IRC log of ixml on 2024-03-05

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:37:00 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #ixml
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logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/03/05-ixml-irc
14:43:26 [cmsmcq]
scribe: cmsmcq
14:43:51 [cmsmcq]
Meeting: Invisible XML CG
14:44:30 [cmsmcq]
Previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2024/02/20-ixml-minutes
14:45:14 [cmsmcq]
Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ixml/2024Mar/0007.html
14:45:23 [cmsmcq]
rrsagent, make logs public
14:53:40 [Steven]
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14:56:02 [norm]
norm has joined #ixml
15:01:01 [cmsmcq]
rrsagent, please make the minutes
15:01:02 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/03/05-ixml-minutes.html cmsmcq
15:02:52 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Review of action items
15:02:55 [john]
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ACTION 2023-01-10-f continues.
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ACTION 2023-11-28-a continues.
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ACTION 2023-11-28-c continues.
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ACTION 2023-11-28-e was done in https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ixml/2024Mar/0009.html
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ACTION 2024-02-20-a
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has been done.
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ACTION 2024-02-20-b continues.
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ACTION 2024-02-20-c has been done (issues #234 - #236)
15:08:40 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Pull request #224 Mitigating ambiguity in mod357
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Topic: Status reports
15:09:30 [cmsmcq]
JL reports he has done a lot of exploration of generating ixml grammars, with special reference to auto-generation of XPath 4 grammar.
15:10:03 [cmsmcq]
You can generate quite big ixml grammars, and the issue of controlling inherent ambiguity really needs to be looked at.
15:10:34 [cmsmcq]
Any spec which uses extra-grammatical constraints to resolve ambiguities will exhibit this problem.
15:11:12 [cmsmcq]
JL uses an ixml grammar to parse the source code for the specification of the XPath 4.0 grammar in the specs, and produces an ixml grammar.
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NTW has nothing to report.
15:11:37 [cmsmcq]
SP is working to prepare for Prague, but has nothing visible to report.
15:12:49 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Pull request #224 Mitigating ambiguity in mod357
15:13:28 [norm]
https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/pull/224
15:23:20 [cmsmcq]
We discussed.
15:28:07 [cmsmcq]
Ultimately, GR's suggestion is a way to make the test catalog more manageable.
15:28:28 [cmsmcq]
We can do that by making the results deterministic, as GR suggests.
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Or by using only unambiguous test numerals.
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We reached consensus that we should accept the pull request.
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ACTION: Norm to confirm correctness of #224 and commit the pr
15:31:01 [norm]
ACTION: Norm to test the correctness of PR #224 and merge if it is correct.
15:31:24 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Pull request #225 Fix errors in ixml-spec-grammar performance test for XPath
15:31:31 [cmsmcq]
Yes, accept.
15:31:42 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Pull request #226 Additional result for performantce/xpath xsltforms-3
15:32:01 [cmsmcq]
Accept this.
15:32:43 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Pull request #227 Add .gitattributes
15:33:21 [cmsmcq]
NTW suggests leaving #227 unresolved until we have resolved issue #192.
15:34:10 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Issue #233 There are other things called iXML
15:34:44 [cmsmcq]
ACTION: Norm to add a section to the home page pointing to other things named "ixml" or "9ml" or ...
15:35:59 [cmsmcq]
Jim mentions another recipeML
15:36:10 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Issue #139 Sample grammars for IRIs and URIs
15:36:49 [cmsmcq]
SP clarifies that he doesn't propose to replace the existing ixml grammars, just to add a new one.
15:36:58 [cmsmcq]
NTW says that's fine, just modulate the tone in the README a bit.
15:37:59 [cmsmcq]
ACTION: SP to prepare pull request to resolve issue #139 (new grammars, new README).
15:38:32 [cmsmcq]
Topic: Issue #236 When must version numbers change?
15:42:03 [norm]
SP: I don't like version numbers.
15:42:48 [norm]
CM: I don't like them either but consider the case of a C program from the mid-eighties that heavily used some extensions...I can't compile it.
15:43:12 [norm]
... If something claims to be a correct iXML grammar for version 3, I don't need to be surprised if it isn't processable by a 1.1 processor.
15:43:35 [norm]
... If there's no version number, then, "well, sometimes iXML grammars work and sometimes they don't." A race to the bottom.
15:47:22 [norm]
Some discussion about whether or not a construct that is an error in 1.0 that is then allowed in 1.1 is considered a change of semantics or just a change of syntax.
15:49:20 [norm]
SP asserts strongly that adding new syntax not valid in 1.0 is not a change.
15:52:48 [cmsmcq]
MSM asserts strongly that the change from "not a grammar" to "a grammar with a particular meaning" is a change to the semantics of an input.
15:57:14 [cmsmcq]
We discussed, without any visible forward progress.
15:57:47 [cmsmcq]
Topic: next meeting 19 March.
15:57:53 [cmsmcq]
Beware time zone shift in US
15:59:31 [cmsmcq]
Topic: typo in 1.0 spec
15:59:46 [cmsmcq]
Pi should be defined as 3.1415926 not 3.145926
16:00:29 [cmsmcq]
RRSAgent, please make minutes
16:00:31 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/03/05-ixml-minutes.html cmsmcq
16:02:15 [cmsmcq]
present: John Lumley, Steven Pemberton, Jim Saiya, Michael Sperberg-McQueen, Norm Tovey-Walsh, Bethan Tovey-Walsh
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scribe: Michael Sperberg-McQueen
16:02:26 [cmsmcq]
scribenick: cmsmcq
16:02:54 [cmsmcq]
chair: Steven Pemberton
16:02:59 [cmsmcq]
RRSAgent, please make minutes
16:03:00 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/03/05-ixml-minutes.html cmsmcq