13:07:23 RRSAgent has joined #matf 13:07:27 logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-matf-irc 13:07:27 GleidsonRamos has joined #matf 13:07:39 Jamie has joined #matf 13:07:52 julianmka has joined #MATF 13:08:06 Zakim, start meeting 13:08:06 RRSAgent, make logs Public 13:08:08 please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Joe_Humbert 13:08:27 present+ 13:08:28 Zakim, this is MATF October 23 2024 13:08:28 got it, Joe_Humbert 13:08:39 present+ 13:08:51 Meeting: MATF October 23 2024 13:09:08 scribe: quintinb 13:09:18 Yup! 13:09:23 present+ 13:09:30 present+ 13:09:36 present+ 13:10:15 agenda+ 3.2.6 Consistent Help 13:10:29 agenda+ 3.3.2 Labels or Instructions 13:10:42 agenda+ 4.1.2 Name, Role, Value 13:10:48 present+ 13:11:03 move to next agendum 13:11:03 agendum 1 -- 3.2.6 Consistent Help -- taken up [from Joe_Humbert] 13:11:23 https://github.com/w3c/matf/issues/43 13:11:55 present+ 13:15:41 I know for example "COMMAND + /" in Android show the keyboard shortcuts, and developers can add their own shortcuts to this menu if they programatically register them 13:16:01 ⌘ + / 13:16:41 q+ 13:16:46 q+ 13:18:04 Jamie has joined #matf 13:18:19 julianmka I agree can apply as written with minor word swaps - however floating chat also needs to be considered, like a chatbot 13:18:28 present+ 13:19:15 q+ 13:20:34 julianmka usually floating actions present other accessibility problems on top of consistent help 13:21:40 ack julian 13:21:47 ack Jamie 13:24:22 Jamie I feel like including floating help as an additional option or note should exist, not to modify the SC but acknoledge. Looking at the NOTE 3 (ADDED) how does it apply? Does it need to be a set, or just a pattern? 13:24:22 I would consider the floating help toelong to this 13:24:26 *to belong 13:24:30 +1 13:26:37 Joe_Humbert some of this needs to defined at a higher level to avoid the document being overwhelmed. The floating help seems to cover many of the points 13:26:44 q+ 13:27:44 -1 13:27:52 ack quintinb 13:27:54 @joe asking if there is something to call out specifically? *silence* 13:29:44 q+ 13:31:05 ack Jamie 13:31:17 q+ 13:33:30 +1 Joe_Humbert to adding this to understanding 13:35:51 ack julianmka 13:36:23 julianmka we should not conflate the SC too much (like with the keyboard android stuff) 13:36:24 +1 to julianmka 13:36:27 +1 julianmka 13:38:20 +1 to keep as is 13:38:48 "view" needs some clarity 13:38:51 +1 13:38:53 but yeah 13:38:53 +1 13:38:55 +1 13:38:57 +1 13:39:13 GleidsonRamos has joined #matf 13:39:51 ACTION: Propose the draft SC as is for wider group 13:40:04 move to next agendum 13:40:04 agendum 2 -- 3.3.2 Labels or Instructions -- taken up [from Joe_Humbert] 13:40:27 q+ 13:42:57 JJ has joined #matf 13:43:01 q+ 13:43:04 present+ 13:43:10 We could probably add a note that labels should not disappear when input focus is given to the labelled element (i.e. hint) 13:43:11 q+ 13:43:14 ack quintinb 13:43:46 Hey all, sorry for being late - construction workers started making noise at the office so headed home, but missed the meeting notification because I was away from my laptop. Thanks for taking over Joe_Humbert! 13:45:35 Could we just add a relates link? 13:46:22 Joe_Humbert it seems that mobile developers do miss this 13:46:39 julianmka said there is a mention of this somewhere else 13:46:58 Jamie if we scope it to mobile apps, agrees 13:47:32 Yes, note can help to clarify best-practices in mobile (app) context 13:48:13 Just add a contact in iPhone - the name field is an example of this error 13:48:50 julianmka there isn't a mention in 3.2.2 in the understanding docs 13:49:14 Joe_Humbert do we need to modify the definition of label? 13:49:45 q- 13:49:51 Android would be "text" element, "UILabel" in IOS 13:50:14 (or "TextView" if you're a dinosaur Android dev) 13:50:36 +1 as is 13:50:39 +1 as is 13:50:42 +1 as is 13:50:45 +1 13:50:46 +1 as is 13:50:47 +1 13:51:14 Joe_Humbert has joined #matf 13:51:21 ACTION: Suggest to accept 3.3.2 for the wider group 13:52:18 move to next agendum 13:52:18 I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Joe_Humbert 13:52:26 q? 13:52:28 q- 13:52:35 move to next agendum 13:52:35 agendum 3 -- 4.1.2 Name, Role, Value -- taken up [from Joe_Humbert] 13:52:52 https://github.com/w3c/matf/issues/48 13:53:36 Fixed link in agenda 13:54:01 Jamie on 4.1.2 - 2 questions: intended coverage - to all UI element types, and how to call out keyboard as an AT for 4.1.2 13:55:14 Jamie How do we interpret the control aspect? 13:55:56 q+ 13:56:20 q+ 13:56:35 ack JJ 13:56:41 I would say that all UI components regardless of interaction should be identifiable by AT 13:57:32 JJ I've interpreted this in the context of interactive components - the issues are mostly about custom components 13:57:33 q+ 13:57:47 ack julianmka 13:59:01 julianmka I think there is a world where this primarily applies to custom components, native components usually work but devs do lack a lot of knowledge in this area (e.g. separation of name and state). 13:59:03 ack GleidsonRamos 13:59:59 GleidsonRamos I agree about custom components, but not always - in X platform there are additional issues because a lot of the time the components that are "standard" are actually already "custom" 14:00:13 +1 to julianmka that even standard user interface components in mobile do include a higher layer of accessibility knowledge than in web so should be mentioned in this SC 14:00:56 bye! 14:04:40 rrsagent, make minutes 14:04:41 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/10/23-matf-minutes.html JJ 14:05:12 zakim, bye 14:05:12 leaving. As of this point the attendees have been Jamie, quintinb, julianmka, GleidsonRamos, Karla, Joe_Humbert, jeroen, JJ 14:05:12 Zakim has left #matf