17:54:59 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #a11yedge
17:55:03 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/01/22-a11yedge-irc
17:55:03 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
17:55:34 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), janina
17:55:34 <janina> Meeting: Accessibility at the Edge Teleconference
17:55:34 <janina> Date: 22 Jan 2024
17:55:34 <janina> Chair: Janina
17:55:43 <janina> agenda+ Welcome and Introductions (as needed)
17:55:58 <janina> agenda+ Continue Capabilities Reorganization
17:56:10 <janina> agenda+ Wrapup: Actions and Next Steps
18:01:45 <janina> present+
18:01:53 <janina> scribe+
18:02:00 <Lionel> Lionel has joined #a11yedge
18:02:08 <Lionel> agenda?
18:02:17 <Lionel> zakim, who is here?
18:02:17 <Zakim> Present: janina
18:02:19 <Zakim> On IRC I see Lionel, RRSAgent, Zakim, janina, gpellegrino, dmontalvo
18:02:22 <Lionel> present+
18:11:27 <janina> zakim, next item
18:11:27 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Welcome and Introductions (as needed) -- taken up [from janina]
18:11:40 <janina> We have several regrets and no new participants today.
18:11:58 <janina> zakim, close this item
18:11:58 <Zakim> agendum 1 closed
18:11:59 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
18:11:59 <Zakim> 2. Continue Capabilities Reorganization [from janina]
18:12:03 <janina> zakim, next item
18:12:03 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Continue Capabilities Reorganization -- taken up [from janina]
18:12:30 <janina> subsection: What are available outputs from Figjam?
18:12:48 <janina> We looked and find only CSV or Figma stickies
18:13:05 <janina> janina: So, tool takes html as input but does not provide html output?
18:13:19 <janina> subsection: Review of reorg continues
18:15:17 <Lionel> present+ jason
18:15:53 <Lionel> janina: We should stay with the terminology commonly adopted by the community, even if we dont find it sufficiently useful
18:17:09 <Lionel> jason: Agree that it has become an industry term
18:17:22 <Lionel> .. it has some valuable components as defining a domain
18:17:48 <Lionel> ... but if you ask someone to describe an overlay, they would lead with things that pop up on a screen, take control of assistive technology
18:18:05 <Lionel> ... and would hardly talk about any of the capabilities that we are talking about here, technically
18:18:28 <Lionel> ... so perhaps we could say, those things are not part of javascript include
18:20:06 <Lionel> ... we need to discuss what can you do well, and what can you do safely, from the edge
18:21:22 <Lionel> janina: We understood that no one wants to read the entire list, we see the table of contents as enabling people to jump to the section that interests them
18:21:50 <janina> Lionel: Agree with Jason
18:22:19 <janina> Lionel: If we differ it's been in tactic -- how we put this together
18:25:13 <janina> jason: Interested in what can be automated
18:26:36 <janina> jason: Duplicated id hrefs on a site are an example of what cannot be auto remediated
18:29:57 <janina> Lionel: Trying to find the abstract explanation of what is done
18:32:24 <Lionel> janina: WCAG itself has the binary pass/fail issue built into it
18:33:40 <Lionel> janina: We are not after full accessibility, we are after how well can we succeed in resizing text, enhancing contrast, along the lines of how individual users need those adjustments
18:34:24 <Lionel> ... that is more interesting than something called full accessibility
18:36:33 <Lionel> jason: Companies use edge technologies, some by only handcrafting the fixes
18:40:52 <janina> jason: Suggesting we enumerate WCAG 2.2 SC by SC as which are automatable, and which not
18:42:18 <janina> Lionel: Believe we can break down as static or dynamic analysis
18:43:57 <Lionel> Lionel: Listing exactly what automated detection and automated remediation can do today is subject to change rather rapidly
18:44:06 <Lionel> ... w3c is a slower moving body than that
18:44:28 <Lionel> ... I see the value in our bringing to the conversation very clear high level "ingredeients" list
18:44:47 <Lionel> ... so a company that provides something relating somewhat to the term 'overlay' can say
18:45:16 <Lionel> ... Are you looking for a widget that does personalization changes like text size? well maybe go to such and such a company, we dont do that
18:45:31 <Lionel> ... are you looking for automated detection? We're happy to discuss that
18:46:00 <Lionel> ... are you looking for handcrafted code to be provided via edge technology, so we can do accessibility development for you? We do that.
18:58:28 <Lionel> jason: These are reasonable buckets for discussing the topic
18:59:01 <Lionel> Lionel: Personalization (CSS-type adjustments), Automated detection, Automated remediation, Hand written code via Edge, Miscellaneous
18:59:18 <Lionel> jason: This isn't a linear list
18:59:55 <Lionel> jason: Customization, Automation, Handcrafted Code, Miscellaneous
19:01:09 <janina> zakim, bye
19:01:09 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been janina, Lionel, jason
19:01:09 <Zakim> Zakim has left #a11yedge
19:01:59 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
19:02:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/22-a11yedge-minutes.html janina
19:18:59 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #a11yedge
19:19:06 <janina> zakim, who's here?
19:19:06 <Zakim> Present: (no one)
19:19:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see Lionel, RRSAgent, janina, dmontalvo
19:19:21 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
19:19:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/22-a11yedge-minutes.html janina