15:03:54 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #adapt
15:03:58 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-irc
15:03:58 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
15:03:59 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Lionel_Wolberger
15:04:01 <Lionel_Wolberger> Date: 12 December 2023
15:04:02 <Vikas> Vikas has joined #adapt
15:04:05 <Abhinav> present+
15:04:06 <matatk> present+
15:04:06 <Lionel_Wolberger> Chair: Lionel_Wolberger
15:04:11 <matatk> present+ Janina
15:04:18 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Administratrivia
15:04:28 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ WKU for Accessibility Statement
15:04:34 <Vikas> present+
15:04:37 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ WKU for A11Y Reporting
15:04:44 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ WKU vs. Destination
15:04:58 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Issue 240
15:05:02 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Continue the concept definition discussion
15:05:06 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Concept #2, Our word for 'symbol': adapt-symbol?
15:05:06 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/2 -> CLOSED Pull Request 2 fixing typo (by dret)
15:05:08 <Lionel_Wolberger> agenda+ Concept #3, Composition or Concatenation
15:05:09 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/3 -> CLOSED Issue 3 Avoid human text in attributes (by michael-n-cooper) [i18n-tracker] [action required]
15:06:26 <Lionel_Wolberger> present+
15:06:57 <matatk> scribe+
15:07:29 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: We are meeting next week. Sharon chairing, her last meeting.
15:08:12 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: We won't meet on the 26th of December.
15:09:14 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: We won't meet on the 2nd of January.
15:10:20 <matatk> RESOLVED: We will meet on the 19th of December, and the 9th of January, with holiday in-between.
15:10:26 <matatk> rrsagent, make minutes
15:10:27 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html matatk
15:11:21 <matatk> meeting: Adapt Weekly Teleconference
15:11:24 <matatk> rrsagent, make minutes
15:11:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html matatk
15:11:32 <matatk> zakim, next item
15:11:32 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Administratrivia -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
15:11:37 <matatk> zakim, close this item
15:11:37 <Zakim> agendum 1 closed
15:11:38 <Zakim> I see 7 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:11:38 <Zakim> 2. WKU for Accessibility Statement [from Lionel_Wolberger]
15:11:42 <matatk> zakim, next item
15:11:42 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- WKU for Accessibility Statement -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
15:11:59 <matatk> I think we should focus on what we want to discuss of the three areas (explainers).
15:12:01 <matatk> q+
15:12:16 <Lionel_Wolberger> scribe+
15:12:32 <matatk> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/discussions
15:12:58 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: We are using the discussion feature of github to discuss well known uri (WKU) issues
15:13:25 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... Names are important, not sure if calling this "WKU" is the best label
15:13:40 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... as we might end up talking about other related topics like 'rel'
15:13:54 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... proposing 'Information Architecture'
15:14:24 <Lionel_Wolberger> present+ janina, matatk, Lionel_Wolberger, Abhinav, russell
15:14:42 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Yes, vocabulary is important
15:15:07 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... well-taken, that we are using multiple mechanisms to reach the results we are chartered for, and have already in our explainer
15:15:09 <Abhinav> q+
15:15:28 <Lionel_Wolberger> +1 to broader vocabulary
15:16:02 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: we will likely be using an adapt- (adapt dash)
15:16:04 <matatk> ack me
15:16:05 <matatk> q+
15:17:07 <Lionel_Wolberger> Subtopic: Naming this workstream
15:17:35 <Lionel_Wolberger> Abhinav: Will we want to eventually register this with IETF?
15:18:41 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Register what is appropriate to register. Where we use WKU we would register that with the IETF
15:18:41 <Lionel_Wolberger> Abhinav: The IETF requires the endpoint to be declared
15:19:06 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: We could say that it would redirect, as we just want to allocate the WKU
15:19:16 <Lionel_Wolberger> s/IETF/IANA
15:19:24 <Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes
15:19:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger
15:19:46 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: The 'rel' attributes would relate to microformats or the HTML spec itself
15:20:38 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... we do have to agree on the keywords that we are registering,
15:20:48 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... likely be the destination values that we got from COGA
15:21:26 <Lionel_Wolberger> %s/IETF/IANA
15:21:33 <Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes
15:21:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger
15:22:00 <Lionel_Wolberger> s/IETF/IANA
15:22:01 <Lionel_Wolberger> s/IETF/IANA
15:22:29 <matatk> rrsagent, make minutes
15:22:30 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html matatk
15:22:52 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: We've agreed that we will register the URLs with IANA. We have not yet agreed on what we'll register,
15:23:46 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: Since that registration is public, we would need to go through some validation process internally (with TAG? or others?) before we register
15:24:30 <matatk> q?
15:24:44 <matatk> ack Abhinav
15:26:29 <Abhinav> q+
15:28:29 <matatk> q+ Janina
15:28:31 <matatk> ack me
15:29:10 <matatk> subtopic: Process, timeline
15:30:04 <matatk> matatk: We (Adapt TF) are discussing the 'WKU' Explainer on GitHub (discussions link above). We should keep going there until we have something to bring back to the group.
15:30:14 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: The TF should clarify process and timeline regarding human readable vs machine readable accessibility statement
15:30:44 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... the presumption is that we will have both; the machine readable is more complex, requires a much longer process
15:30:49 <matatk> matatk: We discussed last week that we'd look at the schema.org schema we found, and then take that to WAICC for futher input, once we've reviewed it to see if it needs additions/changes.
15:30:54 <matatk> rrsagent, make minutes
15:30:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html matatk
15:31:08 <Lionel_Wolberger> +1
15:31:08 <matatk> q?
15:31:45 <matatk> Janina: We (APA) definitely would like to do this, but needs to be as part of WAI.
15:32:09 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: We have to be tactical and practical, let's move this off our table for now, but it fits so well into the passion we had around WKU.
15:32:39 <matatk> ... I was excited because all sites have accessibility statements, so thought we could get a standard pointer to it, without tackling machine readability,
15:34:13 <matatk> s/readability,/readability./
15:34:16 <matatk> ack me
15:34:33 <matatk> Abhinav: There's another discussion topic, about translation that we need to add.
15:34:48 <matatk> ... Also about accessibility meta and reporting - I made some comments there.
15:35:07 <matatk> ... If human-readable, do we want to do a redirect, or have everything on a single page?
15:35:25 <matatk> ... If single page, then it can't be a redirect.
15:37:24 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: The explainer should make this clear, that the end-user can control which format they would accept
15:39:47 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Whether github discussion is sufficiently accessible remains to be determined
15:39:52 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: We turned to RQTF on that
15:40:11 <matatk> q?
15:40:16 <matatk> ack Abhinav
15:40:25 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... they said if the discussion is not accessible enough, then we can turn them into issue
15:40:30 <Lionel_Wolberger> s/issue/issues
15:40:30 <matatk> ack Janina
15:40:40 <matatk> agenda?
15:40:42 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/2 -> CLOSED Pull Request 2 fixing typo (by dret)
15:40:44 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/adapt/issues/3 -> CLOSED Issue 3 Avoid human text in attributes (by michael-n-cooper) [i18n-tracker] [action required]
15:40:44 <matatk> zakim, take up item 4
15:40:44 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- WKU vs. Destination -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
15:41:02 <matatk> rrsagent, make minutes
15:41:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html matatk
15:47:04 <matatk> q+
15:48:09 <Lionel_Wolberger> q+
15:48:45 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, close item 4
15:48:45 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Lionel_Wolberger
15:48:51 <Lionel_Wolberger> ack matatk
15:48:54 <Lionel_Wolberger> ack Lionel_Wolberger
15:48:56 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, close item 4
15:48:56 <Zakim> agendum 4, WKU vs. Destination, closed
15:48:59 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:48:59 <Zakim> 2. WKU for Accessibility Statement [from Lionel_Wolberger]
15:49:11 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, take up item 5
15:49:11 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- Issue 240 -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
15:49:28 <Lionel_Wolberger> russell: (Summarized the 'Using Bliss Unicode Instead of BCI-IDs' that he sent to the list)
15:49:32 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: +1
15:50:28 <Lionel_Wolberger> matatk: This looks sensible, as it retains the outlines of what we worked on, such as the registry
15:50:30 <Lionel_Wolberger> q+
15:51:07 <matatk> q+ Janina
15:51:12 <matatk> ack Lionel_Wolberger
15:51:42 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: I'll take matatk's excitement as we don't have to redo all that we've done. I'm not sure that the puzzle is cracked just yet.
15:52:24 <matatk> ... Where I'm not sure: I think russell did all the heavy lifting and cognitive work to establish in a dispositive way that unique IDs on the Blissymbolics table could be formed out of unicode.
15:52:38 <matatk> ... The uniqueness and non-ambiguity would remain, as would functionality of look-up.
15:52:51 <matatk> ... And this would still achieve the aims of the spec.
15:53:02 <matatk> ... Does that mean all aspects of the code numbers are resolved?
15:53:32 <matatk> ... If I wish a simple semantics to indicate 'I want an image here, in the end-user's image vocabulary', what is the best way of indicating that?
15:53:58 <matatk> ... If I do it with unicode, do I use an emoji, or the words, or Bliss symbol?
15:54:03 <matatk> ... This is not semantic.
15:54:14 <matatk> ... Semantic would be unambiguous code to say 'happiness' e..g
15:54:22 <matatk> s/e..g/e.g./
15:54:36 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: I suspect emoji would have a rich enough vocabulary,.
15:54:57 <matatk> s/y,./y./
15:55:13 <matatk> russell: I don't think emojis will do the trick, There are a lot of them but they're limited.
15:55:31 <matatk> ... Using a unicode encoding, we could use any language e.g. just the string 'happiness'
15:55:42 <matatk> ... But the problem is there are so many words that have multiple meanings.
15:56:39 <matatk> ... I understood Bliss was chosen because it was a set of concepts derived from the AAC world, and would be well known, and map to the core vocab of the other AAC systems.
15:56:44 <matatk> ... Emojis wouldn't be good for this.
15:56:56 <matatk> ... Maybe for emotions they'd work, but not in broader vocab.
15:57:30 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: Let's lead the agenda with this next time.
15:57:38 <matatk> rrsagent, make minutes
15:57:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html matatk
15:58:26 <matatk> Lionel_Wolberger: We've determined that for the lookup function, BCI IDs and unicode are interchangeable. I'm concerned we'll get lost in unicode.
15:58:59 <Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: We have determined that for the conumption use case, Bliss Symbolics IDs and unicdode are both suited to purpose
15:59:21 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... the open question is whether for the authoring use case, they are both suited to purpose
15:59:41 <Lionel_Wolberger> janina: And I think the people who raised the thread are not thinking about authoring
15:59:57 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, end meeting
15:59:57 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Abhinav, matatk, Janina, Vikas, Lionel_Wolberger, russell
15:59:59 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:00:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/12-adapt-minutes.html Zakim
16:00:06 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, Lionel_Wolberger; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
16:00:07 <Zakim> Zakim has left #adapt