IRC log of maturity on 2024-10-23

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14:56:30 [RRSAgent]
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logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-maturity-irc
14:56:35 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:56:36 [Zakim]
please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Fazio
14:56:55 [Fazio]
meeting: Maturity Model Task Force
14:58:08 [Fazio]
chair: David Fazio
14:59:45 [CharlesL]
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present+
15:00:06 [Fazio]
Agenda+ New Business
15:00:06 [Fazio]
Agenda+ Use Cases Update
15:00:06 [Fazio]
Agenda+ Scoring Spreadsheet Instructions Follow Up
15:00:06 [Fazio]
Agenda+ Github Issue #148 Add information fields for metadata for each dimension
15:00:07 [gb]
/issues/148 -> #148
15:00:07 [Fazio]
Agenda+ Github Issue #157 Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process.
15:00:07 [Fazio]
Agenda+ Github Issue #226 Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics
15:00:07 [Fazio]
Agenda+Github Issue #137 Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model.
15:00:07 [gb]
/issues/157 -> #157
15:00:07 [gb]
/issues/226 -> #226
15:00:07 [gb]
/issues/137 -> #137
15:00:20 [Fazio]
present+
15:01:52 [jkline]
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present+
15:04:07 [stacey]
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15:04:18 [stacey]
present+
15:07:33 [janina]
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present+
15:07:37 [CharlesL]
scribe+
15:07:44 [Sheri_B-H]
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15:07:46 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:07:46 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- New Business -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:08:07 [stacey]
Can someone send the right link for the call? I keep connecting, but I'm the only one on Zoom.
15:08:53 [Fazio]
emailed your gmail
15:09:04 [stacey]
TY!
15:09:09 [CharlesL]
zakim, close item
15:09:09 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'close item', CharlesL
15:09:22 [CharlesL]
zakim, close this item
15:09:22 [Zakim]
agendum 1 closed
15:09:23 [Zakim]
I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:09:23 [Zakim]
2. Use Cases Update [from Fazio]
15:09:28 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:09:28 [Zakim]
agendum 2 -- Use Cases Update -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:09:46 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: procurement for a multi-org.
15:10:09 [CharlesL]
... We can email this for review its a page.
15:10:25 [CharlesL]
... I will email it out. Jeff looking for your comments.
15:10:45 [CharlesL]
... in reviewing other use-cases we can modify some of the older ones. Will open up a ticket for that.
15:10:52 [jkline]
queue+
15:11:00 [NehaJ]
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15:11:02 [CharlesL]
... updates are not big.
15:11:06 [NehaJ]
present+
15:11:16 [CharlesL]
David: down to 15 issues.
15:11:23 [CharlesL]
ack jkline
15:11:54 [Sheri_B-H]
q+
15:11:58 [CharlesL]
jkline: wondering with use cases if its necessary to put in the roles all the time? seems may not be necessary.
15:12:22 [CharlesL]
David: maybe ask Stacey. usability review?
15:13:04 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: we discussed this Jake pushed hard to have a stake holder list. ie who to involve. We don't discuss this at all. I think we need to leave them in maybe condense them.
15:13:21 [CharlesL]
David: Stacey if you can review that section.
15:13:36 [CharlesL]
stacey: it is quite big and could be condensed.
15:13:49 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: maybe you and I can review together Stacey.
15:13:55 [CharlesL]
stacey: Sure.
15:14:25 [CharlesL]
David: this is more editorial I would say. do we need a issue for this?
15:14:48 [CharlesL]
janina: if its useful to track progress, it doesn't matter.
15:15:10 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: 1-2 weeks tops we should have this done. agreed by Stacey.
15:16:21 [CharlesL]
CharlesL: we don't have to have every github issue resolved before we move to a release.
15:16:28 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item.
15:16:28 [Zakim]
I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, CharlesL
15:16:34 [CharlesL]
q?
15:16:47 [CharlesL]
ack Sheri_B-H
15:16:54 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:16:55 [Zakim]
agendum 3 -- Scoring Spreadsheet Instructions Follow Up -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:17:45 [CharlesL]
jkline: Yes I have added this, revised by Charles and Mark. there is now an instruction page in the excel spreadsheet.
15:18:01 [CharlesL]
David, Do we need to add it to the document?
15:18:24 [CharlesL]
jkline: I don't think we do. could add to an appendix. but I don't think we need it.
15:19:51 [CharlesL]
CharlesL: this is done and we don't need add instructions to the document. only in the excel spreadsheet.
15:19:52 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item.
15:19:52 [Zakim]
agendum 4 -- Github Issue #148 Add information fields for metadata for each dimension -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:19:52 [gb]
/issues/148 -> #148
15:20:29 [Fazio]
achttps://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/148
15:20:38 [CharlesL]
Add information fields for metadata for each dimension #148
15:21:23 [CharlesL]
David: Add fields for each dimension that provides information such as (but not limited to: name of completer of the dimension form, Functional area(s) encompassed, scope of the organization included, etc
15:22:26 [CharlesL]
jkline: this tool may be sent to multiple departments / divisions it would be useful to add these fields?
15:22:33 [CharlesL]
... if we add the fields to the top.
15:23:46 [CharlesL]
Charles: we do have "Assessment Scope" field at the top of each dimension already.
15:24:06 [CharlesL]
jkline: it is also good to have a name associated for traceability.
15:24:35 [CharlesL]
... we don't know how long this version of the spreadsheet will be out there, open schedule on when this gets converted.
15:25:29 [CharlesL]
... if there are enhancements we should do that. it will be easier to do now.
15:25:42 [CharlesL]
David: should we do it?
15:25:56 [CharlesL]
jkline: I will do it.
15:26:13 [CharlesL]
David: jeff will add metadata to the spreadsheet.
15:26:59 [CharlesL]
Charles: Jeff please just send me the list of metadata to include.
15:27:04 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:27:04 [Zakim]
agendum 5 -- Github Issue #157 Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process. -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:27:04 [gb]
/issues/157 -> #157
15:27:22 [CharlesL]
Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process.
15:27:30 [CharlesL]
Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process. · Issue #157 · w3c/maturity-model
15:27:38 [Fazio]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/157
15:27:38 [gb]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/157 -> Issue 157 Section 3.6: proof points should be expanded to take into account evidence of the outcomes of the procurement process. (by jasonjgw)
15:28:32 [Sheri_B-H]
q+
15:29:46 [CharlesL]
David: asking us to define metrics and goals of the procurement process.
15:29:57 [CharlesL]
jkline: yes we did
15:30:07 [CharlesL]
ack Sheri_B-H
15:30:50 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: its not always possible to procure an accessible product. so I don't know calculating what you were doing before / after.
15:31:20 [CharlesL]
... I don't think its a good measure.
15:31:45 [CharlesL]
David: he is looking at the ISO standard which is complementary to our maturity model.
15:32:04 [CharlesL]
... I believe the ISO standard does have something for procurement.
15:33:12 [CharlesL]
jkline: I think we have this in the new proof point we added. "how many procurements % of, that are demonstrated to be accessible, % of a11y mentioned in SOW and contracts. he is providing examples but may not be the best examples for our model.
15:33:46 [CharlesL]
David: We feel we have addressed this issue and will close it with comments.
15:34:01 [CharlesL]
jkline: we should address the 3 specific points he pointed out.
15:34:23 [CharlesL]
... without being specific for the goals / metrics...
15:35:00 [CharlesL]
David: word smithing the response before closing the issue.
15:35:33 [Fazio]
suggested resolution: Without requiring specific metrics and goals, we believe that our addition of metrics and goals resolves this issue, to the extent applicable by the maturity model.
15:35:48 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:35:48 [Zakim]
agendum 6 -- Github Issue #226 Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:35:48 [gb]
/issues/226 -> #226
15:36:03 [CharlesL]
Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics
15:36:22 [CharlesL]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/226
15:36:23 [gb]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/226 -> Issue 226 Add an explanatory section on dimension goals and metrics (by jasonjgw)
15:38:16 [CharlesL]
David: we added metrics and goals, for each dimension but he is looking for examples.
15:39:15 [CharlesL]
stacey: holistically an organization may not know how to create a metrics and goals. I think it is important but it is subjective to their business / needs.
15:40:07 [CharlesL]
jkline: This is project management 101 defining some goals. you can make the same argument for a lot of the proof points.
15:40:45 [Sheri_B-H]
q+
15:40:51 [CharlesL]
... there may be some in my book, if someone doesn't understand how to define goals for a project, doesn't need to be specific to accessibility...
15:41:12 [CharlesL]
stacey: have to assume they don't have a11y knowledge.
15:41:44 [CharlesL]
... I do product management but when you add in a11y they are blanking on what they need to do next.
15:42:52 [CharlesL]
David: I think Stacey's approach works here. very generic but useful.
15:43:35 [janina]
+1 to Pre-Requisites; Could be called "Assumptions"
15:43:37 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: slightly different: a "prerequisite" section skills of what this section needs.
15:44:10 [CharlesL]
David: suggested skill sets. contract with someone who has this skill set if you don't have it yourself.
15:44:27 [CharlesL]
... can you take a crack at that Sheri?
15:44:38 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: I can take a crack but where would this go?
15:45:09 [CharlesL]
... we can talk about this at the same time with Stacey. In the abstract section. set expectations.
15:45:30 [CharlesL]
jkline: section 1.2 Audience for Maturity model.
15:46:09 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: maybe add more on skills. suggested skills
15:46:31 [CharlesL]
jkline: an executive in charge of this would go find those skills needed
15:46:56 [CharlesL]
stacey: maybe hire someone, like PDF remediation for example :)
15:47:37 [CharlesL]
David: Jason says its not clear. that Table. clarify things and things to consider, skills needed etc.
15:48:15 [CharlesL]
jkline: who can help us define these goals, this is a progressive model.
15:49:07 [CharlesL]
David: we have a couple places for this and will point Jason to this once Stacey and Sheri update the document.
15:49:24 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:49:24 [Zakim]
I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, CharlesL
15:49:29 [CharlesL]
q?
15:49:34 [CharlesL]
ack Sheri_B-H
15:49:41 [CharlesL]
zakim, next item
15:49:41 [Zakim]
agendum 7 -- Github Issue #137 Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model. -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:49:41 [gb]
/issues/137 -> #137
15:50:01 [CharlesL]
Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model
15:50:14 [CharlesL]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/137
15:50:15 [gb]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/137 -> Issue 137 Address the accessibility of entire processes in the Maturity Model. (by jasonjgw)
15:51:34 [jkline]
queue+
15:51:53 [janina]
q+
15:53:06 [CharlesL]
stacey: the maturity model is digital spaces not physical spaces.
15:53:13 [CharlesL]
ack jkline
15:53:45 [stacey]
q+
15:53:45 [Sheri_B-H]
q+
15:53:59 [CharlesL]
jkline: This is no in scope, compliance issue, no proof points to try and deal with this. we are trying to enable an organization...
15:54:14 [CharlesL]
ack janina
15:54:21 [CharlesL]
janina: out of scope
15:54:32 [CharlesL]
ack stacey
15:54:40 [CharlesL]
ack Sheri_B-H
15:55:05 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: this is the opportunity can extend the model to include these other ideas.
15:55:21 [CharlesL]
janina: we are about documenting.
15:55:53 [CharlesL]
Sheri_B-H: we aren't signaling out him just other groups are doing this and can extend where appropriate.
15:56:12 [CharlesL]
David: yes we won't address this and just say out of scope.
15:56:46 [CharlesL]
rrsagent, make logs public
15:57:02 [CharlesL]
rrsagent, draft minutes
15:57:03 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-maturity-minutes.html CharlesL
15:58:35 [CharlesL]
zakim, end meeting
15:58:35 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been CharlesL, Fazio, jkline, stacey, janina, NehaJ
15:58:37 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:58:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-maturity-minutes.html Zakim
15:58:43 [Zakim]
I am happy to have been of service, CharlesL; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye
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