14:56:30 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #maturity
14:56:35 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-maturity-irc
14:56:35 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:56:36 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Fazio
14:56:55 <Fazio> meeting: Maturity Model Task Force
14:58:08 <Fazio> chair: David Fazio
14:59:45 <CharlesL> CharlesL has joined #maturity
14:59:58 <CharlesL> present+
15:00:06 <Fazio> Agenda+ New Business
15:00:06 <Fazio> Agenda+ Use Cases Update
15:00:06 <Fazio> Agenda+ Scoring Spreadsheet Instructions Follow Up
15:00:06 <Fazio> Agenda+ Github Issue #148 Add information fields for metadata for each dimension
15:00:07 <gb> /issues/148 -> #148
15:00:07 <Fazio> Agenda+ Github Issue #157 Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process.
15:00:07 <Fazio> Agenda+ Github Issue #226 Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics
15:00:07 <Fazio> Agenda+Github Issue #137 Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model.
15:00:07 <gb> /issues/157 -> #157
15:00:07 <gb> /issues/226 -> #226
15:00:07 <gb> /issues/137 -> #137
15:00:20 <Fazio> present+
15:01:52 <jkline> jkline has joined #maturity
15:02:00 <jkline> present+
15:04:07 <stacey> stacey has joined #Maturity
15:04:18 <stacey> present+
15:07:33 <janina> janina has joined #maturity
15:07:37 <janina> present+
15:07:37 <CharlesL> scribe+
15:07:44 <Sheri_B-H> Sheri_B-H has joined #maturity
15:07:46 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:07:46 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- New Business -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:08:07 <stacey> Can someone send the right link for the call? I keep connecting, but I'm the only one on Zoom.
15:08:53 <Fazio> emailed your gmail
15:09:04 <stacey> TY!
15:09:09 <CharlesL> zakim, close item
15:09:09 <Zakim> I don't understand 'close item', CharlesL
15:09:22 <CharlesL> zakim, close this item
15:09:22 <Zakim> agendum 1 closed
15:09:23 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:09:23 <Zakim> 2. Use Cases Update [from Fazio]
15:09:28 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:09:28 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Use Cases Update -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:09:46 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: procurement for a multi-org.
15:10:09 <CharlesL> ... We can email this for review its a page.
15:10:25 <CharlesL> ... I will email it out.  Jeff looking for your comments.
15:10:45 <CharlesL> ... in reviewing other use-cases we can modify some of the older ones.  Will open up a ticket for that.
15:10:52 <jkline> queue+
15:11:00 <NehaJ> NehaJ has joined #maturity
15:11:02 <CharlesL> ... updates are not big.
15:11:06 <NehaJ> present+
15:11:16 <CharlesL> David: down to 15 issues.
15:11:23 <CharlesL> ack jkline
15:11:54 <Sheri_B-H> q+
15:11:58 <CharlesL> jkline: wondering with use cases if its necessary to put in the roles all the time?  seems may not be necessary.
15:12:22 <CharlesL> David: maybe ask Stacey.  usability review?
15:13:04 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: we discussed this Jake pushed hard to have a stake holder list.  ie who to involve.  We don't discuss this at all.  I think we need to leave them in maybe condense them.
15:13:21 <CharlesL> David: Stacey if you can review that section.
15:13:36 <CharlesL> stacey: it is quite big and could be condensed.
15:13:49 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: maybe you and I can review together Stacey.
15:13:55 <CharlesL> stacey: Sure.
15:14:25 <CharlesL> David: this is more editorial I would say. do we need a issue for this?
15:14:48 <CharlesL> janina: if its useful to track progress, it doesn't matter.
15:15:10 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: 1-2 weeks tops we should have this done.  agreed by Stacey.
15:16:21 <CharlesL> CharlesL: we don't have to have every github issue resolved before we move to a release.
15:16:28 <CharlesL> zakim, next item.
15:16:28 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, CharlesL
15:16:34 <CharlesL> q?
15:16:47 <CharlesL> ack Sheri_B-H
15:16:54 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:16:55 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Scoring Spreadsheet Instructions Follow Up -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:17:45 <CharlesL> jkline: Yes I have added this, revised by Charles and Mark.  there is now an instruction page in the excel spreadsheet.
15:18:01 <CharlesL> David, Do we need to add it to the document?
15:18:24 <CharlesL> jkline: I don't think we do.  could add to an appendix. but I don't think we need it.
15:19:51 <CharlesL> CharlesL: this is done and we don't need add instructions to the document. only in the excel spreadsheet.
15:19:52 <CharlesL> zakim, next item.
15:19:52 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Github Issue #148 Add information fields for metadata for each dimension -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:19:52 <gb> /issues/148 -> #148
15:20:29 <Fazio> achttps://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/148
15:20:38 <CharlesL> Add information fields for metadata for each dimension #148
15:21:23 <CharlesL> David: Add fields for each dimension that provides information such as (but not limited to: name of completer of the dimension form, Functional area(s) encompassed, scope of the organization included, etc
15:22:26 <CharlesL> jkline: this tool may be sent to multiple departments / divisions it would be useful to add these fields?
15:22:33 <CharlesL> ... if we add the fields to the top.
15:23:46 <CharlesL> Charles: we do have "Assessment Scope" field at the top of each dimension already.
15:24:06 <CharlesL> jkline: it is also good to have a name associated for traceability.
15:24:35 <CharlesL> ... we don't know how long this version of the spreadsheet will be out there, open schedule on when this gets converted.
15:25:29 <CharlesL> ... if there are enhancements we should do that. it will be easier to do now.
15:25:42 <CharlesL> David: should we do it?
15:25:56 <CharlesL> jkline: I will do it.
15:26:13 <CharlesL> David: jeff will add metadata to the spreadsheet.
15:26:59 <CharlesL> Charles: Jeff please just send me the list of metadata to include.
15:27:04 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:27:04 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- Github Issue #157 Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process. -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:27:04 <gb> /issues/157 -> #157
15:27:22 <CharlesL> Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process.
15:27:30 <CharlesL> Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process. · Issue #157 · w3c/maturity-model
15:27:38 <Fazio> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/157
15:27:38 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/157 -> Issue 157 Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process. (by jasonjgw)
15:28:32 <Sheri_B-H> q+
15:29:46 <CharlesL> David: asking us to define metrics and goals of the procurement process.
15:29:57 <CharlesL> jkline:  yes we did
15:30:07 <CharlesL> ack Sheri_B-H
15:30:50 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: its not always possible to procure an accessible product.  so I don't know calculating what you were doing before / after.
15:31:20 <CharlesL> ... I don't think its a good measure.
15:31:45 <CharlesL> David: he is looking at the ISO standard which is complementary to our maturity model.
15:32:04 <CharlesL> ... I believe the ISO standard does have something for procurement.
15:33:12 <CharlesL> jkline: I think we have this in the new proof point we added. "how many procurements % of, that are demonstrated to be accessible, % of a11y mentioned in SOW and contracts.  he is providing examples but may not be the best examples for our model.
15:33:46 <CharlesL> David: We feel we have addressed this issue and will close it with comments.
15:34:01 <CharlesL> jkline: we should address the 3 specific points he pointed out.
15:34:23 <CharlesL> ... without being specific for the goals / metrics...
15:35:00 <CharlesL> David: word smithing the response before closing the issue.
15:35:33 <Fazio> suggested resolution: Without requiring specific metrics and goals, we believe that our addition of metrics and goals resolves this issue, to the extent applicable by the maturity model.
15:35:48 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:35:48 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- Github Issue #226 Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:35:48 <gb> /issues/226 -> #226
15:36:03 <CharlesL> Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics
15:36:22 <CharlesL> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/226
15:36:23 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/226 -> Issue 226 Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics (by jasonjgw)
15:38:16 <CharlesL> David: we added metrics and goals, for each dimension but he is looking for examples.
15:39:15 <CharlesL> stacey: holistically an organization may not know how to create a metrics and goals.  I think it is important but it is subjective to their business / needs.
15:40:07 <CharlesL> jkline: This is project management 101 defining some goals.  you can make the same argument for a lot of the proof points.
15:40:45 <Sheri_B-H> q+
15:40:51 <CharlesL> ... there may be some in my book, if someone doesn't understand how to define goals for a project, doesn't need to be specific to accessibility...
15:41:12 <CharlesL> stacey: have to assume they don't have a11y knowledge.
15:41:44 <CharlesL> ... I do product management but when you add in a11y they are blanking on what they need to do next.
15:42:52 <CharlesL> David: I think Stacey's approach works here.  very generic but useful.
15:43:35 <janina> +1 to Pre-Requisites; Could be called "Assumptions"
15:43:37 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: slightly different: a "prerequisite" section skills of what this section needs.
15:44:10 <CharlesL> David: suggested skill sets. contract with someone who has this skill set if you don't have it yourself.
15:44:27 <CharlesL> ... can you take a crack at that Sheri?
15:44:38 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: I can take a crack but where would this go?
15:45:09 <CharlesL> ... we can talk about this at the same time with Stacey.  In the abstract section. set expectations.
15:45:30 <CharlesL> jkline: section 1.2 Audience for Maturity model.
15:46:09 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: maybe add more on skills.  suggested skills
15:46:31 <CharlesL> jkline: an executive in charge of this would go find those skills needed
15:46:56 <CharlesL> stacey: maybe hire someone, like PDF remediation for example :)
15:47:37 <CharlesL> David: Jason says its not clear. that Table.  clarify things and things to consider, skills needed etc.
15:48:15 <CharlesL> jkline: who can help us define these goals, this is a progressive model.
15:49:07 <CharlesL> David: we have a couple places for this and will point Jason to this once Stacey and Sheri update the document.
15:49:24 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:49:24 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, CharlesL
15:49:29 <CharlesL> q?
15:49:34 <CharlesL> ack Sheri_B-H
15:49:41 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:49:41 <Zakim> agendum 7 -- Github Issue #137 Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model. -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:49:41 <gb> /issues/137 -> #137
15:50:01 <CharlesL> Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model
15:50:14 <CharlesL> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/137
15:50:15 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/137 -> Issue 137 Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model. (by jasonjgw)
15:51:34 <jkline> queue+
15:51:53 <janina> q+
15:53:06 <CharlesL> stacey: the maturity model is digital spaces not physical spaces.
15:53:13 <CharlesL> ack jkline
15:53:45 <stacey> q+
15:53:45 <Sheri_B-H> q+
15:53:59 <CharlesL> jkline: This is no in scope, compliance issue, no proof points to try and deal with this.  we are trying to enable an organization...
15:54:14 <CharlesL> ack janina
15:54:21 <CharlesL> janina: out of scope
15:54:32 <CharlesL> ack stacey
15:54:40 <CharlesL> ack Sheri_B-H
15:55:05 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: this is the opportunity can extend the model to include these other ideas.
15:55:21 <CharlesL> janina: we are about documenting.
15:55:53 <CharlesL> Sheri_B-H: we aren't signaling out him just other groups are doing this and can extend where appropriate.
15:56:12 <CharlesL> David: yes we won't address this and just say out of scope.
15:56:46 <CharlesL> rrsagent, make logs public
15:57:02 <CharlesL> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:57:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-maturity-minutes.html CharlesL
15:58:35 <CharlesL> zakim, end meeting
15:58:35 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been CharlesL, Fazio, jkline, stacey, janina, NehaJ
15:58:37 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:58:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-maturity-minutes.html Zakim
15:58:43 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, CharlesL; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
15:58:45 <Zakim> Zakim has left #maturity
16:14:46 <NehaJ> NehaJ has left #maturity