IRC log of maturity on 2023-10-25

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:50:52 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #maturity
14:50:56 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/10/25-maturity-irc
14:50:56 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:51:27 [Zakim]
please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Fazio
14:52:06 [Fazio]
meeting: Maturity Model
14:52:06 [Fazio]
present+
14:52:06 [Fazio]
chair: Fazio
14:52:10 [Fazio]
Agenda+ Equity Subgroup Update from Sheri
14:52:34 [Fazio]
agenda+ New Business
14:52:49 [Fazio]
Agenda+ GitHub Issue #140 Executive sponsor in place vs Executive leadership in place
14:52:49 [gb]
/issues/140 -> #140
14:53:02 [Fazio]
Agenda+ GitHub Issue #142 Business strategy includes accessibility as a market differentiator
14:53:03 [gb]
/issues/142 -> #142
14:53:12 [Fazio]
Agenda+ GitHub Issue #143 communities of practice. Question, communities we serve
14:53:12 [gb]
/issues/143 -> #143
14:53:21 [Fazio]
Agenda + GitHub Issue #145 Linking would make it easier to use
14:53:21 [gb]
/issues/145 -> #145
14:53:33 [Fazio]
Agenda + GitHub Issue #153 The effectiveness of knowledge/skill acquisition should be measured
14:53:33 [gb]
/issues/153 -> #153
14:58:14 [sheribyrne]
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present_
14:58:24 [sheribyrne]
present+
15:01:26 [CharlesL]
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15:01:33 [janina]
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15:01:36 [janina]
present+
15:01:38 [nadine]
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15:01:40 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
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15:01:50 [CharlesL]
present+
15:03:07 [janina]
present+
15:03:17 [jkline]
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15:03:37 [jkline]
+present
15:03:44 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
present+
15:03:47 [jkline]
present+
15:03:52 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
scribe+
15:03:56 [nadine]
present+
15:04:01 [jkline]
scribe+
15:04:25 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
zakim, next item
15:04:25 [Zakim]
agendum 1 -- Equity Subgroup Update from Sheri -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:05:34 [janina]
q+ Who does equity report to?
15:05:37 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
sheribyrne: The Equity subgroup is looking at Equity all across W3C, not just accessibility
15:06:14 [Fazio]
q+
15:07:08 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... currently reporting to AGWG and there was suggestion that it report to some other group
15:08:03 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
janina: Historically in WAI APA is the right place, as APA is chartered for cross-organizational review
15:08:10 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... if not WAI then perhaps TAG
15:09:07 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
ack Fazio
15:09:13 [janina]
q?
15:09:35 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
janina: I will bring this up at the WAI-CC
15:09:50 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
sheribyrne: Equity was considering a maturity model
15:09:58 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... I suggested two alternatives
15:10:17 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... 1 they provide proof points as an extension of our Maturity Model
15:10:28 [janina]
q+
15:10:28 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
...2 they provide proof points that we incorporate into our model
15:10:35 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... either way, they need to define their proof points
15:10:43 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... and the group has begun that work.
15:11:12 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... One issue that Equity felt strongly about, is improving on the phrase 'proof points'
15:11:12 [Fazio]
I don't like our jargon either
15:11:26 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... they argue that it does not translate well into other languages, as well as other objections
15:11:40 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... they propose 'evidence' perhaps as an alternative
15:12:18 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... Tzviya noted that sustainability also wants to contribute proof points (or whatever they will be called)
15:12:20 [janina]
q?
15:12:50 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
q?
15:12:52 [jkline]
queue+
15:13:31 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
janina: The alternatives sound good, either extension or incorporation
15:13:46 [Fazio]
q+
15:13:49 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... we did think this could fit under culture
15:13:51 [sheribyrne]
q+
15:13:59 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... regarding 'proof points' vs 'evidence'
15:14:12 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... evidence is a collective noun, while proof points are quite specific
15:14:29 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... will it say 'evidence points' for example? We need to consider and propose
15:14:49 [Fazio]
Q?
15:14:52 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... Also noting, this is a positive sign
15:15:06 [Fazio]
ack jkline
15:15:07 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
jkline: Agree it's a positive sign
15:15:34 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... not wedded to 'proof points'. 'Evidence points' could work as well. I am open to this change as long as we find the appropriate terminology.
15:16:09 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... I do want to ensure that we remain focused on 'support of building accessible IT and the organizational capacity and maturity within organizations'
15:16:21 [Fazio]
ack Fazio
15:16:34 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... these concerns for equity, sustainability might divert us from that goal
15:17:07 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
Fazio: Sheri gave a great presentation on LLMs at M-Enabling where Equity played a big role
15:17:43 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... I have found in my sharing this model in LATAM and elsewhere, the language is found to be a bit hard to grasp
15:18:42 [janina]
ack jan
15:19:12 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
sheribyrne: I did hear an opinion that it will be eaiser for the USA Federal Govt to adopt this, if it is one model
15:19:46 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
jkline: Keep the end users in mind. It is already not exactly lightweight.
15:20:11 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... the more it has, the more people might be reluctant to pick it up
15:20:18 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
sheribyrne: Note that it is modular, and people can pick up the part that they want
15:20:18 [Fazio]
q?
15:20:32 [Fazio]
ack sheribyrne
15:20:52 [Fazio]
q?
15:20:54 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
sheribyrne: I find that 'evidence' is a non-countable noun, so it can be singular or collective
15:21:39 [Fazio]
q?
15:21:40 [janina]
q+
15:21:43 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
... in addition, we are talking about adding proof points to all dimensions
15:21:53 [Fazio]
ack janina
15:21:58 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
q+
15:22:09 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
janina: Is evidence sufficient? It does not quantify easily
15:22:19 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
sheribyrne: We can number them with unique identifiers
15:22:55 [janina]
ack ja
15:23:50 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
regrets: Stacey
15:23:58 [Fazio]
q?
15:24:13 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
Topic: General discussion of the term 'proof points'
15:24:25 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
janina: We need to discuss and consider the choices
15:24:46 [janina]
ack ja
15:24:47 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
Lionel_Wolberger_: See above in the minutes for some discussion on 'evidence' vs. 'proof points'
15:25:27 [Fazio]
ack Lionel_Wolberger_
15:25:42 [Fazio]
q?
15:27:39 [jkline]
zakim, next item
15:27:39 [Zakim]
agendum 2 -- New Business -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:28:38 [jkline]
Sheri now in the audit committee for W3c
15:29:42 [jkline]
discussed how to obtain grant funding for DEI activities
15:32:17 [jkline]
zakim, next item
15:32:17 [Zakim]
agendum 3 -- GitHub Issue #140 Executive sponsor in place vs Executive leadership in place -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:32:18 [gb]
/issues/140 -> #140
15:32:26 [jkline]
GITHUB Issues
15:32:39 [Fazio]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/140
15:32:40 [gb]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/140 -> Issue 140 Executive sponsor in place' vs 'Executive leadership in place' (by clapierre) [Editorial]
15:32:45 [jkline]
Issue 140 - Exec leadershiip
15:34:28 [jkline]
Exec leadership vs exec sponsorship terminology...in discussion
15:36:42 [jkline]
Discussion on new terminology....leadership vs. champion discussion.
15:39:33 [jkline]
references provided on where exec sponsorship appears
15:40:44 [jkline]
Close issue... don't see a significant path to improve current terminology
15:41:51 [jkline]
Zakim, next item
15:41:51 [Zakim]
agendum 4 -- GitHub Issue #142 Business strategy includes accessibility as a market differentiator -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:41:52 [gb]
/issues/142 -> #142
15:42:06 [Fazio]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/142
15:42:06 [gb]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/142 -> Issue 142 'Business strategy includes accessibility as a market differentiator' (by clapierre) [Editorial]
15:47:57 [jkline]
Need the term "promoting" in the proof point
15:48:53 [jkline]
Business strategy includes promoting accessibility as a market differentiator'
15:48:59 [Fazio]
will edit 3.7.1 Proof Points to say Business strategy includes promoting digital accessibility as market differentiator
15:49:31 [jkline]
Language to be revised. Issue closed.
15:50:17 [jkline]
zakim, next item
15:50:17 [Zakim]
agendum 5 -- GitHub Issue #143 communities of practice. Question, communities we serve -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:50:18 [gb]
/issues/143 -> #143
15:51:08 [Fazio]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/143
15:51:09 [gb]
https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/143 -> Issue 143 communities of practice. Question, communities we serve? (by clapierre) [Editorial]
15:55:03 [jkline]
Janina..get support from equity group on communities of practice.
15:55:56 [jkline]
we agree this could be clearer.
15:57:25 [jkline]
Janina provides wikipedia definition
15:59:40 [jkline]
zakim, end meeting
15:59:40 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been Fazio, sheribyrne, janina, CharlesL, present, Lionel_Wolberger_, jkline, nadine
15:59:43 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:59:44 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/10/25-maturity-minutes.html Zakim
15:59:59 [Zakim]
I am happy to have been of service, jkline; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye
15:59:59 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #maturity
16:02:32 [janina]
rrsagent, bye
16:02:32 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items