IRC log of coga on 2024-02-05

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:20:07 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
13:20:11 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, make logs Public
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Meeting: Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
13:26:25 [lisa_]
agendaag / newd draft. see testing subgroup and
13:27:09 [lisa_]
agenda+ Testingand new draft. Should we link to a wiki? see testing subgroup and
13:28:33 [lisa_]
agenda+ Breakout sessions in March
13:29:27 [lisa_]
agenda+ Wayfinding issue paper
13:31:55 [lisa_]
agenda+ conversational interfaces paper. See
13:33:30 [lisa_]
Agenda+ ag summary
13:33:45 [lisa_]
Agenda+ Analisis document
13:40:41 [lisa_]
RRSAgent, publish minutes
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I have made the request to generate lisa_
15:37:15 [lisa_]
15:37:28 [lisa_]
RRSAgent, publish minutes
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I have made the request to generate lisa_
15:38:24 [lisa_]
Regrets+ David, Jennie, Rachael
15:39:49 [lisa_]
scribe list. please sign up
15:52:35 [lisa_]
15:58:58 [abbey]
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16:00:41 [JustineP]
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16:01:06 [julierawe]
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16:01:38 [lisa_]
scribe: Julieraw
16:01:59 [lisa_]
next item
16:02:19 [lisa_]
take up item 2
16:02:20 [Becca_Monteleone]
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16:02:21 [julierawe]
Lisa: We need Rain for 1st agenda item
16:02:21 [abbey]
16:02:29 [Becca_Monteleone]
16:02:40 [Becca_Monteleone]
I am having difficulty logging onto the zoom, and hope to join shortly!
16:02:48 [lisa_]
16:03:02 [lisa_]
take up item 6
16:03:43 [lisa_]
priortisation call tomorow
16:03:49 [lisa_]
scribe+ lisa
16:03:51 [lisa_]
priortisation call tomorow
16:04:20 [lisa_]
lisa: have we done what you need from us
16:04:47 [tburtin]
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16:04:50 [RAin]
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16:04:53 [tburtin]
16:04:54 [lisa_]
julie: crd sort may come first, and Im not sure if we need support for voting
16:05:00 [RAin]
16:05:18 [lisa_]
close item 6
16:05:26 [kirkwood]
16:05:43 [lisa_]
take up item 1
16:05:53 [julierawe]
Rain is seeking early feedback before subgroup meeting on Thursday
16:06:32 [lisa_]
Q= to say how can we fit in testing (no hurry)
16:07:02 [julierawe]
Rain: This is not high-fidelity, it's simple "grey boxing" to give idea of what the layout will be
16:07:39 [julierawe]
Rain: The publication details will be hidden with a dropdown so the first thing you see is introduction
16:07:57 [julierawe]
Rain: Design and Build shows 5 main sections
16:08:28 [julierawe]
Rain: "How to use this document" has accordions so you can expand each section
16:08:45 [julierawe]
Rain: Gives you a step-by-step recommendation on how to use this document
16:09:21 [julierawe]
Rain: "Design and Build" section is collapsed with short description of the 5 sections and they are also zippes
16:09:23 [julierawe]
16:09:41 [julierawe]
Rain: Can use "expand" option or click on the link
16:09:51 [lisa_]
q+ to ask if we have a signal doc on what you have followed
16:10:31 [julierawe]
Rain: If click into a section, will get tags for roles typically responsible. Tapping on these would take you to info that is relevant for that role
16:10:44 [lisa_]
q+ to add tags on media/modality
16:10:56 [julierawe]
Rain: Also includes at top of the section when these actions typically happen
16:11:24 [julierawe]
Rain: Then patterns are presented in buckets (Informative, Logical, Safeguarded)
16:11:46 [julierawe]
Rain: I've started going through what would be in a specific pattern, including visualized examples
16:12:16 [tburtin]
16:12:21 [lisa_]
q+ on form look that isnt a form
16:12:32 [julierawe]
Rain: Seeking early feedback now so we can address it when we meet on Thursday
16:12:59 [lisa_]
ack t
16:13:25 [julierawe]
Tiffany: Small request to give heads-up when moving the screen
16:13:29 [Leandro]
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16:13:37 [Leandro]
16:13:54 [julierawe]
Tiffany: How will this work for screenreaders?
16:14:01 [julierawe]
Rain: It will be in HTML
16:14:08 [julierawe]
16:14:15 [lisa_]
ack next
16:14:16 [Zakim]
lisa_, you wanted to ask if we have a signal doc on what you have followed and to add tags on media/modality and to comment on form look that isnt a form
16:14:44 [julierawe]
Tiffany: Need to make sure labels are clear and tie together so no one gets lost
16:15:13 [julierawe]
Lisa: We seem to have missed out on testing as an objective as well as general information
16:15:57 [julierawe]
Lisa: Include findings from the work Shawn and Jennie did as a testing subgroup last year
16:16:08 [julierawe]
Lisa: Include advice on user testing
16:16:32 [julierawe]
Lisa: Sometimes there are 3 to 5 things you should test together
16:16:47 [julierawe]
Lisa: The user testing might be better to have in a wiki format?
16:17:25 [julierawe]
Lisa: Some people find it much easier to have a single document that they expand and print or that they expand and listen to
16:18:31 [julierawe]
Lisa: People could get lost because you've done 5 clicks and you might have lost where it fits in the whole thing
16:18:47 [julierawe]
Rain: There will be a lefthand column to help you see where you are — I haven't mocked that piece up yet
16:19:32 [julierawe]
Rain: The side navigation will be always available
16:20:10 [julierawe]
Lisa: We may want tags on the media modality, like some are specifically for speech
16:20:52 [lisa_]
ack next
16:20:55 [Rain_]
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16:21:23 [julierawe]
Lisa: Where the pattern screen is, it looks like a form, but that's probably a prototyping thing
16:21:53 [lisa_]
julie: it looks amazing
16:22:21 [lisa_]
zoom into patterns screen
16:22:40 [lisa_]
will the buckets be diffrent per objective
16:22:46 [RAin]
16:22:56 [lisa_]
rain: the bucket is diffrent for each one
16:23:19 [lisa_]
(each bucket had the patterns grouped in a phrase)
16:24:01 [lisa_]
julie:loves the buckets. caughtion with these terms so that the phrases invite people in and they nknow what it is
16:24:22 [kirkwood]
+1 to buckets meeting
16:24:25 [tburtin]
16:24:35 [lisa_]
ack next
16:25:16 [julierawe]
Tiffany: I could help make the buckets more pronounced and easier to notice and understand
16:25:42 [lisa_]
next item
16:25:51 [julierawe]
Lisa: Can we move on to the next item? Fantastic job, Rain
16:26:17 [julierawe]
Lisa: WCAG will come out later than our next version
16:26:28 [lisa_]
close item 2
16:26:30 [julierawe]
Lisa: Having a wiki might be the best way.
16:26:41 [julierawe]
Lisa: We might need to publish as an editor's note
16:26:42 [lisa_]
next item
16:27:19 [julierawe]
Julie asked if other folks were getting an error when trying to open the doc Lisa shared
16:27:23 [julierawe]
Becca said yes
16:28:09 [julierawe]
Lisa: TPAC is when all the W3C gets together and there's an opportunity to give a presentation or have a breakoutsession
16:28:30 [julierawe]
Lisa: TPAC is in September but they're also having breakout sessions in March
16:28:42 [julierawe]
Lisa: These sessions will be at most 50 minutes
16:28:56 [julierawe]
Lisa: Plenary is for raising awareness, at most 10 minutes
16:29:07 [julierawe]
16:29:27 [julierawe]
Lisa: People who have something they want all of W3C to be aware of
16:29:27 [lisa_]
To propose a session: For more information about W3C Breakouts Day 2024 (including who may propose a session, time slots, etc.), see:
16:29:52 [lisa_]
Calendar 29 February: Deadline for proposals 1 March: Draft schedule announced 8 March: Stable schedule announced 12 March: W3C Breakouts Day 2024
16:29:56 [julierawe]
Lisa: The deadline for proposals is the end of this month
16:30:46 [julierawe]
Lisa: This is something new, that they're doing midway through the year to do TPAC-ish things
16:31:07 [julierawe]
Lisa: Breakouts are parallel sessions that some groups might be interested in
16:31:16 [tburtin]
TPAC 2024 Will be held on 23-27 September 2024 in Anaheim, CA, USA & online. Source:
16:31:22 [julierawe]
Lisa: Internationalization might be good, Mental Health might be good
16:31:38 [julierawe]
Lisa: Part of the agenda could be do we want to do breakout
16:31:54 [julierawe]
Lisa: The problem is it's in a month, on the 12th of March. Do we have time?
16:32:46 [julierawe]
Lisa: These can take a lot of work so know your goal
16:32:56 [lisa_]
Sessions For this W3C Breakouts Day experiment we are soliciting two kinds of session proposals: Breakout (for deep dives, smaller group, at most 50 minutes). We plan to schedule breakout sessions in parallel (ideally, no more than 5 in parallel). Plenary (for raising awareness, large group, at most 10 minutes). We plan to schedule plenary sessions back to back within a single hour, with no other sessions in parallel. (If we receive many plenary pro[CUT]
16:33:28 [julierawe]
Lisa: Internationalization might be perfect for plenary
16:33:34 [julierawe]
16:34:07 [julierawe]
Lisa: Rain, do you want to share new structure at a breakout?
16:34:09 [RAin]
+1 but I need to see if it's possible for me to do that timing wise
16:34:21 [lisa_]
ack next
16:35:10 [julierawe]
Lisa: Internationalization could be recruiting opportunity
16:35:28 [lisa_]
next item
16:35:28 [julierawe]
Lisa: And if we can't do March, there's also September
16:35:46 [lisa_]
16:36:12 [lisa_]
drive for testing subgroups work:
16:36:46 [julierawe]
Becca: I have taken these two issues papers as far as I can take them. Need robust review.
16:37:20 [lisa_]
q+ to say do we need a new patern or change to content useable
16:37:42 [julierawe]
Becca: We could build user stories around these three use cases: hospital, airport, grocery store
16:38:08 [julierawe]
Lisa: Content Usable is where we have these use cases and scenarios. It doesn't have to go in this paper.
16:38:23 [kirkwood]
16:38:28 [julierawe]
Lisa: We want to build out personas, but we don't have to do that in these issues papers. Can do in Making Content Usable
16:38:37 [lisa_]
ack J
16:39:18 [julierawe]
John K: Should we have aging as part of wayfinding? Does that go outside our range of thinking?
16:39:20 [lisa_]
ack k
16:39:40 [julierawe]
16:40:03 [julierawe]
Lisa: I don't know if that's a separate paper
16:40:57 [julierawe]
Becca: In the previous draft, we added a sentence that some people may experience temporary cognitive issues.
16:41:14 [julierawe]
Becca: Maybe we add another sentence that this requires more evidence or guidance?
16:42:22 [kirkwood]
issue of “Wandering in People/ Patients with Alzheimer's Disease and Dementia” may be a topic to have awareness of
16:42:32 [julierawe]
Lisa: Being able to track where you are gives people freedom
16:42:50 [julierawe]
Becca: Maybe it will be clearer next week what the additional sentence is
16:42:59 [lisa_]
note on informed concent
16:43:07 [kirkwood]
potentiallly; Wandering in People or Patients with Alzheimer's Disease and Dementia
16:43:41 [julierawe]
Lisa: Supported decision making and consent. Issue paper might be the right place to do that.
16:44:15 [lisa_]
ack next
16:44:16 [Zakim]
lisa_, you wanted to say do we need a new patern or change to content useable
16:44:24 [lisa_]
ack next
16:44:38 [Leandro]
16:45:18 [lisa_]
julie: can we do in door navigation as it is not online? do we need a comment on scope
16:46:02 [julierawe]
Julie: Suggest adding a note at the top of the paper that this issue paper is not about digital accessibility.
16:46:07 [lisa_]
john: +1 more real world, and it makes a missunderstanding
16:46:21 [julierawe]
Julie: That this is about wayfinding in physical spaces, not digital wayfinding
16:46:29 [lisa_]
lets and a sentence on scope so people dont get confuced
16:47:01 [julierawe]
John K: Two different kinds of topics. Let's make sure we don't create confusion.
16:47:30 [julierawe]
Becca: Could we say this document is about technology-assisted navigation through indoor spaces?
16:47:42 [julierawe]
John K: Geolocation is a potential word to use
16:48:07 [julierawe]
Lisa: It's very similar to online wayfinding
16:48:32 [julierawe]
John K: Geolocation and directions from place to place
16:49:32 [julierawe]
Julie: Suggest adding "technology-assisted" to the title
16:50:29 [julierawe]
John K: Or should it be split? This is about navigation in the physical world.
16:50:45 [julierawe]
Becca: My focus is on navigating in physical space using technology.
16:50:55 [julierawe]
Lisa: Do we have one on digital wayfinding?
16:51:06 [julierawe]
John K: I seem to remember we did?
16:51:14 [julierawe]
Lisa: I thought we'd combined them?
16:51:34 [julierawe]
Becca: The Github/original version was just focused on indoor navigation.
16:52:10 [julierawe]
Lisa: I'll doublecheck if we have separate paper on digital wayfinding
16:52:30 [julierawe]
Lisa: Next steps. I think we're ready to move this into Github as an issue paper.
16:52:53 [julierawe]
Lisa: The next step after that is seeing what we want to add to the next version of Making Content Usable
16:53:02 [julierawe]
Lisa: What could we change? What should we change?
16:53:25 [julierawe]
Lisa: Becca, because this is all in your head right now, can you look at Making Content Usable?
16:53:31 [lisa_]
16:53:49 [julierawe]
Lisa: The patterns are going to port and we're going to rework them a bit.
16:54:14 [julierawe]
Lisa: Can we look at whether one of the personas have that already and we just need to do a tweak?
16:54:18 [julierawe]
Becca: Yes
16:54:31 [lisa_]
next item
16:54:37 [lisa_]
ack next
16:55:01 [julierawe]
Leandro: It's my first meeting with COGA. I started in December with Adapt.
16:55:11 [julierawe]
Leandro: I met Rain a year and a half ago.
16:55:27 [julierawe]
Leandro: I'm working on my PhD on people with intellectual disabilities.
16:55:49 [julierawe]
Lisa: Tomorrow I'm having an orientation call with a new member on my personal zoom.
16:56:27 [lisa_]
next item
16:56:55 [julierawe]
Lisa: We've got 5 minutes left. Should we add conversational interfaces to a future meeting?
16:57:06 [julierawe]
Becca: Yes. I will not be here next week.
16:57:19 [julierawe]
Lisa: The week after is Presidents Day so maybe March 4?
16:57:40 [Becca_Monteleone]
March 4 for conversational interfaces issue paper works!
16:58:08 [julierawe]
Lisa: Lots of us are doing literary reviews. I was going to do a follow-on call so we could review together
16:58:29 [julierawe]
Lisa: But now there are AG calls that conflict, so I'll send a spreadsheet asking for a good time to do this follow-on call
16:58:34 [julierawe]
Lisa: I'll do that in the next few days
16:58:50 [julierawe]
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I have made the request to generate julierawe
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Lisa: Is there anything else people want to touch on?
16:59:37 [julierawe]
Leandro: Nice to meet you all
16:59:43 [julierawe]
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