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14:51:42 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/03/28-pcg-a11y-irc
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14:52:03 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, this will be pcg-a11y
14:52:03 <Zakim> ok, AvneeshSingh
14:52:16 <AvneeshSingh> present+
14:52:24 <AvneeshSingh> chair: AvneeshSingh
14:55:21 <ChrisOliverOttawa> ChrisOliverOttawa has joined #pcg-a11y
14:55:25 <George> present+
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15:03:18 <gpellegrino> present+
15:04:03 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Review of in-progress techniques documents.
15:04:25 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Proposal for ONIX technique for Charts, diagrams, and formulas
15:04:31 <ChrisOliverOttawa> present+
15:04:40 <AvneeshSingh> agenda+ Any other business.
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15:05:12 <gpellegrino> scribe+
15:05:22 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:05:22 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Review of in-progress techniques documents. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:05:42 <Madeleine> Madeleine has joined #pcg-a11y
15:05:48 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: we had a lot of merges in the last week
15:05:51 <Madeleine> present +
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15:06:05 <gpellegrino> George: I worked in the principles document, based on Madeleine comments
15:06:08 <gautierchomel> present+
15:06:11 <gautierchomel> https://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/wiki/Minute_Taking_Tips
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15:07:04 <Madeleine> present+
15:07:07 <gpellegrino> q+
15:07:22 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:08:11 <gpellegrino> George: do I have to add unkown for all principles?
15:08:14 <gautierchomel> q+
15:08:20 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino: no
15:09:08 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: if there is no metadata for hazards I think it is better to hide the principle
15:09:27 <gpellegrino> George: if there is the information it will be explicit
15:10:05 <gautierchomel> q-
15:10:06 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:10:15 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:10:15 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Proposal for ONIX technique for Charts, diagrams, and formulas -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:10:37 <AvneeshSingh> https://github.com/w3c/publ-a11y/pull/257
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15:12:45 <gpellegrino> Chris_ED: the proposal we check if there are charts or diagrams in the publication
15:14:06 <gautierchomel> https://rawcdn.githack.com/w3c/publ-a11y/1abe0943cbc2bbfe3d35c88b90f0125f383336dc/UX-Guide-Metadata/draft/techniques/onix-metadata/index.html
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15:14:35 <gpellegrino> ... I also check if there are  mathematics formulas and chemeitry formulas
15:14:46 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:14:58 <gpellegrino> .. if some of these are present I check if there are alternatives (extended or data)
15:15:35 <gpellegrino> ... if formulas are present I checked if they are in accessible formats
15:15:37 <gpellegrino> q+
15:16:14 <Miiak> Miiak has joined #pcg-a11y
15:16:48 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
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15:17:45 <Hadrien> present+
15:17:57 <Bill_Kasdorf1> present+
15:18:06 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:18:26 <Madeleine> q+
15:18:37 <AvneeshSingh> ack madel
15:18:56 <Chris_ED> q+
15:19:24 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino: we have the last instruction for telling when there is a formulas or chart or chem, but not the accessible way to express it
15:19:30 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:19:42 <gpellegrino> ... is it ok for you?
15:20:01 <gpellegrino> Madeleine: yes, I think it is ok to have all them together at the end
15:20:48 <gpellegrino> Chris_ED: I think it is the most used way in ONIX
15:20:49 <gpellegrino> q+
15:20:56 <Chris_ED> q+
15:21:04 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:22:33 <Madeleine> q+
15:23:11 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino: the statements we check if there there are formulas and if they are accessible
15:23:16 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:24:11 <gpellegrino> ... maybe there is no need to double check if there are formulas in the epub
15:24:44 <gpellegrino> Chris_ED: in onix we have a way to say that chem can be expressed both in chemml and mathml
15:24:44 <AvneeshSingh> ack madel
15:26:04 <gpellegrino> ... we are developing a validator for checking that if you say that you have accessible formulas, you also have to say that you have formulas in epub
15:26:18 <gautierchomel> q+
15:26:39 <gpellegrino> Madeleine: yes, maybe we may have some records saying that there are accessible formulas, without saying that there are formulas at all
15:27:15 <gautierchomel> q-
15:27:58 <gpellegrino> ... so maybe as Chris suggested we may change the first four instructions to check only for presence of accessibility metadata
15:28:34 <Madeleine> q+
15:28:36 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: I would preferred the simplified version
15:28:56 <Madeleine> q-
15:29:19 <gpellegrino> George: I'm afraid that publishers think they have to do extra work for accessible math (apart from MathML)
15:29:36 <gpellegrino> Chris_ED: "accessible math" is displayed only if we have mathml or latex
15:29:40 <gpellegrino> q+
15:29:49 <gpellegrino> q-
15:30:06 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: I'm aware of ChemML... never seen it
15:30:15 <gpellegrino> Chris_ED: Yes, we have it, but not used
15:30:35 <gpellegrino> ... a lot by publishers
15:30:37 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:30:53 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino: I'll update the PR
15:30:54 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, next agendum
15:30:54 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Any other business. -- taken up [from AvneeshSingh]
15:31:23 <gpellegrino> ChrisOliverOttawa: It started as an initiative last summer
15:31:39 <gpellegrino> ... the idea is to have the whole library community onboard
15:31:55 <gpellegrino> ... libraries would like to leverage on the work done in the W3C
15:32:15 <gpellegrino> ... in the libraries we have to manage born accessible, remediated, printed books
15:32:32 <gpellegrino> ... so we had the idea to start a network within IFLA
15:32:41 <gpellegrino> ... it should be approved in april
15:32:58 <gpellegrino> ... there is already a lot of interest, with over 60 people
15:33:18 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:33:37 <gpellegrino> ... a lot of them have IFLA affiliations, but 30% of them are from the disabilities associations
15:33:52 <gpellegrino> ... Gregorio joined the network
15:34:20 <gpellegrino> ... we're creating working groups, there will be a crosswalk working group
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15:36:08 <gpellegrino> ... 4 working groups: general principles, mapping and crosswalk groups (to reuse metadata), best practices and display, vocabulary
15:36:36 <gpellegrino> ... for sure the work done within W3C (mapping, display guidelines) would be a starting point for our work
15:37:31 <gpellegrino> q+
15:37:44 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:39:41 <gpellegrino> q+
15:40:05 <AvneeshSingh> ack next
15:41:13 <Bill_Kasdorf1> q+
15:41:17 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: I think that having a sync between our principles document and the IFLA one is important
15:41:59 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino: I think the scope of the two documents are sligthly different
15:42:33 <gpellegrino> ChrisOliverOttawa: right, it's more high level, also political, but for sure having a sync is important
15:44:20 <gpellegrino> ChrisOliverOttawa: we have representative from different stakeholders, normally when we publish document than it is reviewed by people from all over the world
15:45:26 <Madeleine> Madeleine has joined #pcg-a11y
15:45:34 <gpellegrino> who is interested can join the BaseCamp group
15:46:00 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:46:17 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: you have done a great work with the MARC crosswalk. Will you start from that?
15:47:05 <gpellegrino> ChrisOliverOttawa: we'll use that as a starting point, we'll also have people form UNIMARC
15:47:27 <gpellegrino> Bill_Kasdorf1: at the end of your work, will this implementation be on the side of libraries or of vendors?
15:48:03 <gpellegrino> ChrisOliverOttawa: the work should push this idea: if the accessibility metadata is stored, then they should be displayed
15:48:36 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:48:57 <AvneeshSingh> ack bill
15:49:38 <gpellegrino> we have two use cases: metadata from publishers and local metadata for remediated files
15:50:17 <gpellegrino> Bill_Kasdorf1: I'm going to work on an ISO WG for defining metadata about remediation
15:50:40 <gpellegrino> ... we'll use what is already available, so not to reinvent the wheel
15:51:09 <AvneeshSingh> q?
15:52:18 <gpellegrino> AvneeshSingh: the important thing is to be insync
15:52:19 <Bill_Kasdorf1> s/ISO/NISO
15:53:37 <AvneeshSingh> rrsagent, make minutes
15:53:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/03/28-pcg-a11y-minutes.html AvneeshSingh
15:53:45 <AvneeshSingh> rrsagent, make logs public
15:54:49 <AvneeshSingh> zakim, bye
15:54:49 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been AvneeshSingh, George, gpellegrino, ChrisOliverOttawa, gautierchomel, Madeleine, Hadrien, Bill_Kasdorf
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