJ]
14:14:13 <Aash> There are multiple suggestion on github. Mobile is not preffered.
14:14:28 <Aash> *the term mobile in the guidance name is not preffered
14:16:32 <Aash> because it includes and not limited to native mobile apps, mobile web apps, mobile web content, and hybrid apps using web components inside native mobile apps.
14:17:31 <Illai> +q
14:17:44 <JJ> ack Illai
14:17:44 <Joe_Humbert> +1 for now, though I feel others like Patrick will push back
14:18:07 <JJ> Do we agree to use the title "Guidance on Applying WCAG 2.2 to Mobile (WCAG2Mobile)" for our draft, keeping the option open to change the term "Mobile" in a future stage?
14:19:25 <Aash> +1 to JJ
14:19:42 <Aash> Guidance on Applying WCAG 2.2 to Mobile (WCAG2Mobile) can be used as a working title
14:19:52 <Aash> later we can drop the term "mobile"
14:19:56 <Illai> +1
14:20:03 <Karla> I prefer WCAG22Mobile
14:20:48 <Tim> +1 to Guidance on Applying WCAG 2.2 to Mobile (WCAG2Mobile)
14:20:48 <Aash> Karla should it not be WCAG22-2-Mobile?
14:22:23 <Karla> Yes, Guidance on Applying WCAG 2.2 to Mobile
14:23:05 <Illai> q+
14:23:07 <JJ> move to next agendum
14:23:07 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, JJ
14:23:16 <JJ> ack Illai
14:23:17 <JJ> move to next agendum
14:23:17 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- 3.3.2 Labels or Instructions -- taken up [from JJ]
14:23:18 <Joe_Humbert> q+
14:24:27 <Aash> Illai Are we refering to the entire component or the spinner alone for this SC?
14:24:52 <JJ> ack Joe_Humbert
14:25:02 <Aash> JJ Google and Apple need to make more efforts to make the native components accessibile
14:26:10 <Aash> Joe_Humbert the example looks like just a pop-up and that should be fine. However, the spinner is overlaid on calendar, which could be a problem for some users.
14:26:55 <Illai> +1 JJ
14:27:01 <Karla> +1 JJ
14:27:22 <Aash> JJ this needs to be updated by Apple
14:27:47 <JJ> Do we agree to keep the original proposal text for 3.3.2 by Julian?
14:27:49 <Karla> Karla has joined #matf
14:27:55 <Illai> +1
14:27:59 <Joe_Humbert> +1
14:28:22 <Aash> +1
14:28:22 <Karla> present+
14:28:22 <Karla> +1
14:28:24 <Tim> +1
14:28:59 <Aash> q+
14:29:10 <Joe_Humbert> q+
14:30:50 <Aash> Aash did not understand the 4 orientations concepts?
14:32:20 <Aash> q-
14:32:25 <Illai> +q
14:32:27 <Joe_Humbert> Joe_Humbert has joined #matf
14:32:32 <Aash> @jj
14:32:59 <JJ> JJ has joined #matf
14:33:00 <JJ> q?
14:33:03 <Illai> +q
14:33:05 <JJ> ack Joe_Humbert
14:33:42 <Aash> Joe_Humbert No more work needed to support all 4 orientations. It is same rendering in terms of pixels
14:34:49 <JJ> ack Illai
14:35:07 <Aash> JJ it is a best practice to support all 4 orientations.
14:36:03 <Aash> Illai should we propose this in conjunction with target size SC?
14:37:09 <JJ> Should we add a note to 1.3.4 about the best-practice of supporting all 4 (or more) orientations of a device?
14:37:09 <Aash> JJ we can add 4 orientation in notes, along with the target size SC, basic and advanced.
14:37:15 <Illai> +1
14:37:17 <Aash> +1
14:37:20 <Karla> +1
14:37:23 <GleidsonRamos> +1
14:37:27 <Tim> +1
14:37:55 <JJ> move to next agendum
14:37:55 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- 1.3.4 Orientation -- taken up [from JJ]
14:39:10 <Aash> move to next agendum
14:39:10 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- 1.4.13 Content on Hover or Focus -- taken up [from JJ]
14:39:42 <Illai> +q
14:41:03 <Illai> -Q
14:41:10 <Illai> -q
14:41:48 <Aash> JJ it would be interesting to see what happens to hover interaction if you use mobile devices with mouse
14:42:41 <Aash> q+
14:42:55 <JJ> ack Aash
14:44:31 <Aash> Aash considering the stats, we should focus more on focus on taps and deprioritise the mouse based Interactions
14:44:48 <JJ> Move 1.4.13 to medium variation because it needs more research?
14:44:53 <Aash> +1
14:44:56 <Karla> +1
14:44:56 <Tim> +1
14:45:02 <Joe_Humbert> +1
14:45:06 <Illai> I would say move it to large variation
14:45:16 <Aash> JJ the scope is likely to increase when we replace keyboard with assistive tech
14:45:29 <JJ> Move 1.4.13 to large variation because it needs more research?
14:45:36 <Illai> +1
14:45:51 <GleidsonRamos> +!
14:45:53 <GleidsonRamos> +1
14:46:12 <Aash> q+
14:46:17 <JJ> ack Aash
14:46:33 <JJ> ACTION: Add a note to 1.3.4 about the best-practice of supporting all 4 (or more) orientations of a device
14:46:51 <JJ> ACTION: Move 1.4.13 to medium variation
14:46:58 <Illai> But we are adding 3D touch for example
14:47:11 <Aash> Aash traditionally the mobile apps are not designed for Hover. so the medium variation should be ok
14:47:22 <JJ> ACTION: Keep "Mobile" definition as is, keep option open to change it in the future
14:48:18 <Aash> Illai we are not considering hover, but we are considering long taps and 3D touches, so the impact would be large
14:48:51 <JJ> move to next agendum
14:48:51 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- 2.1.4 Character Key Shortcuts -- taken up [from JJ]
14:49:37 <Aash> q+
14:50:34 <Aash> q-
14:53:56 <Illai> q+
14:54:06 <JJ> ack Illai
14:54:10 <Joe_Humbert> q+
14:55:14 <Aash> Illai the keyboard shortcuts is mostly related to ipads. In a prev meeting, Watch OS came up. so are we trying to cover all operating systems? Where are we going to stop?
14:55:35 <Aash> Illai by supporting more operating systems we are getting deeper into this
14:56:23 <Aash> JJ our main focus is phones and tablets
14:57:30 <JJ> ACTION: In draft, mention current scope of our work (Android, iOS, iPadOS on phones and tablets)
14:57:37 <JJ> ack Joe_Humbert
14:58:04 <Aash> Joe_Humbert we need to keep the first note. A lot of long press options exist on both OS. It is an OS gestures.
14:58:43 <JJ> Keep 2.1.4 as is, making sure to include Note 1 exception?
14:58:49 <Aash> +1
14:58:49 <Joe_Humbert> +1
14:58:51 <Illai> +1
14:58:53 <Karla> +1
14:58:54 <Tim> +1
14:59:01 <GleidsonRamos> +1
14:59:07 <JJ> ACTION: Keep 2.1.4 as is, making sure to include Note 1 exception
15:00:25 <Aash> JJ We are planning to release draft in December
15:00:35 <JJ> https://matf.to/slack to join Slack
15:01:22 <JJ> Zakim, list participants
15:01:22 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been JJ, Illai, Joe_Humbert, Aash, Karla, Tim, !
15:01:30 <JJ> present- !
15:01:44 <JJ> present+ GleidsonRamos
15:01:52 <JJ> Zakim, list participants
15:01:52 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been JJ, Illai, Joe_Humbert, Aash, Karla, Tim, !, GleidsonRamos
15:02:33 <JJ> rrsagent, make minutes
15:02:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-minutes.html JJ
15:02:52 <JJ> regrets+ JeroenHulscher
15:02:58 <JJ> regrets+ JamieHerrera
15:03:04 <JJ> regrets+ JulianK
15:03:20 <JJ> rrsagent, make minutes
15:03:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-minutes.html JJ
15:03:42 <Aash> Aash has left #matf
15:06:46 <JJ> chair: JJ
15:06:49 <JJ> rrsagent, make minutes
15:06:50 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-minutes.html JJ
15:07:38 <JJ> rrsagent, bye
15:07:38 <RRSAgent> I see 5 open action items saved in https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-actions.rdf :
15:07:38 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Add a note to 1.3.4 about the best-practice of supporting all 4 (or more) orientations of a device [1]
15:07:38 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-irc#T14-46-33
15:07:38 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Move 1.4.13 to medium variation [2]
15:07:38 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-irc#T14-46-51
15:07:38 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Keep "Mobile" definition as is, keep option open to change it in the future [3]
15:07:38 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-irc#T14-47-22
15:07:38 <RRSAgent> ACTION: In draft, mention current scope of our work (Android, iOS, iPadOS on phones and tablets) [4]
15:07:38 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-irc#T14-57-30
15:07:38 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Keep 2.1.4 as is, making sure to include Note 1 exception [5]
15:07:38 <RRSAgent>   recorded in https://www.w3.org/2024/11/13-matf-irc#T14-59-07